Finally Found The Perfect 5513!

[4rnold]

Miro

[4rnold]

But I think its more Sam Francis

[brandrea]

Congratulations OP Nice Speedy too

[Crown & Shield]

Originally Posted by offrdmania

I hate how the marketers of vintage pieces praise these dials as exotic or as patina in order to ask ungodly prices for what is essentially a damaged dial.

[Kingface66]

Congrats! And happy you’re happy. I’m a bit astonished that dials like these are kind of getting to the point of “If you want a gilt dial for x-amount, this is what you’re gonna get”.

[linesiders]

Originally Posted by WatchEater666

There's light brown all over the dial if you blast it with light. I don't think it's water damage.

I don't think it is water damaged (the plots look original and fantastic). And I think the price it was listed at was fair considering the source and the condition of the dial . You would pay an extra 7K if that dial did not have that delamiation/lifting of the final surface layer. This is a near 60 year old dial doing what 60 year old dials do. In time, it may be worth seeing if a dial specialist can resolve that (there may be ways) and leaving the existing lume intact. In the meantime, enjoy it, understand it is not perfect, but you also did not pay perfect price.

Originally Posted by boring_sandwich

It that rust on the dial around the 6 and 7 o'clock markers, possible water damage?

Not rust, this is a common thing that happens with gilt dials browning differently around the edge. Sometimes it looks lousy, this looks alright.

[Pete_mcC]

It’s a good, interesting & wearable watch, you’re not going to be as scared to ding the case or dial as you would be with a full price one. Personally I like it, it’s unique.

The case looks like new. That seller must get special rates from his polisher/laser welder judging by the number of watches in stock that he has had refinished just like that one

[WatchEater666]

Originally Posted by Pete_McC

It’s a good, interesting & wearable watch, you’re not going to be as scared to ding the case or dial as you would be with a full price one. Personally I like it, it’s unique.

The case looks like new. That seller must get special rates from his polisher/laser welder judging by the number of watches in stock that he has had refinished just like that one

It’s true patina that does them I think! He does good work.

[hutch300]

Greg at TP does a lot of his services but not all. He uses a lot of the usual suspects and also The Independent aka Giovanni Passalacqua local to him.

[Pete_mcC]

Originally Posted by WatchEater666

It’s true patina that does them I think! He does good work.

Good to know, thanks!

[TurboTim14]

Originally Posted by offrdmania

I hate how the marketers of vintage pieces praise these dials as exotic or as patina in order to ask ungodly prices for what is essentially a damaged dial.

This

Dealers like to spin damage as some sort of desirable "patina".

OP, glad you like the watch. That's all that matters. I do hope you got a good deal on it. I would personally have the dial refinished by one of the experts. Looks like a nice watch otherwise.

[RFC]

I’m sensing that the seller oversold this piece but the OP likes it regardless of price or marketing hype. He’s not asking for advice before making a purchase. Damaged dial or not he has a gilt 5513 so kudos to him.

[4rnold]

Is is possible to fixate a dial like this? How would they 'repair' it?

[Arnozerosix]

Originally Posted by 4rnold

Is is possible to fixate a dial like this? How would they 'repair' it?

Yes it is there are some experts for such job in Europe and in Hong Kong...
but it is expensive....

[RFC]

Staying on message Tropical Watch has just posted for sale a 1963 gilt 5513 with a similar damaged dial, though better looking than the one in this thread, and I quote “The excellent gilt underline dial has aged with an extensive and even pattern of speckling patina and in addition has a beautiful foggy quality to the lacquer which shows tones of golds and blues.”. “Foggy quality”!!! It’s a galactic watch according to his notes. Got to give points for creativity. The hands have been relumed and he’s asking 32k.

[btinl]

Originally Posted by RFC

Staying on message Tropical Watch has just posted for sale a 1963 gilt 5513 with a similar damaged dial, though better looking than the one in this thread, and I quote “The excellent gilt underline dial has aged with an extensive and even pattern of speckling patina and in addition has a beautiful foggy quality to the lacquer which shows tones of golds and blues.”. “Foggy quality”!!! It’s a galactic watch according to his notes. Got to give points for creativity. The hands have been relumed and he’s asking 32k.

This dealer practice gets validated by people buying these watches with damaged dials.

[4rnold]

Originally Posted by RFC

Staying on message Tropical Watch has just posted for sale a 1963 gilt 5513 with a similar damaged dial, though better looking than the one in this thread, and I quote “The excellent gilt underline dial has aged with an extensive and even pattern of speckling patina and in addition has a beautiful foggy quality to the lacquer which shows tones of golds and blues.”. “Foggy quality”!!! It’s a galactic watch according to his notes. Got to give points for creativity. The hands have been relumed and he’s asking 32k.

is this water damage?

[WatchEater666]

Forgot what a buzzkill TRF can be. FWIW didn't pay the list price.

[4rnold]

I dont know what to think of these watches, I think they are beautifull, but would I buy them?

if they were kinda cheap, yes, but still, you'd pay thousands of dollars

so priced according the condition is not cheap by any means

[RFC]

Originally Posted by WatchEater666

Forgot what a buzzkill TRF can be. FWIW didn't pay the list price.

It’s irrelevant to you that the dial is not perfect or damaged. It looks unique and who cares what others think. Not many can say they have a gilt 5513. Enjoy it.

[mjolnir2thor]

Originally Posted by RFC

Staying on message Tropical Watch has just posted for sale a 1963 gilt 5513 with a similar damaged dial, though better looking than the one in this thread, and I quote “The excellent gilt underline dial has aged with an extensive and even pattern of speckling patina and in addition has a beautiful foggy quality to the lacquer which shows tones of golds and blues.”. “Foggy quality”!!! It’s a galactic watch according to his notes. Got to give points for creativity. The hands have been relumed and he’s asking 32k.

Actually there are are two on the site currently for sale. The one you identified and another for ~$25k. Was the bubbling on the dial due to age of the applied factory finish or were the dials subjected to some external factor causing the blistering? What do you guys think?

[MrChamfers]

Originally Posted by mjolnir2thor

Actually there are are two on the site currently for sale. The one you identified and another for ~$25k. Was the bubbling on the dial due to age of the applied factory finish or were the dials subjected to some external factor causing the blistering? What do you guys think?

The $25k one looks like it had water damage to me.

[GGGMT]

Originally Posted by RFC

Staying on message The hands have been relumed and he’s asking 32k.

And he’ll get it because people will buy it …


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[GGGMT]

Originally Posted by WatchEater666

There's light brown all over the dial if you blast it with light. I don't think it's water damage.

It’s a cool interesting unusual dial. And gilt. That’s Sick biz!! Wear in good health.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Arnozerosix]

It is always a question of destination.

Are you getting this watch because it provides you some emotional reaction ?
Are you getting this watch because you believe watch is a way to invest your money and you are expecting a 2figures % ROI ?

Personally I love these gilt dial and nothing in the Rolex range provides more emotion once on my wrist...

[Kingface66]

Im sure I’m stating the obvious, but if there were many excellent gilt dialed Subs available, like there were, say, 20 years ago, these bubbling/cracking/deteriorating dials would be shunned and would never sell…unless maybe for parts. Nobody would be inventing names for them, or touting them as charming. There would be no need to. But, because the pristine, or elegantly-aged examples have all been bought-up, pretending these damaged examples are exotic and worthy has become a modern day Emperor’s New Clothes. And who’s to blame? Jacek et al. for nurturing this desire to own even a completely damaged version of an iconic watch because, “Hey, it’s still a gilt Sub”, or the hundreds or thousands of customers willing to pay $25K for such piece?
Sorry for the rant.

[Arnozerosix]

Originally Posted by Kingface66

....Jacek et al. for nurturing this desire to own even a completely damaged version ....
Sorry for the rant.

you're kind of exaggerating aren't you ?
This watch is quite nice even though the dial shows sign of life ...

[Dan S]

Putting value and personal taste aside, I feel that this particular dial would be too risky for me to own. That's really my main issue with it. Those big blisters do not look stable to me and flaking seems inevitable. Unfortunately, dials do deteriorate. For the OP's sake, I hope it doesn't happen soon and that he gets to enjoy the watch in its present state for years to come. I would just try to be careful with it, minimize exposure to the elements, and I wouldn't have any unnecessary work done on the watch. Avoid having the dial/movement removed from the case if possible, and definitely don't have the hands removed if you can avoid it. Just treat it really gently.

[Kingface66]

Originally Posted by Arnozerosix

you're kind of exaggerating aren't you ?
This watch is quite nice even though the dial shows sign of life ...

“Signs of life” is far too generous.
Maybe my point got lost, but I don’t think I was exaggerating in the conceit that when Jacek or some other dealer has to come up with names like “stardust” or “hot lava” or “moonscape” to try to sell clearly damaged dials that can’t be repaired, one can’t help feel that it’s all an effort to create a false belief that these dials are somehow “rare” or “exotic” and therefore worth tens of thousands of dollars. A perfect example is how the term “tropical” for a dial has been so abused and misappropriated.

[subtona]

Originally Posted by linesiders

Interesting, the bubbling is what it is but killer dial underneath. Being almost as old, my face has some issues too ; )



Great Pickup - enjoy it ; )