Rolex 6202 - is the dial refinished? luke rottman

[mr.nice_watch]

Originally Posted by lukerottman

I always upgrade at the gate, right before takeoff! W/O upgrading, purchasing a FC ticket in advance these days is so costly. Book economy and upgrade for a few hundred. It can save you tens of thousands a year if you're a frequent flyer.

For instance...Virgin America JFK TO LAX is a 2,500 ticket in first. I book Econ. ticket far in advance then upgrade to first. I end up spending 600 total round trip. And still earn mileage points. Also by doing so ur eligible to use First Class lounges at the airports, plus other travel benefits. If you'd like anymore info on that, feel free to email me! Thewatchadviser@yahoo.com. :)

How can s 16 year old travel first class without being of age?? This whole thread smells like BS to me.

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[themaninblack]

15 and up is the standard age for independent travel on most airlines, 16 on some airlines and class of travel does not come into it.

[mr.nice_watch]

Originally Posted by themaninblack

15 and up is the standard age for independent travel on most airlines, 16 on some airlines and class of travel does not come into it.

Interesting

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[andromeda160]

Might be a bit more strict now, but first time I traveled alone I was 14. I had silver and gold medallion for a good part of my childhood, so upgrades were frequent for me. Had to use my miles for international upgrades though

[Haywood_Milton]

All interesting perhaps regarding minors and flight rules, but there are significant questions relating to the main thread outstanding.

H

[andromeda160]

Originally Posted by Haywood_Milton

All interesting perhaps regarding minors and flight rules, but there are significant questions relating to the main thread outstanding.

H

Seems quite clear Mr.Rottman doesn't care to divulge into any further details.

[Welshwatchman]

Master Rottman acted as a broker for this watch?

[Kingface66]

Originally Posted by Welshwatchman

Master Rottman acted as a broker for this watch?

I believe he was the actual seller, as he handed it to him off his wrist.

Luke, I think people here are just confused (understandably) the moment a third party was mentioned (Rob Maron) and then further mentioned by the OP that the watch was refunded by Maron, not you.

And while it may resolved on your end, people can't let a good mystery go! And I think AS buys, sellers, dealers, interested parties, etc. we all follow these kinds of transactions keenly because we ALL participate in them all the time.

And if you, as a dealer, are implicated in a fuzzy transaction...legitimately, or not..surely, it would behoove you to set the record straight for your own sake, yes?

[Wing Zero]

oh man... 16 years old??

This is getting better and better each day

[TimeToGo]

Well for what its worth, folks, - yes - he is a young man. I will not call him a "Kid"... I have met him a couple of times....AND.. he is Pretty darn knowledgeable of vintage watches.

...and yes, when I met him the first time, he was a sales person for RM.

I would not doubt if he has his own inventory and that he would also sell for RM for a commission.

[Micha]

Originally Posted by Wing Zero

oh man... 16 years old??

This is getting better and better each day

x2

[05carbondrz]

All that I know is that if you would have just explained yourself a couple pages back this thread would be dead right now.

[themaninblack]

Hmmm!

[Amme]

Originally Posted by lukerottman

I have a reputation to maintain.

Your reputation reflects your knowledge and business history, which both have been tested in this transaction. Therefore this thread has to stay like a KO loss stays on the sheet for a fighter
Grow a pair and deal with it, learn from it!

[Haywood_Milton]

Is this summary correct?

OP questions the dial of a 6202 that he says he bought from a dealer, who guaranteed that the dial was genuine.

OP : "the watch was purchased from Luke Rottman / Robert Maron and Appraised by Robert Maron of LA."

LR : "Robert Maron NEVER sold you [Jim] anything, ever. And Robert was never part of our deal nor did he ever own this watch!"

OP : "I received the refund from Rob Maron today in full. I would like to commend Rob for taking charge of the incident and effectively resolving the issue in an appropriate manner."

LR : "The refund was out of my pocket."

It is easy to see why people (who may in future have considered doing business with parties involved, for example) might wish to understand the position a little more clearly.

LR, do you do business with / for Robert Maron in some way?

If you were involved in the sale of the watch in any way, what is your opinion of the dial?

HM

[JustinK]

So I went to LR's website and find it curious that the first thing I see is in reference to the settlement of the Mayer vs Maron suit. Basically it's an advertisement of what a good guy Maron is.
I think it's great at 16 LR is following his passion but he leaves us all wondering what his relationship with Maron is. My guess is relative or family friend.

Nice website by the way LR.

[lukerottman]

A reply to all...again...

Yes, I'm 16 years old. I've been doing this for some time now. I'm completely self-made, just to put it out there. I do know Bob quite well (NOT family/a family friend) as he has been, in many ways, a mentor to me. And I did write that article in Bob's favor. Of course. Why? Well, he never sold Mayer a bad watch! ...

Iregardless, he was never part of this deal! You see, that's his company's appraisal of the watch. Not my appraisal! Jim requested this appraisal a couple months after the deal had finalized at the Antique Show in Las Vegas, where I was by Bob's booth, with the 6202 on my wrist.

I do work with Bob at the trade shows/antique shows. Yet I have my own inventory of watches to display. I also set up on my own [under "Luke Rottman/ THE WATCH ADVISER") at certain trade shows, such as the WWT shows.

I was the ONLY seller. Jim was the ONLY buyer. Period. No other parties directly involved in the transaction.

I believed, and still believe the dial is original. The photos posted by Jim weren't the best quality. Looking at the dial with a loupe, the lume plots are clean and appear untouched. The gilt font is--without question--original. Dial is signed "Swiss." The abbsence of "Turn-O-Graph" isn't due to fading. The watch was never born w "Turn-O-Graph" printed on the dial; nonetheless, it encompasses all of the traits of a factory-original, untouched gilt dial. Is it safe to say that not one of us here on the forum knows every single dial/watch that left the Rolex factory? Rolex doesn't even have that insight!We have yet to discover more "impossible" Rolexes--that's why collecting and dealing watches is so magical. It's a learning experience for every one of us.

Can someone PLEASE remove the thread?

[lukerottman]

And to address the first class comments lol...there is no age resriction to fly first class. I've been on first where a couple has taken their kids (prob 4-6 yrs old) w them. And anyone, assuming they're old enough to have a credit or debit card, can book a ticket on an airline.

15+ can travel as unaccompanied minors. Under 15 generally need parental consent--a motorized note--or need to be greeted by a family member at the gate.

[lukerottman]

Posted a response to all your questions with answers. Waiting for the moderator to approve. If response is added, this posting is redundant. If it isn't added, please understand that there is no mystery. I work w Maron at some trade shows, while other trade shows I attend on my own. I have my own inventory and I'm an independent watch dealer. He has been very supportive and encouraging throughout my journey as a young dealer, but he wasn't part of this deal, nor is he part of 99.999% of my other deals.That appraisal was requested by Jim a few months post-sale. I had no involvement in the appraisal other than recommending Bob's company to Jim.

Please remove thread. And I do believe dial is correct. Please refer to my lengthier response in which I go into the details.

[albmich]

You are certainly very well-spoken and knowledgable. I think what is throwing everyone off is that the OP wrote "All. I received the refund from Rob Maron today in full. I would like to commend Rob for taking charge of the incident and effectively resolving the issue in an appropriate manner." There has yet to be an explanation for why he said this because it does not fit the story.

[swish77]

Originally Posted by lukerottman

Posted a response to all your questions with answers. Waiting for the moderator to approve. If response is added, this posting is redundant. If it isn't added, please understand that there is no mystery. I work w Maron at some trade shows, while other trade shows I attend on my own. I have my own inventory and I'm an independent watch dealer. He has been very supportive and encouraging throughout my journey as a young dealer, but he wasn't part of this deal, nor is he part of 99.999% of my other deals.That appraisal was requested by Jim a few months post-sale. I had no involvement in the appraisal other than recommending Bob's company to Jim.

Please remove thread. And I do believe dial is correct. Please refer to my lengthier response in which I go into the details.

Sorry, maybe I missed it somewhere, but if Robert Maron wasn't involved in the deal, other than the appraisal, why was he the one who issued the refund to the OP?

Earlier in this thread, this is what the OP said: "All. I received the refund from Rob Maron today in full. I would like to commend Rob for taking charge of the incident and effectively resolving the issue in an appropriate manner."

Why Maron issued the refund, which has been asked several times in this read, remains a mystery, as far as I can tell.

(Sorry, I see I posted my question at the same time as the post above.)

[Haywood_Milton]

Originally Posted by swish77

Sorry, maybe I missed it somewhere, but if Robert Maron wasn't involved in the deal, other than the appraisal, why was he the one who issued the refund to the OP?

Indeed, and why did the OP have this impression at the outset :

"the watch was purchased from Luke Rottman / Robert Maron and Appraised by Robert Maron of LA" ?

As for the appraisal illustrated, if there is a 6202 that is indeed "all original" and available for $12,000 would someone be so good as to direct me to it?

Will be interested to learn how the 6202 is marketed now.

Glad that LR has managed 100,000 deals in his first three years of trade (ref 99.999% comment).

Of course, if an earlier post was correct and for a while LR was working with RM then perhaps he has in fact completed several hundred thousand transactions in those three years, to maintain that statistic.

It must be very hard to ensure that clients understand LR's independent status when he confirms "I work w Maron at some trade shows," but then perhaps that position could be clarified.

Comforting to have the satisfaction that blog posts / submissions to other media can be read with absolute peace of mind that there is no conflict of interest.

Can't see why anyone has any more questions myself.

H

[wildaxlrose]

Interesting


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[themaninblack]

FWIW I don't think the lume plots on the dial in question look correct at all for an original 6202 dial but I will defer to the opinion of others. Could be one of those rare kind of one-off Rolex dials.

[southtexas]

Originally Posted by albmich

You are certainly very well-spoken and knowledgable. I think what is throwing everyone off is that the OP wrote "All. I received the refund from Rob Maron today in full. I would like to commend Rob for taking charge of the incident and effectively resolving the issue in an appropriate manner." There has yet to be an explanation for why he said this because it does not fit the story.

Correct. It appears this question about the refund, although having been asked repeatedly and directly, is being avoided by LR. Why?

And where is OP?


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[RolexAuthority]

I think the thread should remain why would it be removed it's a legitimate thread with a legitimate bad experience if now every time someone's feelings were hurt a thread was removed there'd be no threads in here toughen up kid

[lukerottman]

when Jim, in writing, agreed to remove this thread (especially ours names), I was planning on sending him a wire. I missed the 1:00 bank wire cutoff at my local bank so I wasn't able to send the wire out that day. Therefore Bob sent the wire on my behalf...wih the reasonable expectation that the thread would have been promptly taken down. And I of course paid Bob. That's why Jim perceived the refund as coming from Bob, even though I told Jim exactly what was transpiring.

And "Toughen up kid"??? What's up with that. My feelings weren't hurt. My reputation was hurt. I want to be a trustworthy dealer who sells honest watches, not some kid with bad rep on forums. I want there to be a watch biz in 20 years, so let me move on and be the good dealer I strive to be.

[Old Expat Beast]

Jim did not "agree to remove this thread", he doesn't have that authority. He agreed to ask me to remove it. I explained to him why it should not be removed, and he was fine with that, and apparently grateful that TRF had helped him get his money recovered. The thread will stay up. There are lessons here for everyone.

[themaninblack]

Originally Posted by Old Expat Beast

There are lessons here for everyone.

Indeed. Including considering the potential issues of conducting business transactions with minors who in many jurisdictions have different contractual obligations and standing to adults and incorporated bodies.

[QueueCumber]