Buying Advice

[jvo300]

So I'm interested in dabbling in the vintage market. I've been reading alot of this forum as well as VRF. I've identified the models I am interested in chasing, but how in the world do you feel comfortable buying in the vintage market? It appears that there are many random sellers and it is really hard (for me) to determine if I'll be getting something authentic/original or a frankenstein recreation. I am lost! Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.

[DadsWatch72]

Originally Posted by jvo300

So I'm interested in dabbling in the vintage market. I've been reading alot of this forum as well as VRF. I've identified the models I am interested in chasing, but how in the world do you feel comfortable buying in the vintage market? It appears that there are many random sellers and it is really hard (for me) to determine if I'll be getting something authentic/original or a frankenstein recreation. I am lost! Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.

Take as many detailed photos as possible and post them on this forum. You will probably receive a response from many on this forum that can spot a fake at a glance. Some are harder to tell if they are 100% genuine based on pictures alone. If this is the case with a watch that your interested in buying, then you should ask the seller to meet you at a jeweler/watch maker that you trust so they can physically authenticate the watch. It still may be 100% authentic but have newer or service replacement parts and not be 100% original. Do you understand the difference between genuine (real Rolex) opposed to original (parts that came with the watch when manufactured)? A good watch maker can tell the difference so find one that is knowledgeable in these vintage watches and call him/her your own. If the seller doesn't want to meet and go through this process then that should be your first "red flag" (warning) that something is wrong. IMO you should then walk away from the deal, even if its very tempting. Its a matter of how much you trust the seller. Many on TRF have a history of selling with great testimonials from their customers/buyers. I have found that many on this forum have become friends. I think this is why many on this forum feel comfortable buying/trading from each other. Because they know them personally to some extent. I am fairly new to the forum but from what I have read so far, this is an example of how "birds of a feather flock together". They all share a love for these darn watches and have become extremely knowledgeable regarding anything "Rolex".

[DadsWatch72]

Ok, one exception. This guy looks very "shifty" to me.

[fusionstorm]

I just bought my first vintage piece (1655 Explorer II to the left) less than 2 months ago. The seller was local to me, but he had also been a frequent poster and seller over the past several years on a number of well-known timepiece forums. My purchase was somewhat impulsive, but I'd been lurking on various forums for a few months gauging what I'd want to take a plunge on and what I should reasonably expect to pay. I think I paid an OK price for mine, and I was relieved that my jeweler (a Rolex AD) opened it and confirmed it was original movement, dial wasn't refinished, original hands/bezel, etc.

Generally, the longer the seller has been a member of that forum, and the more posts (especially For Sale ones) they have, the more likely it is that you will have a satisfactory sale. You can always post a reference check and see who responds with feedback (good or bad). There too, you need to vet the responders who give positive feedback. If they are long-time members with lots of posts, you should be in fine shape. If they're a bunch of low post count, recently joined members, you should be suspicious of "shill" accounts set up by seller.

I've seen some sellers touting that they're an IWJG (International Watch & Jewelry Guild) member in good standing. As usual, take that with a grain of salt.

Good luck with your search, and enjoy the thrill of the vintage hunt!

[mike]

Originally Posted by jvo300

So I'm interested in dabbling in the vintage market. I've been reading alot of this forum as well as VRF. I've identified the models I am interested in chasing, but how in the world do you feel comfortable buying in the vintage market? It appears that there are many random sellers and it is really hard (for me) to determine if I'll be getting something authentic/original or a frankenstein recreation. I am lost! Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.

Jackson, welcome to the wonderful world of vintage.

I think the adage "buy the seller" is never more important than in the vintage arena.
The world of vintage is smaller than that of modern with known collector/sellers whose reputations rise and fall on their product. Get to know the regulars and their expertise. There are those who's opinion I value and who's reputation I trust.

There's a few things I learned over the years not the least of which is patience in finding that particular example I'm looking for.

Understanding not only what is correct for a given reference, but also for the era of that reference is vital in securing a "no issues" piece.

I believe in buying the best example that one can. It's tempting to "save" a few dollars because of a minor imperfection or some seemingly minor thing, but down the road that can come back to haunt you.

Among the community the question of genuine vs. original is always a debate with strong feeling on either side.

A watch is original only once and to be honest I sometimes wonder how "original" many of these pieces are.

One has to ask "Does changing something that has worn out degrade the value of a given piece?"

Is changing a crystal, stem, tube, crown that big a deal when it only enhances the integrity and water resistence of the watch protecting the the most vital parts--dial/hands/and movement?

Pay close attention to the dial/hands combination that it is correct for the reference/year you seek, but do not overlook the condition of the case. back, lugs. Often I've seen choice dials in an over polished case that just destroys the value to me.

Nothing wrong with asking for references. Good collectors don't mind at all and have nothing to hide.

The use of a known vintage dealer is certainly an option and some have their own watchmakers in house and offer a warranty of some kind.

Keep in mind they are in business to make money and usually pricing will reflect as opposed to a private sale.

Also understand a question not asked will not have the answer volunteered by a dealer (or perhaps a private sale).

Good luck and as stated take advantage of the expertise of the membership here. Some of these guys have forgotten more than you or I will ever know about these wonderful pieces.

[JohnLips]

Thank you for the good advise for us all!

[Nick1959]

Hope you find what your heart desires for

[jvo300]

Thank you all, and I will keep you posted on my experiences which I hope will only be positive!

[jvo300]

Update #1: 1675 GMTI

Wonderful transaction with NYC dealer and I am thrilled with it!

[slcbbrown]

One more small piece of advice; it's a little time consuming to develop any expertise in one brand. If you want to get to the same level of knowledge with numerous brands, it takes a lot longer. You might want to limit yourself to one or two brands, for awhile.