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View Poll Results: Does your 32xx movement seem to be 100% ok? | |||
Yes, no issues |
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1,039 | 69.83% |
No, amplitude is low (below 200) but timekeeping is still fine |
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61 | 4.10% |
No, amplitude is low (below 200) and timekeeping is off (>5 s/d) |
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388 | 26.08% |
Voters: 1488. You may not vote on this poll |
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#3031 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
Real Name: Jason
Location: Essex, UK
Watch: 14060M
Posts: 2,943
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Quote:
At least if they could the watches could be sorted during services
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#3032 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: USA
Posts: 332
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Quote:
This isn‘t an isolated situation, but rather seems to be a fundamental design flaw. So they need to modify the design of the 32xx movement. To save face they could easily continue calling a slightly redesigned movement the 32xx series. Given that Rolex updates movements infrequently, it would be a real shame if they go 10, 15, 20 years with a problem movement. |
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#3033 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Mar 2021
Location: Ireland
Posts: 327
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#3034 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Mar 2021
Location: Ireland
Posts: 327
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Quote:
Really appreciate your contributions to this thread Charles but you’re just assuming here. We do not know the extent of the problem and we do not whether Rolex has found and implemented a solution or not. One thing I’m sure of, is that Rolex really cares about it’s reputation that it constantly brags about and I doubt Rolex will allow anything that might tarnish this reputation. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
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#3035 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
Real Name: Jason
Location: Essex, UK
Watch: 14060M
Posts: 2,943
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But we do know. We have been told by at least one Rolex techy guy that it hasn’t.
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#3036 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Dec 2020
Location: .
Posts: 2,819
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#3037 |
Facilitator
Join Date: Nov 2005
Real Name: Steve
Location: Omnipresent
Posts: 33,346
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75+% saying no timekeeping problem, is overwhelming evidence of no defect in the 32XX movement.
You can't have an inherent defect that is selective to 24% of movements. So any timekeeping issue would be in the assembly of the movement or the accuracy of the assertion of the watch being inaccurate. Defects in the assembly of the movement (eg proper lubrication) are why Rolex has a 5 year warranty, so if you need you can return and get it remedied. The onus is on those asserting to prove the precise defect, not to ask people to prove their watch is functioning accurately.
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#3038 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
Real Name: Jason
Location: Essex, UK
Watch: 14060M
Posts: 2,943
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Quote:
No but he posts here quit a bit
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#3039 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
Real Name: Jason
Location: Essex, UK
Watch: 14060M
Posts: 2,943
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Might be called BAS or something like that Services watches for Rolex
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#3040 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Dec 2020
Location: .
Posts: 2,819
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32xx movement problem poll and data thread
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#3041 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Oct 2019
Real Name: Graham
Location: Aus
Posts: 2,449
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Quote:
So you can’t take this poll result like that but say hypothetically we could and you accept this 24% defect rate. Are you saying that 24% is an acceptable rate of defect and the manufacturer wouldn’t need to take corrective action? Almost 1 in 4 break down and this won’t harm reputation etc? We are not watchmakers but we have over and over again shown data that shows this issue. If a car kept breaking down would a normal consumer have to prove the exact fault or report the symptoms? Is it our fault Rolex choose to be very secretive about all this? |
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#3042 | |
Facilitator
Join Date: Nov 2005
Real Name: Steve
Location: Omnipresent
Posts: 33,346
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Quote:
That is 1 in 4 of a very small overall number and is it really a defect or just a maintenance issue? If it just needs a service/lubrication its not a defect. "If a car kept breaking down" that is a false and exaggerated analogy. Rolex doesn't have to tell you anything, where does it say that in your warranty? They just have to honour their 5 year warranty which they tend to do, or are you saying they have breached that too?
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Most folks are about as happy as they make up their minds to be. ~Abraham Lincoln Nothing compares to the simple pleasure of a bike ride. ~John F. Kennedy ROLEXploitation - yeah I'm a victim ![]() |
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#3043 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Oct 2019
Real Name: Graham
Location: Aus
Posts: 2,449
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Quote:
My DJ (2019) had to go in twice for the same issue under warranty, what happens after warranty expires in another year’s time or so? This normal? The number of people here posting about issues with the exact same symptoms normal to you? Car analogy is actually spot on here, the key difference here is there is no safety issue so no one needs to do a recall etc. The part they are lubricating is not a normal spot they need to lubricate. Our resident watchmaker has confirmed this. |
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#3044 | |
Facilitator
Join Date: Nov 2005
Real Name: Steve
Location: Omnipresent
Posts: 33,346
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Quote:
I can't comment on your isolated case and by the same token you cannot judge the making of millions of watches by your singular personal experience.
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Most folks are about as happy as they make up their minds to be. ~Abraham Lincoln Nothing compares to the simple pleasure of a bike ride. ~John F. Kennedy ROLEXploitation - yeah I'm a victim ![]() |
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#3045 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Oct 2019
Real Name: Graham
Location: Aus
Posts: 2,449
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Quote:
Searchart, a Rolex watchmaker did a photo essay on the issue. I personally have had 5 of 8 watches go bad to this. I have a 9th at the moment where it’s too early to tell. There are a large amount of reported issue both in this thread and outside of it. There is quite a lot of evidence especially when you consider that a lot of these watches aren’t even being worn as people treat them as investments and commodities. Speaking to Sydney watchmakers they know Sydney RSC were backed up with warranty work. Archer from other watch forums has confirmed he knows fellow watchmakers getting burnt out over this issue. |
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#3046 |
Facilitator
Join Date: Nov 2005
Real Name: Steve
Location: Omnipresent
Posts: 33,346
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Nice anecdotal claims, but again far from conclusive evidence of any inherent defect in millions of watches.
Can you please share the link to the 'photo essay'?
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Most folks are about as happy as they make up their minds to be. ~Abraham Lincoln Nothing compares to the simple pleasure of a bike ride. ~John F. Kennedy ROLEXploitation - yeah I'm a victim ![]() |
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#3047 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
Real Name: Jason
Location: Essex, UK
Watch: 14060M
Posts: 2,943
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Quote:
The search option will help you if you won't believe others..
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#3048 | |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Real Name: H
Location: North Carolina
Watch: M99230B-0008
Posts: 5,675
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Quote:
To be fair, the poll is not vetted. Are all of the 1/4 verified owners of watches that have never been damaged? Are they all accurately tracking time? And is there any other explaination besides a problem in manufacture? Would like some definitive answers. But the poll does not give that. ![]()
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#3049 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Real Name: Scott
Location: UK
Watch: ^^^ for now
Posts: 5,749
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Quote:
Granted the sample size here is relatively small, but 25% is significant, as is the number of repeat failures after service and that the issue is manifest on watches produced over a 4 year period. All of that would suggest its not an assembly related issue which would have been a relatively simple fix. What is does point to is a defect that manifests itself under certain circumstances which, because of its very nature, is quite possibly hard to replicate under test conditions. Why so defensive of Rolex here? Manufacturing defect or inherent design flaw, its not acceptable that its still happening years into the 32xx movement lifecycle.
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Past: 6239 (yes, I know... ![]() Present: 16600, 116509, Cartier Santos Green. |
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#3050 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Oct 2019
Real Name: Graham
Location: Aus
Posts: 2,449
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Quote:
https://www.rolexforums.com/showpost...postcount=3046 |
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#3051 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Oct 2019
Real Name: Graham
Location: Aus
Posts: 2,449
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Quote:
mountainjogger |
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#3052 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Oct 2019
Real Name: Graham
Location: Aus
Posts: 2,449
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Quote:
https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=664616 |
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#3053 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Real Name: John
Location: Salisbury
Watch: Submariner 124060
Posts: 27
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My brand new 124060 is returning the following, with 2 minutes to settle, monitored over 3 minutes, fully wound:
DU -2 to -3 s/d (271-282 degrees) CU -3 to -7 s/d (223-236 degrees) DD 0 s/d (274 degrees) CD -1 to -6 s/d (236-241 degrees) This does NOT fill me with confidence. |
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#3054 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 1,526
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Quote:
User searchart, a Rolex trained watchmaker who has seen and shared photos of this issue. He believes that the "just needs more lube fix" is a band-aid that will not last. User wm82, a Rolex trained watchmaker, has shared seeing this and a date wheel post issue. He says his medium sized AD receives multiple 32xx watches a week with problems. He says he would not personally buy a 32xx based watch at this point since he believes it is not ready for prime time. That speaks volumes to me. Elsewhere on the internet I have spoken with professional watchmakers who have colleagues working directly at RSCs. They are claiming burnout over large caseloads related to these movements. And the fact that they are sending them back out with no actual known long-term fix is not leading to good morale. So, in summary, none of us know anything with enough precision to put a number on this. But there are way, way, WAY too many datapoints emerging for this to be some one in a million fluke the likes of which any manufactured product can suffer from. I believe as time goes on this will become accepted as fact. And for that we owe some thanks to Saxo and the others who have persisted to bring this information forward. And, of course, to you Steve for providing us the venue to do so. ![]() |
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#3055 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Philly.
Watch: Air King, Omega AT
Posts: 2,198
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I purchased a DJ41 Blue in 2019 and had it for 3 years and even thou I didn't wear it every day it ran spot on. I just sold a couple months ago because it was getting almost no wrist time and I couldn't justify have it seat in the box. Maybe I was lucky, but I never had a problem with it as long as I had it.
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Air King 116900 Omega AT41 Gray Dial/Leather Oris Pointer Date Roberto Clemente LE |
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#3056 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Dec 2020
Location: .
Posts: 2,819
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32xx movement problem poll and data thread
Quote:
3U = CU = crown up? 9U= CD = crown down? 6U = CL = crown left is missing? Why do the CU and CD rates vary over such a wide range? It would be interesting to measure also after 24 hours at rest, adding 6U position. |
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#3057 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: USA
Posts: 332
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Here‘s a good summary of the fundamental design flaw with the 32xx movements, paraphrased from one of the responses to the photo essay thread. The problem is not a lack of lubrication. The issue is there should not be a friction on the dial side seconds wheel pivot. The temporary fix consists in replacing the part and lubricating to mitigate the friction, but this is a temporary fix, a paliative, it delays the reocurence of the drag, but eventually it manifests itself again after a year or so, having to pay another visit to the RSC. Rolex need to redesign the part or other elements of the movement to fix the problem once for all.
Recall from that thread that it‘s not one watchmaker saying this, it‘s multiple watchmakers. As to the size of the problem, I think it‘s far larger than the naysayers here claim. A majority of Rolex buyers aren‘t WIS with timegraphers who post on forums, but people who don‘t know a balance spring from a mainspring, they just want a quality, prestigious watch. And lots of newer Rolex buyers stick their watches in the safe and wait for the investment to pay off. Most of these people will never notice the low amplitude problem. My plan is to see if my 2022 Air-King develops the problem within the warranty period. If so, I‘ll get it fixed and sell it and enjoy my other watches that don‘t have design defects. If the problem doesn‘t develop in 5 years, I‘ll consider myself lucky. |
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#3058 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
Real Name: Jason
Location: Essex, UK
Watch: 14060M
Posts: 2,943
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Quote:
Note to self; Don’t buy an AK from @CedCraig. :)
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#3059 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Jul 2018
Real Name: Mike
Location: N. California
Watch: DateJust 41 TT
Posts: 548
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Quote:
How can that be explained by second wheel pivot wear? I'm not saying anyone is wrong - I know who said this first - and I believe. I just can't fathom how it could get better after it got worse if it's a wear/friction issue. Oil Migration? I have YEARS of data where I check the time on my watch daily. My warranty is up in June - I'll send it in again I guess. |
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#3060 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Mar 2021
Location: Ireland
Posts: 327
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32xx movement problem poll and data thread
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