The Tudor Black-Bay ancestor

[arexander]

My BBB has found his granddaddy thanks to you!

[bdex75]

Originally Posted by tanzer208

To late they already changed the whole bezel insert and cant get the old one back from rolex they are sorry i thought they would just put in a pearl for 85 dollars !!! not !!!

My heart was just ripped out.

I am sure it will look great, but my gosh.


On a lighter note I am hopeful that the wife will get me the Tudor book for Christmas but it is an expensive bugger. But hours of leisure reading.


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[Tessabreton]

Hi, sorry if I finish in Off Topic, I am the owner of this minisub ref. serial B527xxx 75090 year 1993, sapphire glass and for this reference I read that would be made of plexiglas.
Can anyone tell me if it is correct I was replaced later?
Thank you

[Blue Lantern]

Originally Posted by Tessabreton

Hi, sorry if I finish in Off Topic, I am the owner of this minisub ref. serial B527xxx 75090 year 1993, sapphire glass and for this reference I read that would be made of plexiglas.
Can anyone tell me if it is correct I was replaced later?
Thank you

Off topic but this is an interesting topic! Generally it's accepted that 75090 = plexi and 75190 = sapphire. However, others on the forum have posted their 75090's with sapphire. It's possible that there was a transition period between the 2 references.

[Boxoldnn]

Wanted to add mine to this thread for those interested. Originally purchased by my father in Honolulu, got it back from servicing a little while ago :)

[Spectre007]

Originally Posted by TAG_TOSSER

Hello guys, I'm going to update this thread about round marker snowflake subs and add mine to your count.
It has the same serial number range as mine is 887XXX.
I found a beautiful example that needed little repair. I sent it to Mr Dominique Wieland for an overhaul. The only things that got replaced were the crystal, crown and tube. I left the case unpolished. I also have the original box, receipt and warranty document.
I am very happy with this and it's by far my favorite Snowflake sub I've owned. And so far it's +3 seconds/7 days since serviced.

Before service-


That looks great!

Movement, it's 25 rubies-



And after-

That looks really great!

[watchthisway]

the info in this thread is why i love this forum.

i have my own story about how i recently came into possession of one of these rare examples. pics attached.

i had always heard that barn finds could be found in pawn shops, but never actually went to one. well that changed when i decided to go visit one near my work at lunch.

i had a good feeling about the place as i had previously found the shop on craigslist when they advertised a used rolex sub, at what i recalled was a very fair price.

so i walk in and a a nice older lady helps me. i ask her if they have any vintage watches. she's like: "you like vintage watches, heh?" and leads me toward the back of the shop. there, she shows me 2 watches. one is a vintage breitling that i knew upon first glance was too small for my wrist. the other watch was this tudor...

i knew within 5 secs of seeing the watch that i was going to buy it.

the dial on the watch looked great. i couldn't see any defects as far as i could tell. the case looked to be in original vintage condition. maybe polished but i'm no expert on those sort of things.

the caseback was the one negative-- it had a bunch of dents and scratches. i couldn't figure out how it could get so damaged...until i read this thread which now i'm learning was common for these military watches because the cases were used as hammers?! incredible.

the last thing that sealed the deal for me was the serial number. it is 88888x. literally one sequential number away from being an infinity tudor.

the woman quoted me a price that was about 500 off the sticker. not a steal but i would say a very fair non-dealer price. and i walked out the store with the watch probably 30 mins after i entered it with my newest acquisition.

[yasser15]

Hello all,

Thinking of picking up this watch from a local dealer but I am having an issue with the authenticity of the dial. I am not sure if it is an original dial, replacement dial or even aftermarket. Can anyone shed some light on this. I would really appreciate any feedback.

[yasser15]

Here is a better picture.

[jbro352]

Fascinating history, thanks for sharing


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[scotiasteve74]

Beautiful!

[TAG_TOSSER]

Originally Posted by watchthisway

the info in this thread is why i love this forum.

i have my own story about how i recently came into possession of one of these rare examples. pics attached.

i had always heard that barn finds could be found in pawn shops, but never actually went to one. well that changed when i decided to go visit one near my work at lunch.

i had a good feeling about the place as i had previously found the shop on craigslist when they advertised a used rolex sub, at what i recalled was a very fair price.

so i walk in and a a nice older lady helps me. i ask her if they have any vintage watches. she's like: "you like vintage watches, heh?" and leads me toward the back of the shop. there, she shows me 2 watches. one is a vintage breitling that i knew upon first glance was too small for my wrist. the other watch was this tudor...

i knew within 5 secs of seeing the watch that i was going to buy it.

the dial on the watch looked great. i couldn't see any defects as far as i could tell. the case looked to be in original vintage condition. maybe polished but i'm no expert on those sort of things.

the caseback was the one negative-- it had a bunch of dents and scratches. i couldn't figure out how it could get so damaged...until i read this thread which now i'm learning was common for these military watches because the cases were used as hammers?! incredible.

the last thing that sealed the deal for me was the serial number. it is 88888x. literally one sequential number away from being an infinity tudor.

the woman quoted me a price that was about 500 off the sticker. not a steal but i would say a very fair non-dealer price. and i walked out the store with the watch probably 30 mins after i entered it with my newest acquisition.

INCREDIBLE!!!
Love the story and very jealous!

I need to visit some shops....

[roguy]

Love the bezel colour. Looks much better than the ones on the new BB but i gotta say, they are both beautiful :D

[SAAS]

Originally Posted by watchthisway

the info in this thread is why i love this forum.

i have my own story about how i recently came into possession of one of these rare examples. pics attached.

i had always heard that barn finds could be found in pawn shops, but never actually went to one. well that changed when i decided to go visit one near my work at lunch.

i had a good feeling about the place as i had previously found the shop on craigslist when they advertised a used rolex sub, at what i recalled was a very fair price.

so i walk in and a a nice older lady helps me. i ask her if they have any vintage watches. she's like: "you like vintage watches, heh?" and leads me toward the back of the shop. there, she shows me 2 watches. one is a vintage breitling that i knew upon first glance was too small for my wrist. the other watch was this tudor...

i knew within 5 secs of seeing the watch that i was going to buy it.

the dial on the watch looked great. i couldn't see any defects as far as i could tell. the case looked to be in original vintage condition. maybe polished but i'm no expert on those sort of things.

the caseback was the one negative-- it had a bunch of dents and scratches. i couldn't figure out how it could get so damaged...until i read this thread which now i'm learning was common for these military watches because the cases were used as hammers?! incredible.

the last thing that sealed the deal for me was the serial number. it is 88888x. literally one sequential number away from being an infinity tudor.

the woman quoted me a price that was about 500 off the sticker. not a steal but i would say a very fair non-dealer price. and i walked out the store with the watch probably 30 mins after i entered it with my newest acquisition.

Congrats great story

[snowflake]

A video on Tudor vintage watches by Hodinkee suggests that the idea of Black Bay in red came from a submariner prototype with a red bezel insert. An interesting aspect is that this dial says "Tudor Geneve - Automatic" without "Submariner". Has anyone seen Tudor subs without "Submariner" printed on the dial?

[james226]

verrryyy good stuff

[james226]

Push! Push!

[Gina Marie]

Just picked one up. Cool watch. 891xxx

[SAAS]

Originally Posted by Gina Marie

Just picked one up. Cool watch. 891xxx

Congrats! Great to see this thread still going and more examples surfacing.

[J. W. Hall]

Love these!


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[CantStop]

Gorgeous

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[as646]

I think I've fallen in love with these.

I'm actually found a 94110 on some local classifieds, could anyone give me a rough idea of what a reasonable price to pay would be? Searching through the price of others that have sold online, it seems to wildly vary in value, largely based on what I assume to be primarily patina and condition. Frankly my eyes are not discerning enough to identify a good one when I see it, so I defer to the experts here.

Unfortunately I have no posts yet, so cannot post links, but images can be found here: imgur[dot]com/a/Sadrw

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

[klchow]

Rare and beautiful watch.

[Gina Marie]

Originally Posted by as646

I think I've fallen in love with these.

I'm actually found a 94110 on some local classifieds, could anyone give me a rough idea of what a reasonable price to pay would be? Searching through the price of others that have sold online, it seems to wildly vary in value, largely based on what I assume to be primarily patina and condition. Frankly my eyes are not discerning enough to identify a good one when I see it, so I defer to the experts here.

Unfortunately I have no posts yet, so cannot post links, but images can be found here: imgur[dot]com/a/Sadrw

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Looks nice. Pics are not the greatest. Case is polished. Hands look replaced since they really don't match at all. Does come with a bracelet. Which is nice. I would think between 5.5 to7k usd....depending on how it looks in person.

[DirtyHarrie]

Originally Posted by as646

I think I've fallen in love with these.

I'm actually found a 94110 on some local classifieds, could anyone give me a rough idea of what a reasonable price to pay would be? Searching through the price of others that have sold online, it seems to wildly vary in value, largely based on what I assume to be primarily patina and condition. Frankly my eyes are not discerning enough to identify a good one when I see it, so I defer to the experts here.

Unfortunately I have no posts yet, so cannot post links, but images can be found here: imgur[dot]com/a/Sadrw

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

In all honesty, it looks like a franken of some kind. The bezel edge isn't right for the watch. The caseback is much too bubbled. The crown guards aren't right for a 7021/94110. And the crown looks way too wide.

I would avoid the watch.

[theotse]

Looks beautiful! Loving the aged dial.

[shaspar]

Nice Tudor.

[Wembleyisgreen]

Originally Posted by michel33

Hello fellow WiS, I'm now the proud owner of the Black-Bay ancestor, a 94010 Submariner originally issued with this stunning dial/hands combo for only one year, every known examples throughout the world (a very few watches) being in the 8.8/beginning of the 8.9XXX serial range number.


This very small 94010 batch is now well documented in the "Tudor Anthology Book" edited by Mondani as you can see hereafter.

I remember that when the first examples emerged, from different world areas, many of us were skeptical about this dial/hands combo on a 94010 Submariner.

Many thought that this could only be a swap between dials/hands done by watchmakers during the watch services.

However, too many facts were conclusive:

- The serial range of these specific examples, as said above.

- But above all, the fact that this specific dial with rectangular stick markers at 3, 6 and 9 O'clock was only fitted on the previous Tudor Submariner model, the 7016 Submariner.
If the 94010 Submariner also featured from 1980 to 1983 a round markers dial, it was with triangular 3, 6 and 9 markers only (see picture).

-And the ultimate proof is that these two dials are not interchangeable at all, as some people suggested, for the simple reason that the two models feature different ETA movements (2776 ETA for the 94010 Submariner and the 2483 ETA for the 7016 Submariner), which require that the feet of the dial are not positioned at the same place for each model!!!

Thus it is impossible to fit a 7016 (3, 6 and 9 "stick markers") dial instead of a Snowflake 94010 dial as previously envisaged by some skeptical fellows.
No need to say that the specific 7016 Submariner round markers (that was furthermore discontinued) cannot have been modified by local watchmakers throughout the world for watches that are all in the same serial number range….. (And as the regular triangular 3,6 9 stick markers round dial was easily available…).

- Another piece of evidence came from a Canadian Navy member who found four Tudor issued Tudor Submariners (though not engraved) in an old box in his naval base, one of them being a round markers dial/Snowflake hands 94010 Submariner once again in the same serial number range.

My new baby:


The article on this very limited issued Tudor 94040 Sub in the "Tudor Anthology Book":


The Canadian Navy 94010 round markers dial/Snowflake hands:


The specific triangular 3, 6, 9 stick markers of the 94010 round dial:

Lovely redish bezel

[smithassignment1]

Wow this is a great collection.

[tudorbaja27]

Awesome!