Insanity in the marketplace....

[JRell]

I prefer my Rolex’s through an official dealer at MSRP, being the first owner of record, but to each their own.

[zen watch]

Your money, your rules. No one has a say, in how one spends his money on. And no one is forcing anyone to buy anything. Free market, free choice. That’s how I see it.

[trfChris]

Originally Posted by JRell

I prefer my Rolex’s through an official dealer at MSRP, being the first owner of record, but to each their own.

I got my GMT from DavidSW at 30% off MSRP, saved some money and he was a pleasure to do business with! Some prefer the AD route though, nothing wrong with that! :)

[0ptimus_1]

David is a stand up guy trying to build a business off a demand. Not everyone is going to be fortunate enough or lucky to be in the right place to get these desirable models. It’s going to be tough to get the new sub with the new rules in AD’s.

[NYG1121]

Love that people blame David or anyone else who has been doing this for a long time. Its pure supply and demand. Blame Rolex

[huncho]

Originally Posted by NYG1121

Love that people blame David or anyone else who has been doing this for a long time. Its pure supply and demand. Blame Rolex

a lot of people are either new or seem to forget these same greys were selling SS models for 20% off 3-4 yrs ago. everyone loved them then and suddenly hates them now lol. no one is entitled to a rolex. don't hate the player, hate the game

[fskywalker]

Originally Posted by yonexsp

It is getting out of hand.

This!


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[donas]

Originally Posted by huncho

a lot of people are either new or seem to forget these same greys were selling SS models for 20% off 3-4 yrs ago. everyone loved them then and suddenly hates them now lol. no one is entitled to a rolex. don't hate the player, hate the game

Exactly. Rolex is the only one to blame.

[Pam673]

Blame the game and not the players?

What a joke! Without the players, there is no game. You play, you also make the game!

[dmitrii_]

Originally Posted by Pam673

Blame the game and not the players?

What a joke! Without the players, there is no game. You play, you also make the game!

No. Without the players there will be other players. All in the game.

[Pam673]

Originally Posted by dmitrii_

No. Without the players there will be other players. All in the game.

No..,without the players there wound be no players if nobody wants to play

[RyanJ]

So then why do people hate flippers? All these watch sellers like DavidSW are also simply flippers.

Everyone is playing the game. I say anyone that can make 100%+ profit have at it.

[Rock]

I have only three Rolex. I bought them all second hand at less than half their original RRP. They were all like new. I am very happy with them, moreso because I paid what I thought they were worth. I will never buy a new one because I think they are lousy value for money new - even at RRP (and I don't like the six-digits anyhow).
I might buy one more if the exchange rate improves - probably from David SW.
In spite of the GFC and Covid, I have observed that there is a lot of money out there, chasing and inflating the value of 'prestige items' - cars, houses, jewellery, art, you name it. A lot of people are doing it tough, but a lot aren't.
If you have one Rolex, you are 100% up on a big slab of the population.

[slvrbulletv6]

Originally Posted by 0ptimus_1

David is a stand up guy trying to build a business off a demand. Not everyone is going to be fortunate enough or lucky to be in the right place to get these desirable models. It’s going to be tough to get the new sub with the new rules in AD’s.

What are these new AD rules that you’re speaking of?

[Sandpit]

Originally Posted by RyanJ

So then why do people hate flippers? All these watch sellers like DavidSW are also simply flippers.

Everyone is playing the game. I say anyone that can make 100%+ profit have at it.

It takes away stock from genuine buyers. To be honest I have the same dislike of ticket scalpers for concerts. You know, the ones that use underhand (but not illegal) tactics to snap up every available ticket (similar to what we see with Rolex).

Personally, i've never tried to profiteer - but I understand some do. I get its a free market and all that, but it doesn't mean we have to like this practice.

[nigelUK]

I loved the days of being able to get a Rolex sports SS watch at retail or slightly lower, then moving it on in say 3/6/ or 12 months later at a small loss or gain, to enable another purchase.

That fun wasn't that long ago, but it's certainly ended now. The 'market value' has pretty much priced me out of the hobby, as far as Rolex is concerned.

Found myself looking more and more at Panerai used market again, and micro brands. .. and I've enjoyed Tudor for some time now

[Miker86]

Originally Posted by Sandpit

It takes away stock from genuine buyers. To be honest I have the same dislike of ticket scalpers for concerts. You know, the ones that use underhand (but not illegal) tactics to snap up every available ticket (similar to what we see with Rolex).

Personally, i've never tried to profiteer - but I understand some do. I get its a free market and all that, but it doesn't mean we have to like this practice.

This is the best summary in my opinion. Greys hoovering up all the desirable pieces and selling at a large premium does leave a bitter taste. At the same time if I were in their position I’d probably do the same thing in all honesty.

[Harry-57]

Originally Posted by nigelUK

I loved the days of being able to get a Rolex sports SS watch at retail or slightly lower, then moving it on in say 3/6/ or 12 months later at a small loss or gain, to enable another purchase.

<joking> You flipper you. You are stealing from people. Go hang your head in shame. </joking>

Originally Posted by nigelUK

That fun wasn't that long ago, but it's certainly ended now.

In Feb 2018 the Hulk was already too hot. I walked into my AD, asked for a Polar, negotiated 5% off and bought it. I could have bought a 116610LN to go with it. I know I wasn't dreaming because I have the Polar and the receipt, as well as the memory.

For me the fun remains because of my love for my watches. And I'm usually planning and scheming for what's next (which is a Tag Heuer in my case). The forum isn't so much fun at the moment though. I don't even want to imagine the posts that get killed by the mods at birth. These things go in cycles.

[Sandpit]

Originally Posted by Harry-57

For me the fun remains because of my love for my watches. And I'm usually planning and scheming for what's next (which is a Tag Heuer in my case). The forum isn't so much fun at the moment though. I don't even want to imagine the posts that get killed by the mods at birth. These things go in cycles.

Absolutely agree. With all this talk of other brands tanking in value I do not understand why more people aren't using this to their advantage instead of only seeing the negative.

Why wouldn't somebody want to pick up something 30-40% off retail?

I'm waiting to see what happens to the new JLC Calendar prices. Ideally Calendar Chrono but they're a decent step up.

[Chopped54]

Originally Posted by RyanJ

So then why do people hate flippers? All these watch sellers like DavidSW are also simply flippers.

Everyone is playing the game. I say anyone that can make 100%+ profit have at it.

People look for a person to blame so naturally it is the flippers. Half of them that complain would flip a watch in a heartbeat, just look at any of the "What would you pick" threads. Majority of folks say they would take the more desirable watch and sell it for a profit and buy the other keeping the extra money, exactly what a flipper does.

In the end it is Rolex's fault. They know exactly what is going on and they will never do anything about it. The shortages\demand\greys all create even more hype for the brand, kind of like the velvet rope outside of a club with 1000 people waiting in line yet an empty club inside.

[Keepchasing]

People keep trying to figure out who's to blame. That presupposes that there is something wrong.

I don't believe anything is wrong. It is the market, plain and simple. Not everyone deserves a Rolex. Now that demand is huge, and they aren't sitting in the case anymore, people don't want to recognize the game has changed.

Just because you can still afford one at msrp, like you could 4 years ago, the situation is no longer the same. That is driving the blaming, imo. People are mad that they can't get what they want, when they want it.

Pay up. There is no problem from what I can see.

Is pricing crazy right now? Imo, yes. It will correct itself sooner or later. Nothing can sustain this kind of growth. Kind of getting parabolic too.

[drfrankenstein]

Originally Posted by Keepchasing

People keep trying to figure out who's to blame. That presupposes that there is something wrong.

I don't believe anything is wrong. It is the market, plain and simple. Not everyone deserves a Rolex. Now that demand is huge, and they aren't sitting in the case anymore, people don't want to recognize the game has changed.

Just because you can still afford one at msrp, like you could 4 years ago, the situation is no longer the same. That is driving the blaming, imo. People are mad that they can't get what they want, when they want it.

Pay up. There is no problem from what I can see.

Is pricing crazy right now? Imo, yes. It will correct itself sooner or later. Nothing can sustain this kind of growth. Kind of getting parabolic too.

Tough situation and I see your points but ADs don’t want empty watch cases either.

Will be interesting to see if this actually fades over time or in some degree just becomes the new normal.

[Saltzy]

Haters gonna hate.

/Thread.

[77T]

A lot of interesting comments. Just briefly, what is a “genuine buyer”?

Is S/He only allowed to buy from an AD, only at MSRP, and without a bundle or series of pre-qualifying purchases?

A person paying nearly 3x for that new Sub is genuine. S/He is just willing to pay that price.

I get the ire at scalper prices - but the dealer who gets the hottest model first will be selling to a genuine buyer no matter how you define it.

The dealer is the same person as a broker who garners scarce resources at “below market” prices and resells at some other level. Think of a recent IPO on the equities market.

Lemonade (LMND) IPO opened on 2July, priced at $29, but spiked for as much as $69 that day - and then into the $80’s in the weeks following IPO - before settling on Friday @$52.40.

Guess what, nobody complained about the IPO. Nor the rollercoaster along the way to equilibrium. BTW, private placements before the IPO had traded above those levels.

Rolex models are traded, bought, sold in all sorts of ways privately, too. For the listing in post #1, there may have already been 2 or 3 sold by a grey dealer privately.

They have lists, too...

So have faith, equilibrium will settle the present arguments...



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[dmitrii_]

Originally Posted by Pam673

No..,without the players there wound be no players if nobody wants to play

Maybe in Lala land. In the real world there will always be players.

[Roger Lococco]

That $28k Cermit is already gone from DavidSW’s website ...

Which TRF poster will confess.


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[Nikrnic]

A fool and his money or more money than brains. I know!... I know it doesn't matter to some people.

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[ippon20]

Originally Posted by Roger Lococco

That $28k Cermit is already gone from DavidSW’s website ...

Which TRF poster will confess.


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Guarantee you it pops up again. Image search programs show a multitude of watches get recycled on there. There's a reason why the WHOLE serial number is removed.

[RHIII]

Originally Posted by ippon20

Guarantee you it pops up again. Image search programs show a multitude of watches get recycled on there. There's a reason why the WHOLE serial number is removed.

I’ve seen watches disappear and reappear across the board - for multiple sellers. definitely not an abnormal occurrence, I’d say.

Especially when they’re what I’d call more obscure references.


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[0ptimus_1]

Originally Posted by slvrbulletv6

What are these new AD rules that you’re speaking of?

You can walk into a AD at one time and buy a Submariner without having to "Bundle". The market has gotten hot and now they leverage the SS sport models to buy the not so popular models or PM pieces. It isn't the norm anymore to just walk in and get a Sub. Yes, exceptions to the rule always exist.