How does new James Bond Rolex choice influence your opinion of 34mm watches?

[Caraptor]

Originally Posted by ArcticMoose

For me personally, the Bond connection is a deterrent to Rolex watches more than a reason to buy them. The 007 Seamaster is one of the cheesiest looking watches of all time, and has forever put me off Omega altogether, regardless of what they may do in the future.

So, what James Bond wears influences my choice about as much as Twilight did regarding my purchase of a Cosmic White C30. (Hint: I bought the car before the movie came out.)

Amen! I'm perfectly happy that Omega became the Bond watch. I'm sure it was a brilliant short-term marketing move that resulted in a ton of sales, but at what long-term cost the brand? Building a sense of exclusivity is one of the keys to luxury goods sales, and happy meal-esque special editions are not the way to do that.

[delldeaton]

Originally Posted by poppydog

... Like the idea of a huge, gold breitling, though.

Well-- since you brought it up, when I interviewed Jeffery Deaver on June 29, along with having him sit for photos exclusive to James Bond Watches, he confirmed that the James Bond Breitling in Carte Blanche is a Breitling for Bentley Motors T Speed.

Image above is of that watch, which also happens to be the one he wore just before his last Carte Blanche speaking engagement in North Carolina. (Specifically not gold, although clearly with other gold jewelry, since gold would have obviously put it well-beyond the price-point stated in the book.)

From 34mm to 48.7mm: Talk about a contrast!

[KarlFr]

Not long ago Deaver was suggesting Bond would be driving Bentley, product placing and publicity stunts and now this thread ?

[delldeaton]

Originally Posted by KarlFr

Not long ago Deaver was suggesting Bond would be driving Bentley, product placing and publicity stunts and now this thread....

Indeed. Here's some foundational instruction (which, by the way, Jeffery Deaver actually cited during his presentation on June 29):

... This is all true Secret Service history that is yet in the higher realm of fantasy, and James Bond’s ventures into this realm are perfectly legitimate. Even so, they would stick in the gullet of the reader and make him throw the book angrily aside — for a reader particularly hates feeling he is being hoaxed — but for two further technical devices, if you like to call them that. First of all, the aforesaid speed of the narrative, which hustles the reader quickly beyond each danger point of mockery and, secondly, the constant use of familiar household names and objects which reassure him that he and the writer have still got their feet on the ground....

A Ranson lighter, a 4½ -litre Bentley with Amherst-Villiers super-charger (please note the solid exactitude), the Ritz Hotel in London, the 21 Club in New York, the exact names of flora and fauna, even James Bond’s Sea Island cotton shirts with short sleeves. All these small details are points de repère to comfort and reassure the reader on his journey into fantastic adventure....

Source: Ian Fleming, "How to Write a Thriller," SHOW magazine, August 1962 (and written while wearing his Rolex 1016 Explorer watch, no doubt).

[Kapture1]

None. I already have first hand experience wearing both 34 and 36mm washes, and IMO, the 34 is way to small for most mens wrist.

[bondtoys]

Originally Posted by KarlFr

Not long ago Deaver was suggesting Bond would be driving Bentley, product placing and publicity stunts and now this thread ?

To be honest if I had the choice, I'd prefer product placing over constant self-quotation and self-promotion including talking about himself in the third person

[Grumpy Badger]

Originally Posted by KarlFr

Not long ago Deaver was suggesting Bond would be driving Bentley, product placing and publicity stunts and now this thread ?

With all due respect to Jeffery Deaver and Bentley Motors, the image of that pic is diametrically opposed to my mental image of Bond...

The car, the pose, the crepe soled shoes, the suit/shirt/tie combo...
I'm well aware Bond is a fictional character but, based on the character traits allotted to him in the Fleming novels, I suspect he might raise an amused eyebrow at that photo!

The Fleming novels worked for me since there was a ring of truth to them. Sure, they were over the top , but Fleming basically WAS Bond...
Mr Deaver may be a decent author but not for Bond novels IMO.

[JacksonStone]

Originally Posted by KarlFr

Ian Fleming and Sean Connery are the originals, the rest is just marketing and copycats in my opinion.

I agree with this as far as the Omega connection goes, which is just shameless product placement. My understanding, though (and correct me if I'm wrong), is that Rolex never authorizes product placement. Therefore, in the Bond movies in which Rolexes appear, it would seem that the choice was influenced by reasons other than Rolex was paying for it. In Dr. No, it was quite organic: Connery was on set and didn't have a watch, so producer Cubby Broccoli took off his own Sub and had Connery put it on.

As for the original question, current Bond novels have no influence on me. (That goes double after seeing that pic of Deaver.) I am academically interested to see what's in the movies, but in the end, I buy what I like. 34mm is too small for me. I prefer 39 - 41mm ideally.

[f16570]

34mm to small for me, bit that is just a personnel preference.

[delldeaton]

Originally Posted by Grumpy Badger

With all due respect to Jeffery Deaver and Bentley Motors, the image of that pic is diametrically opposed to my mental image of Bond....

Hmm, I dunno. Seems like this gets kinda close to a line of courtesy we'd all do well to stay safely this side of in our TRF discussions.

We are indeed, talking about a fictional character. And actors who do great and not always great jobs or bringing that to the silver screen. And, more particularly, who continue on with that in writing - which is a very different (for plus and minus) medium. Some enjoy that; I'm among them. Some don't, and that's okay.

But, let's face it, this sort of "role playing" - including by authors who are great writers, but maybe don't shoot well, don't womanize, don't smoke 70 cigarettes a day - goes with the gig.

In posing for the photo below, don't you think Ian Fleming, himself, was more aware than anyone that he was well-past the 40-year-old upper limit he'd originally suggested for James Bond a decade earlier? That the Bentley in which he was posing hardly represented what his Agent 007 of that day would have been driving, even as an older car?

Having been in the audience when Mr Deaver made his last presentation, I laughed with the crowd when he referred to Daniel Craig's new marriage, suggesting that if that somehow disqualified the actor for "Bond 23," that he, Jeffery Deaver, was available.

Deaver laughed as he said it. If there isn't something fun about all this, why the heck are we here?

So, smile. Enjoy. Be nice.

Now: Back to the arguments pro and con of the 34mm Rolex in Carte Blanche, coupled with inevitable invitations to re-open discussions of the established fact that the literary James Bond watch in On Her Majesty's Secret Service was none other than a Rolex reference 1016 Explorer.

[Grumpy Badger]

Originally Posted by delldeaton

Hmm, I dunno. Seems like this gets kinda close to a line of courtesy we'd all do well to stay safely this side of in our TRF discussions.

No foul, I have my own mental image of the literary Bond, and that ain't it.

Deaver laughed as he said it. If there isn't something fun about all this, why the heck are we here?

Now this I wholeheartedly agree with!

Now: Back to the arguments pro and con of the 34mm Rolex in Carte Blanche, coupled with inevitable invitations to re-open discussions of the established fact that the literary James Bond watch in On Her Majesty's Secret Service was none other than a Rolex reference 1016 Explorer.

As you quoted Flemings advice to authors on his descriptive detail why did he not state in the novels that Bond wore a 1016 if he didn't intend the watch to be enigmatic?
He tells us the exact make, model, year, colour etc of the Bentley, right down to which coach builder made the bodywork and who made the supercharger...

[bondtoys]

Originally Posted by delldeaton

of the established fact that the literary James Bond watch in On Her Majesty's Secret Service was none other than a Rolex reference 1016 Explorer.

The only person, who "established" this "fact" is yourself.

[JacksonStone]

Originally Posted by delldeaton

Hmm, I dunno. Seems like this gets kinda close to a line of courtesy we'd all do well to stay safely this side of in our TRF discussions.

Seemed like a perfectly appropriate comment to me. Nobody made Deaver pose in that picture.

[delldeaton]

Originally Posted by Grumpy Badger

As you quoted Flemings advice to authors on his descriptive detail why did he not state in the novels that Bond wore a 1016 if he didn't intend the watch to be enigmatic?
He tells us the exact make, model, year, colour etc of the Bentley, right down to which coach builder made the bodywork and who made the supercharger...

The short answer to your question is that this is how BW Goodden referenced the Rolex in his original recommendation. The complete, necessarily longer answer is provided through my WatchTime and NAWCC Bulletin articles.

Originally Posted by JacksonStone

Seemed like a perfectly appropriate comment to me. Nobody made Deaver pose in that picture.

Sounds like you have more information than I do: If this photo wasn't set up as part of a book promotion, where he might, indeed, have been under some sort of obligation to "pose," then I'd be hard pressed to image why else it would have been done.

Regardless, we'll have to agree to disagree. You can like or dislike the book on its merits, personal opinion, or whatever. But I don't think the fact that there's a picture posted her on TRF constitutes an invitation to make unkind comments about the person.

That's all. I'm not here to argue.

[Dweller of the Sea]

I really don´t care about the new book and the authors choise.

There is only one author of James Bond books- Ian Fleming.

The rest is not for me.
An artist can paint a perfect Picasso, but it doesn´t make it a real Picasso.

[KarlFr]

Originally Posted by Dweller of the Sea

I really don´t care about the new book and the authors choise.

There is only one author of James Bond books- Ian Fleming.

The rest is not for me.
An artist can paint a perfect Picasso, but it doesn´t make it a real Picasso.

+1

[Grumpy Badger]

Originally Posted by delldeaton

The short answer to your question is that this is how BW Goodden referenced the Rolex in his original recommendation. The complete, necessarily longer answer is provided through my WatchTime and NAWCC Bulletin articles.


Sounds like you have more information than I do: If this photo wasn't set up as part of a book promotion, where he might, indeed, have been under some sort of obligation to "pose," then I'd be hard pressed to image why else it would have been done.

Regardless, we'll have to agree to disagree. You can like or dislike the book on its merits, personal opinion, or whatever. But I don't think the fact that there's a picture posted her on TRF constitutes an invitation to make unkind comments about the person.

That's all. I'm not here to argue.

I'm afraid that doesn't answer my question. The fact that that was the model recommended doesn't mean that it's the one Fleming went with. A recommendation was made that Bonds beretta pistol was inappropriate and Fleming made a point of changing it and describing the make and calibre of the replacement in detail. Not so his wristwatch.

I must say I take umbrage at you calling my comments on the photo "unkind". I merely said they didn't tie in with my mental image. You glossed over my feeling that the car was inappropriate... Did you not think I was being "unkind" to bentley?
My comments on Mr Deavers dress I think were appropriate since the character of Bond was a snob and did, in the novels, judge people (often harshly) by their taste in clothes, cars, etc...

I am equally sure that Mr Deaver will sleep soundly in his bed despite my opinions on his shoes, aided no doubt by the royalty cheques piling into his bank account from what is, undeniably, a very popular novel.

[JacksonStone]

Originally Posted by delldeaton

Regardless, we'll have to agree to disagree....But I don't think the fact that there's a picture posted her on TRF constitutes an invitation to make unkind comments about the person.

I am all for agreeing to disagree, but that becomes a bit of a challenge when you want to keep expressing why you think you're right.

[delldeaton]

Originally Posted by JacksonStone

I am all for agreeing to disagree, but that becomes a bit of a challenge when you want to keep expressing why you think you're right.

It wasn't my intent to perpetuate anything; I'm sorry if I came across that way.

[JacksonStone]

Originally Posted by JacksonStone

In Dr. No, it was quite organic: Connery was on set and didn't have a watch, so producer Cubby Broccoli took off his own Sub and had Connery put it on.

I decided to look this up again to make sure I was remembering correctly. I got most of it right, but was off slightly in the timing of it.

"According to the book James Bond the Legacy (John Cork and Bruce Scivally, Boxtree 2002, IBSN 0-8109-3296-2), [...w]hen Rolex declined to provide one of their watches to the production and the film’s budget did not allow for the purchase of one, Cubby Broccoli took the one off his wrist and gave it to a member of the art department for use in the film. That Rolex was a Submariner with a very large crown, no crown guards, a coin edge bezel and a black crocodile strap."

[Ed Rooney]

Originally Posted by Grumpy Badger

With all due respect to Jeffery Deaver and Bentley Motors, the image of that pic is diametrically opposed to my mental image of Bond...

The car, the pose, the crepe soled shoes, the suit/shirt/tie combo...
I'm well aware Bond is a fictional character but, based on the character traits allotted to him in the Fleming novels, I suspect he might raise an amused eyebrow at that photo!

The Fleming novels worked for me since there was a ring of truth to them. Sure, they were over the top , but Fleming basically WAS Bond...
Mr Deaver may be a decent author but not for Bond novels IMO.

Looks like he bought that suit at Kohls.

Are those Rockport shoes?

[RolexPete32]

I already wear an air-king most of the time

[delldeaton]

From both WIS and James Bond perspectives, there was a great interview with Jeffery Deaver on MSNBC last Friday that ties directly to this TRF thread. And a little bit more.

Approximately 10% of this is focused on watches, with Rolex and Breitling mentioned by name. Where do we ever see that sort of mainstream attention, and detail, outside of stories where wristwatches are the main focus?

The screen capture above, then link to video you can watch for free online, is the Dylan Ratigan Show, hosted July 8, 2011, by Matt Miller. If memory serves, Jeffery Deaver was in New York that day in connection with another project, but this piece is exclusively focused on Carte Blanche.

The lead-in context was Ian Fleming's pioneering use of brand names to advance plot lines in his 007 books. Bentley, Breitling, and Rolex were then mentioned as applied to Carte Blanche; but the James Bond watches really dominate content-wise.

Approximately 4:52 is where this part starts.

Much as I'm gratified to see the ongoing and increasing attention on James Bond watches, I think it's great in general to be getting this sort of visibility - and more than just by way of passing reference - via increasing media channels!

[JacksonStone]

Thanks for the link, Dell. Interesting interview. I was wondering, "Who is Deaver that he can just start writing about Bond?" Now I know. I also thought it was funny he used a Breitling for Bentley when he needed a gaudy watch for Bond to wear. Indeed, those things are massive, and quite blingy, even in stainless. But did you say Deaver was actually wearing one for one of his speaking engagements? That's a bit ironic. Some people can pull them off better than others, though. Maybe he can. Personally, I can't wear them; they're far too huge for my narrow wrist.

[CKLinLA]

I have always been confused as to whether the James Bond character
is
- Someone who is knowledgeable and impeccable (and conformist) in his
taste for all things luxurious and refined ....., or
- A working class Brit who has a strong sense of what he himself prefers
and does what he wants.

In anycase, the Perpetual dates are truly classic and beautiful.

[TheWatchFiend]

Originally Posted by JacksonStone

I agree with this as far as the Omega connection goes, which is just shameless product placement. My understanding, though (and correct me if I'm wrong), is that Rolex never authorizes product placement. Therefore, in the Bond movies in which Rolexes appear, it would seem that the choice was influenced by reasons other than Rolex was paying for it. In Dr. No, it was quite organic: Connery was on set and didn't have a watch, so producer Cubby Broccoli took off his own Sub and had Connery put it on.

I thought that too. But I was watching either Live and Let Die or The Man With The Golden Gun not too long ago, and in the end credits, EON thanked Rolex. Now why would they thank Rolex unless Rolex did something for them? I have seen Roger Moore wearing a Rolex Submariner on his wrist in his day to day life, so I was thinking that one of the watches in those movies was really his, or maybe Rolex really did pay for product placement in one of those movies. Why else would EON thank Rolex? I have no idea. I'm just suggesting it's possible that Rolex was involved in the production in some way based on the end credits. I guess I should go check the end credits of the earlier films and see if they thanked Rolex too, which I don't ever recall them doing, just to make a comparison. I'm sure someone on here knows more about this than me.

[JacksonStone]

Originally Posted by TheWatchFiend

Now why would they thank Rolex unless Rolex did something for them?

I'm just theorizing off the top of my head, but maybe we need to draw a distinction between authorizing product placement and actually paying for it. It's possible Rolex supplied the watches in those movies, without paying for Moore to wear them. Or perhaps EON thanked Rolex for allowing them to mess with the watch; the Sub in Live and Let Die has a gadget feature, whereas in The Man With the Golden Gun, it's just a watch. With Dr. No, Bond was an untested commodity, so perhaps Rolex couldn't have cared less what Connery wore in the movie. By the time of the Moore Bonds, the movies were clearly a cash cow, and even if Rolex wouldn't pay to put their products in it, perhaps they were still happy to supply their products so they could appear in the movies. Interestingly, this pretty much ground to a halt starting with The Spy Who Loved Me. Some speculate that's because Seiko started paying EON for placement. That's clearly what Omega is doing now, even taking it to the level of full-blown product licensing. Thankfully Rolex never went down that road. Could you imagine the 007 Edition Submariner?

On a related note, even if we can accept the argument Rolex doesn't pay for product placement, they are no stranger to the paid celebrity ambassador. Their website is replete with them. Rolex understands the value of good publicity, and still works it, even if they do so more subtly than other brands.

[TheWatchFiend]

[QUOTE=JacksonStone;2607933] Could you imagine the 007 Edition Submariner?QUOTE]

AH! No! The horror! Yea, I don't know why Rolex is credited, maybe they supplied a watch or two. I think it's a sure thing they didn't have anything to do with the earlier movies based on what is already known. I just happened to watch a Roger Moore James Bond movie recently and saw the credit and was surprised knowing what little they had to do with James Bond from their end. In any case, I thought it was interesting to speculate.

[JacksonStone]

Originally Posted by TheWatchFiend

I just happened to watch a Roger Moore James Bond movie recently and saw the credit and was surprised knowing what little they had to do with James Bond from their end. In any case, I thought it was interesting to speculate.

I've been watching the Bond films in reverse order and just watched The Man With the Golden Gun last night. I didn't pay attention to the credits, but I'll go back and see if there's a mention. Live and Let Die will be in the next few nights, and I'll check that, too.

[TheWatchFiend]

Originally Posted by JacksonStone

I've been watching the Bond films in reverse order and just watched The Man With the Golden Gun last night. I didn't pay attention to the credits, but I'll go back and see if there's a mention. Live and Let Die will be in the next few nights, and I'll check that, too.

Ok, I just watched the end credits of Live and Let Die on youtube, and Rolex, Inc is indeed "acknowledged for their assistance and cooperation." Here is the link if interested. It's at about 28 seconds. Am I allowed to add a link like this here? I hope, if not I'll delete it. Sorry, I'm still a newbie to these forums.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9cW8kE6XcxE