32xx movement problem poll and data thread

[Guppy-1]

I'm really struggling to make a decision on whether I should go ahead to buy a new Rolex or not, with so many problems reported on the new 32xx movements. The worst scenario I have heard so far is -15min/24hrs which literally made the watch unusable.

I'm really not willing to go for another brand but buying a new Rolex now seems to be too risky as I haven't heard they have fixed the problem. I'm trying to put it aside and concentrate on something else but haven't been successful so far.

Can someone give me some suggestions?

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by Guppy-1

I'm really struggling to make a decision on whether I should go ahead to buy a new Rolex or not, with so many problems reported on the new 32xx movements. The worst scenario I have heard so far is -15min/24hrs which literally made the watch unusable.

I'm really not willing to go for another brand but buying a new Rolex now seems to be too risky as I haven't heard they have fixed the problem. I'm trying to put it aside and concentrate on something else but haven't been successful so far.

Can someone give me some suggestions?

Welcome to the Forum!

Just to clarify: This thread is not an anti-32xx or anti-Rolex discussion, not at all!

We try to collect 32xx movement data (facts) and compare them with a few 31xx caliber.

I'm not going to give you any recommendation what to buy or not; read the entire thread, but ...

- I have not seen one negative report about a 3230 caliber.

- The tested (CharlesN) Submariner 126610 (3235), purchased in 09/2020, is just stunning in performance.

- Post #1061 summarizes a part of my personal opinion: The earlier 32xx movements (until about 2019) are very likely much more affected than the 2020/21 calibers.

Which watch you intend to buy?

[AntoMeRolexPassion]

Hello from Italy HiBoost

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by AntoMeRolexPassion

Hello from Italy

Hi Antonio,

Nice to see you (Moderator on the Italian Forum) joining here, a warm welcome.

You are kindly invited to post an executive summary of all findings in your thread "Rolex calibri serie 32xx e 31xx differenze e approfondimenti".

Cheers.saxo3

[AntoMeRolexPassion]

Originally Posted by saxo3

Hi Antonio,

Nice to see you (Moderator on the Italian Forum) joining here, a warm welcome.

You are kindly invited to post an executive summary of all findings in your thread "Rolex calibri serie 32xx e 31xx differenze e approfondimenti".

Cheers.saxo3

Good morning, nice to meet you
Soon i will give you a summary of our work in Italy and i renew the invitation to participate in our topic on our Forum in Italy

[Guppy-1]

Originally Posted by saxo3

Welcome to the Forum!

Just to clarify: This thread is not an anti-32xx or anti-Rolex discussion, not at all!

We try to collect 32xx movement data (facts) and compare them with a few 31xx caliber.

I'm not going to give you any recommendation what to buy or not; read the entire thread, but ...

- I have not seen one negative report about a 3230 caliber.

- The tested (CharlesN) Submariner 126610 (3235), purchased in 09/2020, is just stunning in performance.

- Post #1061 summarizes a part of my personal opinion: The earlier 32xx movements (until about 2019) are very likely much more affected than the 2020/21 calibers.

Which watch you intend to buy?

Thank you for the reminder. I so far have only 116613LB bluesy from 2016 and after 5 yrs of being worn almost every day, it's now still doing +1s/week which is quite impressive.

I had been saving up towards a DD40 then I learned about the issue with 3235. I have made up my mind to postpone it as it is too risky.

I also have the feeling that most recent batches may be ok, as they must have heard something and it would be unimaginable for the most trusted brand in the world not to do anything about it. For the last several weeks my thoughts have been changing and now I have set my eyes on a two-tone DJ36 which is less costly and therefore less risky but it will still cost me NZ$18,650, that is if I can get it. That's what I am struggling with now.

Keep in mind that the 2020/21 calibers may not have been running long enough to show any symptoms yet. I would still be very upset if I go ahead with the DJ only to find out it is just another defective piece like many others, even if it is not as expensive.

Thank you again anyway...

[CharlesN]

Originally Posted by Guppy-1

I had been saving up towards a DD40 then I learned about the issue with 3235. I have made up my mind to postpone it as it is too risky.

now I have set my eyes on a two-tone DJ36 which is less costly and therefore less risky
That's what I am struggling with now.

Hi Guppy,

I also would urge you to NOT worry about the 32xx movements.

If you have read this thread you can see that I am saxo3 have been doing lots of measurements on our watches.

I have a 3235 movement and you can see that the running, timekeeping etc are all stunningly good.
Not a hint of a problem and i dont expect one to arise at all.

Bear in muind we are NOT trying to find fault, Create a fault or panic anyone.

We are just doing research for our own amusement and it is so far only showing how good the 32xx movement is. i have not found a "bad" one yet.

Please be VERY cautious about choosing your watch. Dont buy one because you are worried about another one. remember Rolex watches come with a 5 year warranty so any fault would be put right if there was one (and at the moment we cant find one).

[CFR]

Originally Posted by Guppy-1

I'm really struggling to make a decision on whether I should go ahead to buy a new Rolex or not, with so many problems reported on the new 32xx movements. The worst scenario I have heard so far is -15min/24hrs which literally made the watch unusable.

I'm really not willing to go for another brand but buying a new Rolex now seems to be too risky as I haven't heard they have fixed the problem. I'm trying to put it aside and concentrate on something else but haven't been successful so far.

Can someone give me some suggestions?

I'd say that if you were otherwise going to buy the DD40 with the 32xx movement, go ahead and buy it. What's the absolute worst possible thing that could happen? You'd need to send the watch for repair a bit more often than you otherwise would, if Rolex fails to come up with a robust fix. If you can enjoy the watch knowing that might happen, then buy it and enjoy it. It's not as if the watch will suddenly stop working forever or become valueless, which would be dealbreakers for me (and a lot of others I think).

[Guppy-1]

Thank you Charles and CFR I can hear you both. I will think about it...

[Rushhour]

As a generalization - how long have the 3200 series watches that have shown issues been in service (I.e. purchased and worn)?

I have a 126711 CHNR (aka two tone root beer) since Early July 2020.

Since purchase - it has never been off more than two seconds a day since I purchased it. It started off 2 and still is off 2. I check it every day.

Now I wear it almost every day and store it every night on a watch stand, vertical 6 o’clock high (ie the band is around 2 points hanging - with the dial dial facing me vertical as I look at it 6 o’clock high - probably a lefty issue - sorry my mom did it to me).

My blue dial Milgauss also has been consistently 2 seconds off since purchase in 2019.

I think this thread is a great service.

Just thinking maybe a master aggregate graph should be setup indicating average/median plot points by year purchased & movement #. Given the amount of data acquired, it maybe to early. And I understand the amount of variables that may skew it.

But individual watches do not show the whole picture.

Again to the op and everyone who has gone through documenting - I think you have done a great service to the community.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[EEpro]

Originally Posted by Rushhour

As a generalization - how long have the 3200 series watches that have shown issues been in service (I.e. purchased and worn)?

I have a 126711 CHNR (aka two tone root beer) since Early July 2020.

Since purchase - it has never been off more than two seconds a day since I purchased it. It started off 2 and still is off 2. I check it every day.

Now I wear it almost every day and store it every night on a watch stand, vertical 6 o’clock high (ie the band is around 2 points hanging - with the dial dial facing me vertical as I look at it 6 o’clock high - probably a lefty issue - sorry my mom did it to me).

My blue dial Milgauss also has been consistently 2 seconds off since purchase in 2019.

I think this thread is a great service.

Just thinking maybe a master aggregate graph should be setup indicating average/median plot points by year purchased & movement #. Given the amount of data acquired, it maybe to early. And I understand the amount of variables that may skew it.

But individual watches do not show the whole picture.

Again to the op and everyone who has gone through documenting - I think you have done a great service to the community.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

For me the DJ41 ran 0.x seconds per day from April through November 2019. I let it sleep for a bit when I got a 116710LN and once I fired it back up it was -30 spd.

[jssans]

Got mine back from RSC three weeks ago suffering from this issue. It’s 1 sec slow a day currently. Back to awesome. The service papers do not identify the issue or part(s) replaced or repaired. Kinda funny, but not really.

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by CFR

I'd say that if you were otherwise going to buy the DD40 with the 32xx movement, go ahead and buy it. What's the absolute worst possible thing that could happen? You'd need to send the watch for repair a bit more often than you otherwise would, if Rolex fails to come up with a robust fix. If you can enjoy the watch knowing that might happen, then buy it and enjoy it. It's not as if the watch will suddenly stop working forever or become valueless, which would be dealbreakers for me (and a lot of others I think).

One can't say for certain that a model of any manufactured good would not become worthless.
There is no Crystal ball.
Plenty of things have virtually become worthless in the fullest context of the market. All it takes is for a bad reputation to consolidate and it's all over red rover, with the exception of spare parts value.

Against the backdrop of the Rolex invention of the "Superlative Chronometer" standard where on the balance of probability, it seems that the only movements which can be relied upon to maintain the accuracy standard that's laid down exclusively by Rolex, are the older ones.
In addition to the so called Rolex 10 year service interval(with arbitrary conditions for the first time).

It's not all that inconceivable the 32xx movement may herald a watershed point in time where the whole brand takes a downward turn in reputation until they introduce new movements to arrest the slide.
Perhaps they could package a new movement in such a manner so that it could easily be retrofitted to replace the problematic 32xx movements

A long standing reputation like the one which underpins Rolex popularity(aside from purly speculative influences), could easily be eroded along with a corresponding rise of other brands to replace the crown.

Personally, there's not a person in the world that could give me one of the new watches with a 32xx movement.
They're effectively worthless to me for a good number of reasons. So there you have it, this is your first officially documented example of a watch becoming worthless, and an absolute first for me with Rolex in decades of maintaining a collection.
Having said that my focus on Rolex offerings has narrowed anyway, and i have all that i want. If I were starting out again from today, I would probably only be interested in older Rolex references

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by jssans

Got mine back from RSC three weeks ago suffering from this issue. It’s 1 sec slow a day currently. Back to awesome. The service papers do not identify the issue or part(s) replaced or repaired. Kinda funny, but not really.

It's SOP for Rolex.
I hope it goes well for you in the long term

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by EEpro

For me the DJ41 ran 0.x seconds per day from April through November 2019. I let it sleep for a bit when I got a 116710LN and once I fired it back up it was -30 spd.

This seems to be quite a common theme

[Twisted Vicar]

228235 (Day Date 40) brought new in September 2017. Always been within COSC

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by Twisted Vicar

Always been within COSC

I can say the same for all my Rolex watches except for my beloved 5513. But it was consistently close
A few were well within Superlative Chronometer" specs, even long before it was supposed to mean something

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by Dirt

Against the backdrop of the Rolex invention of the "Superlative Chronometer" standard where on the balance of probability, it seems that the only movements which can be relied upon to maintain the accuracy standard that's laid down exclusively by Rolex, are the older ones

Hi Dirt,

Can you explain what you mean with …the only movements which can be relied upon to maintain the accuracy standard that's laid down...

What is for you the standard?

Is it COSC, TIMEKEEPING, ACCURACY, PRECISION, anything else?

Have you ever measured something for your watches and collected some concrete data, which you could share here?

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by Rushhour

As a generalization - how long have the 3200 series watches that have shown issues been in service (I.e. purchased and worn)?

There is no general answer to this question, it depends on the watch/caliber fabrication date.

Originally Posted by Rushhour

I have a 126711 CHNR (aka two tone root beer) since Early July 2020. Since purchase - it has never been off more than two seconds a day since I purchased it. It started off 2 and still is off 2. I check it every day.

Do you have some useable data for your 126711 CHNR?

Originally Posted by Rushhour

My blue dial Milgauss also has been consistently 2 seconds off since purchase in 2019.

The blue dial Milgauss (Ref. 116400 GV) has a 3135 caliber. I can confirm that the 3100 series movements run very well.

Originally Posted by Rushhour

Just thinking maybe a master aggregate graph should be setup indicating average/median plot points by year purchased & movement #.

Can you explain further what you mean with "master aggregate graph" (I like the master part ).

Originally Posted by Rushhour

But individual watches do not show the whole picture.

There is no other way to start here.

Originally Posted by Rushhour

I think you have done a great service to the community.

Thank you!

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by Twisted Vicar

228235 (Day Date 40) brought new in September 2017. Always been within COSC

Very interesting.

The DAY-DATE 40 Ref. 228235 (everose gold) has a 3255 caliber.

I have never heard of any timekeeping issue with a 3255, all problems reported so far here are for 3235 and 3285 movements.

[saxo3]

EEpro: "For me the DJ41 ran 0.x seconds per day from April through November 2019. I let it sleep for a bit when I got a 116710LN and once I fired it back up it was -30 spd."

Originally Posted by Dirt

This seems to be quite a common theme

Dirt, I disagree.

What is your basis to claim that?
Reading on the Internet?
We remember you have no own 32xx movement.

In your 75 posts (until now, rank 3!) you have not delivered one number or any useful data point in this thread.

[CharlesN]

Originally Posted by Dirt

This seems to be quite a common theme

Dirt,

I can NOT agree with you at all.

I have both a 116610 (3135) and a 126610 (3235)

For some reason (not that I know it) I saved my 126610 and hardly ever wore it.

It lived in the safe. Not good I know but I did have another watch on my wrist.

As many of you know I have done quite a lot of tests recently on my 126610 with a 32xx movement

I started these tests with the watch fresh out of storage. It had not ticked since about December.

It ran not only well but as you can see in earlier posts almost perfectly.

I doubt my watch is anything unique.

Dirt, I do think generalisations are a bad thing……. They are almost always proved to be completely wrong as in this instance. I have given evidence to this effect.

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by saxo3

Hi Dirt,

Can you explain what you mean with …the only movements which can be relied upon to maintain the accuracy standard that's laid down...

What is for you the standard?

Is it COSC, TIMEKEEPING, ACCURACY, PRECISION, anything else?

Have you ever measured something for your watches and collected some concrete data, which you could share here?

I think post number 1127 shall suffice

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by saxo3

EEpro: "For me the DJ41 ran 0.x seconds per day from April through November 2019. I let it sleep for a bit when I got a 116710LN and once I fired it back up it was -30 spd."

Dirt, I disagree.

What is your basis to claim that?
Reading on the Internet?
We remember you have no own 32xx movement.

In your 75 posts (until now, rank 3!) you have not delivered one number or any useful data point in this thread.

You powers of observation are Superlative

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by Dirt

You powers of observation are Superlative

Do you have anything constructive to add to this thread?

[zengineer]

Originally Posted by Dirt

In one way it is caused by the lubricant.

But another factor which occurs at the point of lubrication is the surface tension which(for the most part) binds the lubricant to the parts whether they be metallic or rubies.

In a close fitting assembly, the surface tension plays a roll in it as well.



But in the end, the viscosity drops as the temperature increases so both of these factors have less impact on parasitic drag.

You are misusing the term parasitic drag. I do get what you are trying to say and am not interested in a debate, but you are way off.

Sent from my SM-T830 using Tapatalk

[saxo3]

Performance out of the box….

- Submariner Ref. 14060M (2001)
- Caliber 3130

- Last service: May 2013
- Last worn: August 2020

- Out of the box: today, fully worn, waited 10 min, then measured

- Data taking: 2 min (only) each position, 3 min wait after each position change

- Results:


No problem to regulate the + 3.2 s/d average rate, but I see no need at all.

That's (or similar) what I expect from a new Rolex with a 32xx movement.

[Omarion07]

Originally Posted by Dirt

One can't say for certain that a model of any manufactured good would not become worthless.
There is no Crystal ball.
Plenty of things have virtually become worthless in the fullest context of the market. All it takes is for a bad reputation to consolidate and it's all over red rover, with the exception of spare parts value.

Against the backdrop of the Rolex invention of the "Superlative Chronometer" standard where on the balance of probability, it seems that the only movements which can be relied upon to maintain the accuracy standard that's laid down exclusively by Rolex, are the older ones.
In addition to the so called Rolex 10 year service interval(with arbitrary conditions for the first time).

It's not all that inconceivable the 32xx movement may herald a watershed point in time where the whole brand takes a downward turn in reputation until they introduce new movements to arrest the slide.
Perhaps they could package a new movement in such a manner so that it could easily be retrofitted to replace the problematic 32xx movements

A long standing reputation like the one which underpins Rolex popularity(aside from purly speculative influences), could easily be eroded along with a corresponding rise of other brands to replace the crown.

Personally, there's not a person in the world that could give me one of the new watches with a 32xx movement.
They're effectively worthless to me for a good number of reasons. So there you have it, this is your first officially documented example of a watch becoming worthless, and an absolute first for me with Rolex in decades of maintaining a collection.
Having said that my focus on Rolex offerings has narrowed anyway, and i have all that i want. If I were starting out again from today, I would probably only be interested in older Rolex references

For the average Rolex buyer who buys Rolex for the hype and following the crowd, they won't notice any of the timekeeping issues affecting the 32xx movements, and will continue on buying Rolex as long as they're in fashion, just like with the Iphones and Birkin bags.

For WIS, on the other hand, Rolex's reputation won't get affected if they've found a permanent solution for the aforementioned timekeeping issues. The 2020 batches seem to be fine so far but we'll have a better idea in a year from now.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by saxo3

That's (or similar) what I expect from a new Rolex with a 32xx movement.

… And that's what I get for a 32xx movement tested today under identical conditions, immediately after the Submariner 14060M

- GMT-Master II Ref. 126711 (2018)
- Caliber 3285

- Last service: none
- Last worn: October 2020

- Out of the box: today, fully worn, waited 5 min, then measured

- Data taking: 2 min (only) each position, 3 min wait after each position change

- Results:


The averaged rate of -8.2 s/d after full winding cannot be regulated.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by Omarion07

For the average Rolex buyer who buys Rolex for the hype and following the crowd, they won't notice any of the timekeeping issues affecting the 32xx movements, and will continue on buying Rolex as long as they're in fashion, just like with the Iphones and Birkin bags.

For WIS, on the other hand, Rolex's reputation won't get affected if they've found a permanent solution for the aforementioned timekeeping issues. The 2020 batches seem to be fine so far but we'll have a better idea in a year from now.

I fully agree with your view
Not sure to which group of Rolex fan boys the "I" in WIS belongs