32xx movement problem poll and data thread

[Toshk]

Originally Posted by atxwatch

The problem is that we don't know that they have a permanent fix. We know that some who have sent a watch in that came back "fixed", had to send it back in for another "fix". That right there means that you might be stuck with a lemon after year 5...and that is the risk.

And at some point, the pre-owned market will catch on to this. How are you going to unload a 4-year old or 5+ year-old watch with a 32xx movement in another year or two when this is going to be common knowledge? Much less for top dollar?

I will NOT buy another 22xx or 32xx movement until Rolex has announced a PERMANENT fix. WHich I don't believe they have.

Another sound opinion. Cheers

[Easy E]

Originally Posted by atxwatch

And at some point, the pre-owned market will catch on to this. How are you going to unload a 4-year old or 5+ year-old watch with a 32xx movement in another year or two when this is going to be common knowledge? Much less for top dollar?

However, the current market hasn’t caught on. This forum is lit up with current buyers that are quite dismissive of this issue. Further, just a a guess on this one, but if you told me 50% of Rolex buyers never wear their watch more than 2 times a year I would believe that. If this subset of buyers don’t find it to be an issue IDK what it will take.

I am most definitely thinning my 32xx head count. I’m not ready to smoke them outright. I am, maybe naively, optimistic that a fix will come.

[Seo]

Originally Posted by fmc000

Yes for me. I'll never buy a 32xx Rolex because I simply don't trust this movement family.

The "sent in for service" thing is not for me, sorry.

I purchased a 32xx gmt and immediately trade it for a 31xx gmt. Made a tiny bit of money in the process but the goal was not to make money but get the watch I wanted with a movement I wanted.

If problem becomes well known we won’t be able to do this.

[Toshk]

Originally Posted by Easy E

However, the current market hasn’t caught on. This forum is lit up with current buyers that are quite dismissive of this issue. Further, just a a guess on this one, but if you told me 50% of Rolex buyers never wear their watch more than 2 times a year I would believe that. If this subset of buyers don’t find it to be an issue IDK what it will take.

I am most definitely thinning my 32xx head count. I’m not ready to smoke them outright. I am, maybe naively, optimistic that a fix will come.

Do not underestimate fanboy’s determination for inspiration

[swexlin]

Originally Posted by swexlin

Yep.it's getting worse, lost 8 seconds from yesterday to today. I'm gonna send it in next week.

I mailed it to Rolex NYC this morning. Registered mail, says it will arrive on Wed 2/8. So, let's see how long this takes. I give it 2 months, so if it's back by Easter, that will be pretty good.

[aaceofspades]

Originally Posted by atxwatch

The problem is that we don't know that they have a permanent fix. We know that some who have sent a watch in that came back "fixed", had to send it back in for another "fix". That right there means that you might be stuck with a lemon after year 5...and that is the risk.

And at some point, the pre-owned market will catch on to this. How are you going to unload a 4-year old or 5+ year-old watch with a 32xx movement in another year or two when this is going to be common knowledge? Much less for top dollar?

I will NOT buy another 22xx or 32xx movement until Rolex has announced a PERMANENT fix. WHich I don't believe they have.

My DJ41, which was repaired three times, has been running flawlessly since the last repair. After the first two, I had problems within a couple of weeks. Hopefully, this is a sign that they found a permanent fix in 2022. It's been almost a year now.

[swexlin]

Originally Posted by aaceofspades

My DJ41, which was repaired three times, has been running flawlessly since the last repair. After the first two, I had problems within a couple of weeks. Hopefully, this is a sign that they found a permanent fix in 2022. It's been almost a year now.

Not to burst your bubble, but my Oct 21 DSSD which as I mentioned above, I mailed in today, was running within spec (never more than -2 per day, until two weeks ago, when it all of a sudden started running slow, and has been getting worse. So I went 16 months of everyday wear just fine.

So they run within spec - until they don't. I'll probably jinx myself but my DJ41 Wimbledon is 2 years this month, an it's still OK. Knock wood.

[aaceofspades]

Originally Posted by swexlin

Not to burst your bubble, but my Oct 21 DSSD which as I mentioned above, I mailed in today, was running within spec (never more than -2 per day, until two weeks ago, when it all of a sudden started running slow, and has been getting worse. So I went 16 months of everyday wear just fine.

So they run within spec - until they don't. I'll probably jinx myself but my DJ41 Wimbledon is 2 years this month, an it's still OK. Knock wood.

Yeah, not holding my breath. Three repairs was ridiculous. Mine was from 2019 and ran for about two years without issue and then it was downhill fast. We'll just have to wait it out.

This conversation got me wondering- Does Rolex provide a new warranty after a warranty repair? Or is it permanently attached to the purchase date?

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by swexlin

Not to burst your bubble, but my Oct 21 DSSD which as I mentioned above, I mailed in today, was running within spec (never more than -2 per day, until two weeks ago, when it all of a sudden started running slow, and has been getting worse. So I went 16 months of everyday wear just fine.

So they run within spec - until they don't.

Typical behavior, you do not see that the 32xx movement has the virus and the amplitudes decrease over time, while the accuracy remains good for many months, then "suddenly" visibly decreases because the amplitudes are too low after full winding.

Originally Posted by swexlin

I'll probably jinx myself but my DJ41 Wimbledon is 2 years this month, an it's still OK. Knock wood.

You dare to measure the DJ41 with your timegrapher and share the results?
Knocking on wood does not help … jmo.

[swexlin]

Originally Posted by saxo3

Typical behavior, you do not see that the 32xx movement has the virus and the amplitudes decrease over time, while the accuracy remains good for many months, then "suddenly" visibly decreases because the amplitudes are too low after full winding.


You dare to measure the DJ41 with your timegrapher and share the results?
Knocking on wood does not help … jmo.

Saxo, I don't need to. It's been running 0.0 per day. Spot on.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by swexlin

Saxo, I don't need to. It's been running 0.0 per day. Spot on.

Your 32xx can run very accurately on your wrist while it already has far too low amplitudes, which is the main observable for the 32xx issue.

The test I propose would be interesting to check, for a well running caliber, the H- and V-amplitudes plus the rates.

Anyhow, your choice.

[CharlesN]

Just because a 32xx movement equipped watch runs accurately it does NOT mean that there isn’t a problem with the movement.
It has been shown so very many times that the amplitude can drop below spec and the watch still keep good time but then after a little longer things go bad.

[swexlin]

Thanks, now you have me all paranoid! I'll put it on the timegrapher and see what's what.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by vipereaper30

I've saved it all to a spreadsheet just not sure how best to translate that to a forum post sorry for the eye chart. Will send over to Saxo so he can chart it out.

Received today.
Here are my graphs.



Both 3285 calibers are within the known Rolex acceptance criteria:

All amplitudes are above 200 degrees (24 hours after full winding)

Average rates (after full winding) are within owner's expectation (-2,+2):
GMT #1: -1.1 s/d and GMT #2: +1.4 s/d

GMT #2 is better than GMT #1.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by swexlin

Thanks, now you have me all paranoid! I'll put it on the timegrapher and see what's what.

Measure your other two 32xx watches…. ?

https://www.rolexforums.com/showpost...1&postcount=22

[Easy E]

Originally Posted by saxo3

Received today.
Here are my graphs.



Both 3285 calibers are within the known Rolex acceptance criteria:

All amplitudes are above 200 degrees (24 hours after full winding)

Average rates (after full winding) are within owner's expectation (-2,+2):
GMT #1: -1.1 s/d and GMT #2: +1.4 s/d

GMT #2 is better than GMT #1.

As always, very helpful. Thank you for your efforts.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by Easy E

As always, very helpful. Thank you for your efforts.

[vipereaper30]

Originally Posted by saxo3

GMT #2 is better than GMT #1.

Thanks saxo3! Just finished up at 3235 watch that is newer and has much better amplitudes. For now at least.

[the dark knight]

Originally Posted by dafuture

This may seem like a silly question, but I have to ask - would this movement issue stop any of you from buying a new watch from and AD with the 32xx inside? I've been hunting for a Submariner, but I don't really want to have to deal with any issues when I finally get one.

Kind of. I wanted at least one of my "desired' sports models brand new fresh from an AD, so I had to get one with the 32xx movement.

And then I really wanted a SS ceramic Pepsi, so had to go 32xx movement there too. Went slightly preowned on grey market for this one.

If I can get a brand new fresh Pepsi from an AD, I'd be happy to replace the above two with it and go down to one 32xx movement. That's how uneasy I am about it after reading all the stuff here.

I also love the 12x series Submariners, but the movement issues are preventing me from getting one. And I intentionally purchased preowned Explorer IIs with the 3137, and I have no interest in replacing them with a brand new one from AD even if I got allocated one.

[RFC]

My 3130 in the 14060M, 3135 in the DJ, and 3175 in a GMT all run at or near 300 amp when fully wound and all have a fresh service. None loses time. By comparison the 124040 has a better delta and is either spot on or loses time but never gains time and amp is not higher than 270 in any position but not below 230.

[Roddypeepa]

My 2018 DJ41 has just gone in for warranty work. Went from about +0.5 spd to about -4. Let’s see what they say.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[swexlin]

Originally Posted by swexlin

Not to burst your bubble, but my Oct 21 DSSD which as I mentioned above, I mailed in today, was running within spec (never more than -2 per day, until two weeks ago, when it all of a sudden started running slow, and has been getting worse. So I went 16 months of everyday wear just fine.

So they run within spec - until they don't. I'll probably jinx myself but my DJ41 Wimbledon is 2 years this month, an it's still OK. Knock wood.

I received email confirmation and statement from Rolex NYC today. All is basically says is "check movement" and will take about 4 weeks, and will be returned via FedEx. All under warranty, so no charge.

[Marast-66]

Originally Posted by Scholar

This thread was a real wake-up call. I was going to get a current DJ as a gift for my father, and was considering a new OP or Explorer for myself. Going to go Grand Seiko instead for him, and perhaps Tudor for me.

Good for you.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by swexlin

I received email confirmation and statement from Rolex NYC today. All is basically says is "check movement" and will take about 4 weeks, and will be returned via FedEx. All under warranty, so no charge.

Thanks for the update.
Let's hope it gets fixed

[EaglePilot]

Hi,

like I promised in a post in this forum some days ago, bellow is the data I collected from a timegrapher (I was waiting to stay at home for 3 consecutive days to collect data from my timegrapher - Weishi 1000 bought last month). The watch is a GMT master II 126710 BLNR bought brand new from AD in December 2022, after waiting for 7 months. I didnt use the watch since then (I wait to collect data before use, so the watch is unworn).

After 15 min of full winding:

Du -2s / 284 0.0ms
DD -1s /282 0.1ms
9U 0s /241 0.1ms
3U -7s 244 0.2ms (so strange this rate at 3U just after winding the watch, I checked several times and this is the reading I got)
6U -1s 246 0.0ms

24 h:

DU -1s / 260 0.2ms
DD 0s 250 0.2ms
9U -1s 217 0.2ms
3U -3s 219 0.3ms
6U 0s 223 0.0ms

48 h:

DU 0s 232 0.2ms
DD +1s 223 0,2ms
9U -5s 193 0.1 ms
3U +4s 190 0.3ms (strange rate again at 3U, now the watch is gaining time ?! )
6U 0s 190 0.0 ms

I checked the time comparing to my cellphone at 24h and 48h, and the watch was 1s slow at 24 h, and about 1,5s at 48h.
The 60hrs and 72 hrs would be reached tomorrow, but I will travel, so I will not be able to take the readings.

ps - again, sorry for my English, not my natural language! I took some pictures, but dont know how to post pictures in the forum.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by EaglePilot

After 15 min of full winding:

Du -2s / 284 0.0ms
DD -1s /282 0.1ms
9U 0s /241 0.1ms
3U -7s 244 0.2ms (so strange this rate at 3U just after winding the watch, I checked several times and this is the reading I got)
6U -1s 246 0.0ms

24 h:

DU -1s / 260 0.2ms
DD 0s 250 0.2ms
9U -1s 217 0.2ms
3U -3s 219 0.3ms
6U 0s 223 0.0ms

48 h:

DU 0s 232 0.2ms
DD +1s 223 0,2ms
9U -5s 193 0.1 ms
3U +4s 190 0.3ms (strange rate again at 3U, now the watch is gaining time ?! )
6U 0s 190 0.0 ms

These data compared to other GMT-Master II Ref. 126710BLNR watches.




Your 126710BLNR (3285 caliber) is within the known Rolex acceptance criteria:

All amplitudes are above 200 degrees (24 hours after full winding).

The average rate X = -2.2 s/d (after full winding) is well inside COSC (blue marked area) and a little bit outside owner's expectation (-2,+2), which is due to the low rate (-7 s/d) in 3U position.

[EaglePilot]

Thanks for the graphs saxo3.
I will measure one 48 hrs cycle again before real use of the watch. If tbe 3U and 9U rates came "better" then this I will post here. It not, I will start to use the watch and measure again in maybe 1 or 2 months.
By the way, is it plausible the watch after use from brand new start to settle in (I dont know if this is the correct word in english), like an engine car after breaking in from new?

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by EaglePilot

Thanks for the graphs saxo3.
I will measure one 48 hrs cycle again before real use of the watch. If tbe 3U and 9U rates came "better" then this I will post here. It not, I will start to use the watch and measure again in maybe 1 or 2 months.
By the way, is it plausible the watch after use from brand new start to settle in (I dont know if this is the correct word in english), like an engine car after breaking in from new?

You are welcome

These 126710BLNR data are very interesting.

This is the first time I've noticed a different behaviour for a 32xx watch.

Please repeat the test with more data points, for t = 0, 12, 24, 36, 48, 54, 60 hours.

Post all data as you measure them, even if you think something is weird.

[EaglePilot]

Hi saxo3
I will repeat the test following your recomendations! Just have to find time to stay at my city/home for more then 3 consecutive days to do this, because I travel a lot. I didnt use the watch yet (not a problem, daily using my old GMT). I prefer to collect most timegrapher data from my brand new BLNR before start using it.

[corporalq]

Originally Posted by TswaneNguni

No idea about amplitude .

DSSD JC 2018 (3235) was -5s/day .
RSC (Only Rolex I have ever sent to RSC)
Running perfect now .

What was your turn around time? Your situation is literally identical to mine. I need to send for service.