Have I been scammed? What should I do?

[cephyr]

Recently I purchased, or I thought I purchased, a Rolex Submariner ref. 5513 at a watch dealer named Manhattan Watch Company in NYC. The shop is located at 41 West 47th Street, #7 New York, NY 10036. (I am not disclosing any privacy information in this thread. It’s all public)

I contacted the dealer, Armando Martinez, through email (manhattanwatchcompanysales). I made, or I thought I made, a deal with him and wired him $16000. On 20 June, He said he will prepare invoice and shipping. On 25 June, at my inquiry he said the watch has been sent. I further requested for courier information and tracking number, and he has been irresponsive to me since. He does not reply to my email. So far nor does my receiving address in Hongkong receive the package.

I am in China. I love vintage Rolex but it’s hard for me to get one there. It’s my first try to trade with a US dealer but turns out to get this bad experience. This maybe only a delay in response (so far 3 days) or shipping. However in worse circumstance this can be a fraud in which the dealer does not intend to send the watch to me.

So now my question is what should I do? Is there anyone who know this guy? Is there any local authority I can contact with? I have all communication record and wire record with this dealer. The wire recipient is Manhattan Watch Company INC at Citi bank NYC.

I am confused with what happened. I thought this was an honest trade, and shouldn’t be like this, at a dealer with a fixed shop in downtown Manhattan.

Please advise.

[RRGHOST1]

Anymore news. Have you heard from the dealer.

[cephyr]

Originally Posted by RRGHOST1

Anymore news. Have you heard from the dealer.

No the dealer does not reply to me.

[tike71]

Have you tried calling them? The number listed on their webpage is 347-291-5778

[cephyr]

Originally Posted by tike71

Have you tried calling them? The number listed on their webpage is 347-291-5778

I tried multiple times but my call is not answered.

[cephyr]

Originally Posted by tike71

Have you tried calling them? The number listed on their webpage is 347-291-5778

I do not know if they do not answer my call only or the phone number is invalid.

[GGGMT]

Seems like a scam due to no response obviously

Never heard of this company but so many many reputable dealers on this forum for this common watch.


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[cephyr]

I resumed contact with the seller who said the package has been sent today. Issue closed.

[1665fan]

Originally Posted by cephyr

I resumed contact with the seller who said the package has been sent today. Issue closed.

I would still be praying I get a watch lol…..very fishy

[RAB321]

You paid for this watch nearly two weeks ago and he only sending it today? Did he not have possession of the watch when he offered it?

A little early to be saying "issue closed", in my opinion.

[PRSWILL]

Some of these so called "dealers" are nothing more than consignment brokers- many don't inventory anything. they just operate as a middle man- good luck - crossing fingers for you.

[MohiMedia]

Deals not done till its in your hands and money has cleared. But glad they resumed communication. Hope it was shipped properly and in your hands shortly.

Lots of dealers don't actually have on hand what they claim. It's on consignment but not in possession etc. If they focus on these very niche vintage items, then I could totally see them opting to broker or consign a lot instead of holding illiquid inventory. Especially with the heavy losses dealers took last two years lots of watch dealers and exotic car dealers for that matter doing a ton of consignment instead of holding inventory right now...or downsizing, or going out of business entirely.

[101031-28]

I would say 'issue closed' when watch is in your hand. Wishing you a positive outcome

[brandrea]

Hope the watch arrives soon.

Did they provide tracking information? I hope they know how to ship internationally and did proper documentation.

[Rolex1982]

Originally Posted by cephyr

I resumed contact with the seller who said the package has been sent today. Issue closed.

Did the watch arrive?

[cephyr]

Hi to anyone who has read this thread I would like to give you an update.

It turns out that, after my wire transfer on 18 June, although the dealer said that the watch had been sent on 25 June, in fact it was not sent out until 2 July, after my continuous inquiries and threat of negative review to him on the internet.

The watch has been received on 7 July. Upon receiving the watch, the following issues come to my attention:

- The dealer said the watch is all original and absolutely unpolished. However, upon my inspection, although the watch is overall in good shape, it shows signs of obvious polish, at least partially, as indicated by its rounded crown and lug wholes.
- the dealer said that the watch is in full bracelet, whereas the watch comes with 11 links, as a 93150 bracelet I believe the it is short of 1 or 2 links.
- The bracelet comes without the clasp spring bar. The clasp is detached with the other half of the bracelet.

At the end of the day, the good thing is that at least I received the watch, but overall it has been a pretty bad shopping experience.

[cephyr]

Originally Posted by Rolex1982

Did the watch arrive?

Yes the watch did arrived. Please see my latest update.

[omar10213245]

Originally Posted by cephyr

Hi to anyone who has read this thread I would like to give you an update.

It turns out that, after my wire transfer on 18 June, although the dealer said that the watch had been sent on 25 June, in fact it was not sent out until 2 July, after my continuous inquiries and threat of negative review to him on the internet.

The watch has been received on 7 July. Upon receiving the watch, the following issues come to my attention:

- The dealer said the watch is all original and absolutely unpolished. However, upon my inspection, although the watch is overall in good shape, it shows signs of obvious polish, at least partially, as indicated by its rounded crown and lug wholes.
- the dealer said that the watch is in full bracelet, whereas the watch comes with 11 links, as a 93150 bracelet I believe the it is short of 1 or 2 links.
- The bracelet comes without the clasp spring bar. The clasp is detached with the other half of the bracelet.

At the end of the day, the good thing is that at least I received the watch, but overall it has been a pretty bad shopping experience.

The bracelet was missing the clasp spring bar??? holy crap, this seller is an absolute clown, he needs to be put on blast

[Al1969]

OP, you should post some pics.

Perhaps there are other issues with this watch.

[1665fan]

Wow terrible business for manhattan watch company…..shady and lying about the quality…..

[cephyr]

Hi there. Here’s another update.

I asked an expert watchmaker to have the watch thoroughly examined, and it comes as the following:

Overall the watch is in good condition. All parts are original and correct. However the hour hand and the minute hand have been re-lumed, as demonstrated by their slightly lighter patina than that of the hour markers and second hand. The watch maker also said the re-lume was probably done by Rolex service center or a Rolex authorized watchmaker, as it is the same Tritium lume material used by Rolex.

The case has not seen obvious signs of polish. The lines and bevels are intact. Some slight change of shape can be seen on the side surfaces of the case, probably due to years of rubbing by the original owner. There is heavy wears on the crown for unknown reason. 4 of the 5 tips of the Rolex Crown on the crown have been worn out, to the extent that one can see a hole on each of the tip.

The bracelet is short of 2 links, as opposed to full links.

The spring bar on the clasp is missing, as said.

The caliber is original and in good shape. It is running slow and need a service.

So this is the condition of the watch. Overall it is in good shape, though not as good as I was told. Many dealers are not as professional, and cannot examine vintage watch to this extent. I am not accusing the dealer as total bad or so, as he described the watch maybe due to his best knowledge and at least sent the watch to me. Instead I would treat this as a not-so-happy purchase experience and a lesson learned.

Many future plan would be to have the watch a full service, and patch up the missing or worn out parts myself.

[cephyr]

For now the thing that makes me most uncomfortable has become the re-lume. Once you know it is re-lume, you can’t stop staring at it and thinking of it.