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ROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEX
ROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEX
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#31 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: May 2023
Location: Europe
Posts: 237
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#32 |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: New England, USA
Posts: 196
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Hi All,
Mike Margolis here from Czapek Americas. A few comments, take them with a grain of salt, because, well, you know what I do for a living..... 1) Re CWard, we no longer work with that designer. Would you? :) 2) We are not going anywhere, our last few years have been phenomenal, and we are well capitalized. (I am one of the shareholders) 3) You REALLY need to see one in person. Our bracelet is spectacular. We have microadjusters, the other guys do not. A couple people have called us out on lack of chamfering on the edges of the links on the 40.5, while our 38.5 has them. This was a design decision, not a financial one. 4) Platinum microrotor. Anyone else have that? 5) Bridge design? Anyone else as interesting as Czapek. 6) Support from the company AFTER you buy the watch. I don't see the Moser, VC or PF people here commenting Watch on! |
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#33 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Mar 2024
Location: GER
Posts: 12
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#34 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Feb 2024
Location: Australia
Posts: 57
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Quote:
Thanks everyone for their responses as well. |
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#35 | |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: USA
Watch: addiction issues
Posts: 37,130
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Quote:
The 15510st is actually .1mm thinner than the czapek. The bracelet on this gen is thinner than before too so if anyone hasn’t tried the 15510st yet it’s an improvement over the last few gens.
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#36 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: NYC
Posts: 92
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Quote:
VC offers quick/micro adjust. PF offers a platinum microrotor. Bridge/plate/movement architecture is subjective. But Czapek does offer something objectively, very non traditional and visually interesting. |
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#37 | |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: May 2008
Real Name: Dan
Location: CT, by a lake
Watch: 16570
Posts: 1,544
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Quote:
Other suggestion that was posted - get a 15300 and call it a day. Better wearablity than 15202 and the proportions are just as perfect. If you're going to spend $30k that's the one to get. Forget the pretenders and get the original.
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A watch is about the entire package, not just its appearance. Any large watch company not making its own movement is not making a watch at all; they’re just playing dress-up. --The Watch Snob |
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#38 | |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: New England, USA
Posts: 196
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VC offers quick/micro adjust. Sorry, did not know that.
PF offers a platinum microrotor. I love PF from the back. I find the front to mostly be a bit ..... subdued. :) Quote:
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#39 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: Issaquah
Posts: 1,695
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VC Overseas vs PF Tonda vs Moser Streamliner vs Czapek: Rank them?
Isn’t Moser’s blue enamel Streamliner with a platinum micro rotor as well? Please correct me if I’m wrong.
Edit: confirmed. Moser’s blue enamel small seconds Streamliner has a platinum micro rotor. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
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#40 |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: Nov 2012
Real Name: Steven
Location: Glocal
Posts: 20,301
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Czapek did great at Sotheby's auction today. Some other brands timepieces didn't do as well as expected. Will still say get all four, they are different enough to justify :)
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__________________ Love timepieces and want to become a Watchmaker? Rolex has a sensational school. www.RolexWatchmakingTrainingCenter.com/ Sent from my Etch A Sketch using String Theory. |
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#41 |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: New England, USA
Posts: 196
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Sorry, not familiar with Moser's new micro rotor movement.
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#42 | |
2024 ROLEX DATEJUST41 Pledge Member
Join Date: May 2021
Location: East Coast
Posts: 531
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Quote:
To me, it made it look like a cheaper version of your pieces, which was a turn off on both what they did and made it harder for me (perhaps wrongly) to want to take the plunge for a Czapek. I might be the only person like that, but it just was how I felt. I do really like the Promenade. |
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#43 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: California
Posts: 53
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Quote:
Not that the Czapek is perfect, but you get my point. It's the whole package that's important. |
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#44 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Europe
Posts: 627
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I do want to add a bit of perspective on the value retention factor that appears to be coming back again and again. First off: if you cannot afford to lose some money, this is not the right hobby. Second: many RO references depreciated significantly in the past 2 years. If you bought a 15202 in 2021 this has been a very bad financial decision for you. So the value retention point is flawed. Third: you will not be able to buy a nice 37 or 39mm royal oak for the price of a Streamliner or an Antarctique - not at street price that is.
On the product itself: except for the jumbo refs, all royal oaks are mass-produced watches with barebones movement finishing (with the new 15550 even having an outsourced Vaucher movement). So you pay for the timeless design and the fantastic bracelet. Moser and Czapek are independents with a different value prop and exist for collectors who want to travel off the beaten path. No wrong choice either way - but stick with 37 or 39mm if you go RO. |
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#45 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Basel
Watch: LF Sport & Pepsi
Posts: 975
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Oh nice. I was unaware. Glad to hear they fixed (my perception of) the problem.
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#46 | |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: Nov 2012
Real Name: Steven
Location: Glocal
Posts: 20,301
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Quote:
Short term, the recent massive financial bubble has been exceptional, thanks for your recent support for horology everyone ![]() Am curious, who here has joined the NAWCC, AHCI (Académie Horlogère des Créateurs Indépendants), NY Society, etc?
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__________________ Love timepieces and want to become a Watchmaker? Rolex has a sensational school. www.RolexWatchmakingTrainingCenter.com/ Sent from my Etch A Sketch using String Theory. |
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#47 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Basel
Watch: LF Sport & Pepsi
Posts: 975
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#48 |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: Nov 2012
Real Name: Steven
Location: Glocal
Posts: 20,301
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__________________ Love timepieces and want to become a Watchmaker? Rolex has a sensational school. www.RolexWatchmakingTrainingCenter.com/ Sent from my Etch A Sketch using String Theory. |
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#49 | |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: New England, USA
Posts: 196
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#50 | |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: Nov 2012
Real Name: Steven
Location: Glocal
Posts: 20,301
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Quote:
![]() IWJC, omg wow... yeah, and had to look 'em up to see what they've been doing. Mike is also being VERY modest imho, as he's generously been a valued asset for lovers of horology for decades. Still kinda blows my mind the great guys from 1990s Newsgroups, Timezone, etc that are still very active. We are a passionate bunch.
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__________________ Love timepieces and want to become a Watchmaker? Rolex has a sensational school. www.RolexWatchmakingTrainingCenter.com/ Sent from my Etch A Sketch using String Theory. |
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#51 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 31
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I own atm a 4500V blue dial, a Czapek Antarctique and a 15510.
I would say that the AP is not replaceable. It's my 3rd RO. Everytime I sell one, I end up buying it again. From the choices in this thread, no wrong choice. The PF is the one I like the least, the bracelet doesn't do it for me. The Moser is incredible, and I think I will end up buying one, but I feel that it wilI end up boring me. Between VC and Czapek, I like them both. On the grey market, the Czapek is significantly cheaper, so I guess that's a thing to consider. Czapek aftersale service is absolutely incredible here in Switzerland.
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Rolex 116515LN - VC 4500V - Czapek Antarctique
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#52 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,365
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From a personal perspective I can again say I've owned / own all 4. Reading all the posts above, it's pretty obvious many people have their own loves and prejudices. That doesn't mean they are wrong at all but you need to just feel what watch is a better fit for you, your wrist, your psychology and your personality.
1. VC - mine didn't have the micro adjustment and it wears big. Still it has the Holy Trinity sticker if that's your thing.....! Affordable now Grey below RRP. 2. Moser. Streamliner bracelet probably the most comfortable I've worn. No date and that's important to many. Amazing brand and just "quirky" - for those who want to be outside the mainstream. Available below RRP from Grey. 3. Czapek - as Mike and others have mentioned - after sales service second to none. I had a bracelet issue - replaced within 48 hours no questions asked. I feel quite happy wearing mine in London on the rubber strap. Flies under the radar of muggers yet the rear caseback is amazing. Just an easy everyday wear. Good for the beach / swimming / hiking etc. Also good value on grey market now but then you won't necessarily get the ame VIP service. 4. PF. I have had a Tonda panda Chrono and currently have the PF Chrono. Both have the date but the dial on the PF Chrono is amazing. Probably the best horte horology watch of the 4 but more dressy, no lume and no micro adjustment. |
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#53 |
2024 ROLEX DATEJUST41 Pledge Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Real Name: JYogi/Jeremy
Location: Metro Detroit USA
Watch: It's a Rolex!
Posts: 5,733
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Moser
Parm Czapek VC
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"You won't rise to the occasion - you'll default to your level of training." Barrett Tillman Kentucky Colonel, Tennessee Squire & Combat Leprechaun |
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#54 |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: usa
Posts: 19,312
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I’m curious how this tweaked silhouette for VC moves the needle or not on comfort / bulkiness
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#55 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: May 2019
Location: KunLun
Posts: 252
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I currently own a Tonda GMT Rattrapante & I love the comfort of the bracelet as well as the subtle dressy aesthetics of the watch in general. I like a good complication so I chose this one. It’s rare to find a dual time watch with no date. So the PF is a brand I have a soft spot for. I like the Moser Streamliner but it reminds me too much of my IWC Ocean 2000. The Czapek I completely disregard because it looks too generic to me, like an upmarket Tissot PRX. All the VC has is brand cachet & heritage as their watches don’t really appeal to my sense of aesthetics. I hope that was helpful.
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#56 |
TRF Moderator & 2024 DATE-JUST41 Patron
Join Date: Dec 2007
Real Name: Ken
Location: SW Florida
Watch: One on my wrist.
Posts: 63,695
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VC only one on your list that I would consider. I own one in RG and it is an incredible watch and extremely versatile with 3 straps. Highly recommend! The finishing is truly second to none IMHO.
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#57 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Basel
Watch: LF Sport & Pepsi
Posts: 975
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#58 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 31
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Indeed, by another RO
![]() Had a 15450, which was too small for me. Then a 26331 that I had to sell for financial reasons. Had the opportunity to pick a 15510, couldn't refuse
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Rolex 116515LN - VC 4500V - Czapek Antarctique
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#59 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: uk
Posts: 992
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In the end it is your choice, all are nice watches to have.
I personally prefer the blue VC with its incredibly beautiful dial, quite versatile with the various straps and a reputable, historic brand. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
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#60 |
2024 ROLEX DATEJUST41 Pledge Member
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: USA
Watch: YM42 Ti
Posts: 2,617
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I have tried all of these on, though a couple had different dials.
1, Moser. Take my money 2, VC. Like it, but not enough to buy. 3, PF. Want to like it, but I dislike skeleton hands too much to consider. 4, Czapek. Zero interest. No emotional draw at all. Maybe I just saw to many watches that day
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