How do trusted sellers authenticate their inventory?

[Phil8352]

SSIA and TIA

[sportsfan0704]

The good ones open them up. And the best ones do it carefully to not leave marks. But some just do a visual inspection. The thing with these dealers is that the good ones see so many watches come in on a daily basis they really can tell rather quickly. There really isn’t such a thing as a “super clone” if you’re paying attention and know what to look for. While fakes can often get certain things right, they never get everything right.

While you need to look at the movement to be 100% sure it hasn’t been swapped out into a real case, often putting the watch on a timer can be a first clue as to whether you need to inspect further. Things like the screws on the bracelet are an easy tell that the Fakes haven’t mastered ever.

[Guppydriver]

My guess is (and it’s purely a guess)..

Other than their naked eye and experience…..

They don’t.

It’s probably more cost and time effective to replace one watch in a thousand under an authenticity guarantee than it is to thoroughly authenticate each piece.

[jaherer1]

this is how a dealer in singapore inspects

[jaherer1]

Originally Posted by jaherer1

this is how a dealer in singapore inspects

https://watchexchange.sg/watch-inspection-service/

[Tools]

"Trusted Sellers" are only trusted until they aren't.

None of them inspect every aspect of a used watch, they rely on experience and knowledge to separate the chaff.

[train-time]

I believe that they run them through the Flux Capacitor Watch Authenticator.

[Guppydriver]

Originally Posted by train-time

I believe that they run them through the Flux Capacitor Watch Authenticator.

That’s an expensive power bill.

[Funkle]

Do you guys think the ebay authenticators open them?

[Autococker07]

Originally Posted by train-time

I believe that they run them through the Flux Capacitor Watch Authenticator.

Originally Posted by Guppydriver

That’s an expensive power bill.

Not if they have a Mr Fusion (tm)

[Marcjvr]

Originally Posted by Funkle

Do you guys think the ebay authenticators open them?

Yes

From the eBay authentication video:




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[cascadez71]

Originally Posted by Funkle

Do you guys think the ebay authenticators open them?

I don't think this is always (or ever) true based on my internet sleuthings despite the video. Ebay Authentication is done by Stoll and Co. I'm sure they do zero out obvious fakes, I have not read they open watches on a regular basis.

[Andad]

Originally Posted by Marcjvr

Yes

From the eBay authentication video:




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Look like they also poke around inside them as well.

[dmash]

Originally Posted by sportsfan0704

The good ones open them up. And the best ones do it carefully to not leave marks. But some just do a visual inspection. The thing with these dealers is that the good ones see so many watches come in on a daily basis they really can tell rather quickly. There really isn’t such a thing as a “super clone” if you’re paying attention and know what to look for. While fakes can often get certain things right, they never get everything right.

While you need to look at the movement to be 100% sure it hasn’t been swapped out into a real case, often putting the watch on a timer can be a first clue as to whether you need to inspect further. Things like the screws on the bracelet are an easy tell that the Fakes haven’t mastered ever.

This is spoken like somebody with knowledge.

Fact is, an experienced watchmaker/seller can tell within 5 minutes on a modern reference, no opening caseback, with 99.9% accuracy. and the only reason that .1% exists is if somebody took a genuine case/dial/bracelet and then replaced the guts. but even then it would likely show on timer.

People like to claim 'super clone' and '1:1', but fact is, it's not. There's always some small giveaways.


Buying from a trusted seller is honestly so secure when it comes to fakes, that I wouldn't even worry about it. The biggest concern when buying grey is if it's stolen. It's impossible to check every source for if something was part of theft.

but a real 'trusted' seller, neither of these are true issues anyways, as they'll refund your money in both scenarios. Again this is for 'trusted' sellers, not a random backpack flipper. they'd jump ship and shut down account as they can't float a $10k+ loss.

[omar-rye]

Way too much credit is given to these superclones. Honestly, they’re not that good. Anyone who’s business involves handling watches day in and day out can tell something is off the second they pick it up. The weight, the feel, the finish under a loupe, and the way the movement feels and winds all give it away. These so called near perfect replicas might fool the casual eye, but any professional will spot the fakes instantly.

Even $120 Nike sneakers have superclones. Both genuine and fake sneakers cost pennies to produce, are manufactured in the same country, and sometimes use materials from the same suppliers. But even with that, sneakerheads can spot a fake in seconds, sometimes just by the smell alone. My point is, if Chinese (or Vietnamese) made sneakers can be picked out that easily, it’s way harder to replicate a Swiss mechanical watch, especially with the quality control needed. So if you can detect fake Nikes, spotting a fake Rolex is even less of a challenge to the experienced.

As dmash said, the biggest risk are stolen watches, which is why it’s smart practice to take ID and keep a detailed record of everything. Purchase from someone who you can follow up with if the watch turns out to be stolen property.

[ArtNouveau]

The age old mantra is “buy the seller, not the watch.” The Trusted Sellers do this too, they won’t buy a watch to resell without some provenance. And when you handle hundreds of watches every year you get to be a pretty good judge of authenticity, condition, and value. Everyone knows there are fake watches out there, I doubt many of them ever make it into the reseller market.

[shaunylw]

Originally Posted by sportsfan0704

The good ones open them up. And the best ones do it carefully to not leave marks. But some just do a visual inspection. The thing with these dealers is that the good ones see so many watches come in on a daily basis they really can tell rather quickly. There really isn’t such a thing as a “super clone” if you’re paying attention and know what to look for. While fakes can often get certain things right, they never get everything right.

While you need to look at the movement to be 100% sure it hasn’t been swapped out into a real case, often putting the watch on a timer can be a first clue as to whether you need to inspect further. Things like the screws on the bracelet are an easy tell that the Fakes haven’t mastered ever.

Vintage Rolex yes. Modern Rolex, they are not cracking the caseback unless they see something sketchy they don’t like. There isn’t a need to open modern Rolex. No super clone comes remotely close fit and finish where a real dealer would get tricked. The instagram dealers, sure. Vintage is a totally different story, most solid dealers post movement pics of all vintage watches.


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[JRell]

You can’t. Reason 124 I don’t buy Rolex outside of an AD.

[kopi-c]

Originally Posted by phil8352

ssia and tia

ssia?
Tia?

[Sublovin]

Originally Posted by JRell

You can’t. Reason 124 I don’t buy Rolex outside of an AD.

What do you mean? Sure you can.

[Sublovin]

Originally Posted by kopi-c

ssia?
Tia?

Subject says it all

Thanks in advance


Lazy post😀

[huncho]

Originally Posted by omar-rye

Way too much credit is given to these superclones. Honestly, they’re not that good. Anyone who’s business involves handling watches day in and day out can tell something is off the second they pick it up. The weight, the feel, the finish under a loupe, and the way the movement feels and winds all give it away. These so called near perfect replicas might fool the casual eye, but any professional will spot the fakes instantly.

Even $120 Nike sneakers have superclones. Both genuine and fake sneakers cost pennies to produce, are manufactured in the same country, and sometimes use materials from the same suppliers. But even with that, sneakerheads can spot a fake in seconds, sometimes just by the smell alone. My point is, if Chinese (or Vietnamese) made sneakers can be picked out that easily, it’s way harder to replicate a Swiss mechanical watch, especially with the quality control needed. So if you can detect fake Nikes, spotting a fake Rolex is even less of a challenge to the experienced.

As dmash said, the biggest risk are stolen watches, which is why it’s smart practice to take ID and keep a detailed record of everything. Purchase from someone who you can follow up with if the watch turns out to be stolen property.

agreed, 2 mins with a loupe and those superclones don't fool a single veteran trusted seller. crm jewelers often posts videos of superclones coming in to them and it's honestly shocking how bad they are once you put them under a loupe. you don't even have to be an expert when you use a loupe on them because you just see rust/crooked lines or paint peeling off all over the dial

[CaptT]

Assuming the trusted seller / reseller is not picking up inventory directly from the AD, what is often referred to as “backdoored”, the best peace of mind is to buy from someone with whom they’ve previously transacted and trust. Often, this someone is a repeat customer of the AD, a VIP, or has an unspoken arrangement with the AD. In these cases, the trusted seller will not need to authenticate, open the case, etc. With currently available models, this is almost always a complete set.

Absent that, trusted sellers / resellers will complete diligence not unlike what anyone here might do on a private party transaction, and again look for complete sets.

[1259]

Sounds like a “trust me bro” situation

[Calatrava r]

What Omar-Rye said. Used watch dealers don't need to open all watches still under warranty and risk voiding the warranty. The hardest part to clone is what you can see, feel and weigh.

[milgauss2232]

Originally Posted by Calatrava r

What Omar-Rye said. Used watch dealers don't need to open all watches still under warranty and risk voiding the warranty. The hardest part to clone is what you can see, feel and weigh.

How does RSC know if a watch has been opened to check? Is there a seal?

[joli160]

Originally Posted by milgauss2232

How does RSC know if a watch has been opened to check? Is there a seal?

No, they can’t tell as long as you don’t leave tool marks.

[Phil8352]

Originally Posted by joli160

No, they can’t tell as long as you don’t leave tool marks.

I’d think tool marks would be easy to spot for an RSC tech with a loupe that has seen 1000s of watches. I’m not talking about blatant scratches, either.

[77T]

Something trusted sellers do is "buy the seller" when they buy a watch or allow a trade-in.

But that only goes so far.

The worst thing that can happen is if the seller or trader had a stolen watch. The TS has no way to check the Rolex theft list because it is not available to the public.

The one thing that a true TS offers is a refund if the Rolex is not legit. Sadly, for them it is a cost of doing business.


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[roks]

The safeguards of "buy the seller" or "it feels different" can all be bypassed. These are not scientific foolproof methods of watch verification.
These are subjective and what "feels different" to one, may not "Feel different" to another.
We can not rely on human touch/feel methods as they are error prone.
We need 100% objective methods that eliminate touch, feel aspects.

The only way to be sure is to open the case back and look at the movement.
Yes with Trusted Sellers and all the chances of getting screwed get quite small but the chances are still positive and non-zero.

Buying from AD is 100% guaranteed authentic. All others, you have some slight risk of winding up with a nonauthentic...doesn't
matter how good you are, one day you will make a mistake and something will pass through your hands that shouldn't.