AD’s attitudes

[Neil McCauley]

Originally Posted by JonnyOld Boy

It's not just the Rolex brand that has suffered from insufferable snootiness and snobbish behaviour from Sales people. I think the whole industry for mid-to-high end watches has become an often unpleasant place to shop in. I am genuinely perplexed by anyone with a shred of self respect, who cares less about a "relationship" with an AD and cringes and fawns just to get a mass produced item of no real exclusivity. If I ever buy another luxury watch, I doubt it will be new from an AD ,, [ unless it's one of the more straight-and-narrow brands like Breitling etc etc ].
There is no way I am going to waste my time grovelling to get on some radar of a salesman in a cheap suit, smelling of indifferent aftershave, just so I "might" get a watch.
Of course I appreciate the tales of some folk on here tell a tale that is more positive and watches are got without bending over and selling your innocence, but there is too much snobbery and unpleasantness around and WoS in the UK indeed have staff that are insufferable.

Read back through the responses in this thread, Jonny; nobody is grovelling, cringing or fawning.

Only the people who sound grumpy, miserable, or jaded say that people who have a good experience are doing that.

Too many people have too high of an opinion of themselves, and think they are above going to speak to someone who works in a shop. "Get on some radar of a salesman in a cheap suit, smelling of indifferent aftershave" Is there a reason you hate these salespeople so much? Which one hurt you?

Lastly - you've said you wont be buying from an AD next, and that there is no way you're going waste your time... why bother even letting us know about that? or is it just to make you feel better about it? I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that you've not even bought a watch from an AD in the last 10 years and aren't even positioned to have an opinion in this, and you're just on the "embittered AD hating bandwagon".

EDIT: Turns out I'm right... out of all 29 of Jonnys posts, at least 45% of them are moaning about the "process" of buying a Rolex. Blithering on about self respect and whinging about people "pretending to be interested in sales people's lives". Make of that what you will, folks.

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by Neil McCauley

Indeed, and I imagine myself, as a tourist, received mostly the higher end of that scale!

And your British accent perhaps. You folks always sound smarter than us

[Kevin of Larchmont]

Originally Posted by JonnyOld Boy

It's not just the Rolex brand that has suffered from insufferable snootiness and snobbish behaviour from Sales people. I think the whole industry for mid-to-high end watches has become an often unpleasant place to shop in. I am genuinely perplexed by anyone with a shred of self respect, who cares less about a "relationship" with an AD and cringes and fawns just to get a mass produced item of no real exclusivity. If I ever buy another luxury watch, I doubt it will be new from an AD ,, [ unless it's one of the more straight-and-narrow brands like Breitling etc etc ].
There is no way I am going to waste my time grovelling to get on some radar of a salesman in a cheap suit, smelling of indifferent aftershave, just so I "might" get a watch.
Of course I appreciate the tales of some folk on here tell a tale that is more positive and watches are got without bending over and selling your innocence, but there is too much snobbery and unpleasantness around and WoS in the UK indeed have staff that are insufferable.

How exactly has the Rolex brand suffered? Are cases now full of unsold discounted watches? And how is a Rolex watch an item of no real exclusivity when you still can’t walk into an AD and walk out with the one that you want? For some of us it’s no work at all being friendly while others go to great lengths to build a narrative about why being friendly is weak while at the same time complaining that people aren’t friendly to them.

This drama is tiresome.

[ArtNouveau]

Originally Posted by Neil McCauley

As is Rolex UK Ltd

I don't see your point?

For the record RolexUSA really is different from most if not all countries around the world. Our federal anti-trust laws dating back to the last century were set up to prevent monopolies. It requires an arms’ length separation between manufacturers and their distributors.
It is most evident in the way foreign automobiles are distributed here but also shows up in luxury product supply chains such as Rolex. RolexUSA is therefore more autonomous than in most countries. How that relates to enduser relationships is debatable but I only know how it has worked for me over an almost 40 year buying history. In the 80’s almost every small town in the US had a mom and pop jeweler that carried Rolex. A quick glance at the US store locater page will show that most dealers are now in bigger cities and there are vast Rolex “deserts” with only a handful of ADs in some states.
I enjoy reading the experiences here from an international membership but I only go by what US posters say when it comes to RSC or AD rules.

[bluestreak]

Originally Posted by Neil McCauley

Read back through the responses in this thread, Jonny; nobody is grovelling, cringing or fawning.

Only the people who sound grumpy, miserable, or jaded say that people who have a good experience are doing that.

Too many people have too high of an opinion of themselves, and think they are above going to speak to someone who works in a shop. "Get on some radar of a salesman in a cheap suit, smelling of indifferent aftershave" Is there a reason you hate these salespeople so much? Which one hurt you?

Lastly - you've said you wont be buying from an AD next, and that there is no way you're going waste your time... why bother even letting us know about that? or is it just to make you feel better about it? I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that you've not even bought a watch from an AD in the last 10 years and aren't even positioned to have an opinion in this, and you're just on the "embittered AD hating bandwagon".

EDIT: Turns out I'm right... out of all 29 of Jonnys posts, at least 45% of them are moaning about the "process" of buying a Rolex. Blithering on about self respect and whinging about people "pretending to be interested in sales people's lives". Make of that what you will, folks.

I think there are a lot of people who can’t get a watch, and have convinced themselves that if they can’t one, the people that do must be stupid, or subservient, or obsequious, pick your adjective.

Because it has to be that way. It can’t be something about them, can it?


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[KatGirl]

The reality is that demand is still greater than supply, and you must have patience. I started my relationship with my AD exactly 2 years ago. I decided I wanted an Op 36 silver, first because it was different from the rest, with its gold accents, and it has such a classic appearance. I was always assured they were working on it, and it did take a full year. My second AD watch was my Wimbledon TT, where I just got very lucky, and was offered it, when someone else turned down his allocation, while I was visiting my AD. That was 8 months after the first watch. Now, I am awaiting a third watch, an Explorer 36. I’ve been assured by the store Mgr. that he will get it for me, sooner, rather than later. I don’t have any way of knowing whether my journey is typical, or not. I do know my AD seems to like me, and want to get me what I want. I would love to walk into a store and just buy the Rolex I want, but that’s not reality, and I understand there is some waiting involved. Somebody here asked if I’m a VIP. Nope! Just a retired RN, who loves nice watches. My obvious enthusiasm for watches, in general, and Rolex in particular, might work in my favor, but I’m nobody special. Just being my usual friendly, outgoing, direct self is what has worked for me. The people who say they refuse to play the AD games, and would rather pay more for a used watch perplex me. If their first encounter at an AD was met with rudeness, or snootiness, they should try another AD. I think these people just lack patience.

Kat


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[racerx]

Originally Posted by KatGirl

The reality is that demand is still greater than supply, and you must have patience. I started my relationship with my AD exactly 2 years ago. I decided I wanted an Op 36 silver, first because it was different from the rest, with its gold accents, and it has such a classic appearance. I was always assured they were working on it, and it did take a full year. My second AD watch was my Wimbledon TT, where I just got very lucky, and was offered it, when someone else turned down his allocation, while I was visiting my AD. That was 8 months after the first watch. Now, I am awaiting a third watch, an Explorer 36. I’ve been assured by the store Mgr. that he will get it for me, sooner, rather than later. I don’t have any way of knowing whether my journey is typical, or not. I do know my AD seems to like me, and want to get me what I want. I would love to walk into a store and just buy the Rolex I want, but that’s not reality, and I understand there is some waiting involved. Somebody here asked if I’m a VIP. Nope! Just a retired RN, who loves nice watches. My obvious enthusiasm for watches, in general, and Rolex in particular, might work in my favor, but I’m nobody special. Just being my usual friendly, outgoing, direct self is what has worked for me. The people who say they refuse to play the AD games, and would rather pay more for a used watch perplex me. If their first encounter at an AD was met with rudeness, or snootiness, they should try another AD. I think these people just lack patience.

Kat


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Very well said!!

[123Blueface]

Why is basic economics Demand and Supply so hard to understand?
Why is an AD catering to their best customers so hard to understand?
Why is a business using an item in high demand with less stock than demand looking to maximize sales using this in demand item as bait to bundle with less in demand items difficult to understand?

As a customer who has a very high spending history with my AD, I have zero issues getting whatever I have ever asked for. I’m sure there are references I’ll never be offered but they are items I’ll never ask for to begin with.
I’m in an affluent market where many have spent more than me and the most I have ever waited is 3 years for a blue dial sky dweller my son purchased. White dial Daytona a year, black dial Daytona six months. Everything else, a couple of months at most. I have never bought anything I did not want.
Patience is a virtue and often rewarded.

My AD is owned by WOS, Mayors. Loved by as many as it is hated by. Not hard to figure out which side of the fence I fall on.

[Kevin of Larchmont]

Amen.

[Krash]

Originally Posted by 123Blueface

Why is basic economics Demand and Supply so hard to understand?

Good question. Supply and demand is one of the easiest theories to learn in college. Economics 101. You would expect TRF subscribers to have a good grip on it. But for some, it’s apparently as difficult as quantum mechanics, which is arguably the hardest class to master.


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[fsprow]

Originally Posted by KatGirl

The reality is that demand is still greater than supply, and you must have patience. I started my relationship with my AD exactly 2 years ago. I decided I wanted an Op 36 silver, first because it was different from the rest, with its gold accents, and it has such a classic appearance. I was always assured they were working on it, and it did take a full year. My second AD watch was my Wimbledon TT, where I just got very lucky, and was offered it, when someone else turned down his allocation, while I was visiting my AD. That was 8 months after the first watch. Now, I am awaiting a third watch, an Explorer 36. I’ve been assured by the store Mgr. that he will get it for me, sooner, rather than later. I don’t have any way of knowing whether my journey is typical, or not. I do know my AD seems to like me, and want to get me what I want. I would love to walk into a store and just buy the Rolex I want, but that’s not reality, and I understand there is some waiting involved. Somebody here asked if I’m a VIP. Nope! Just a retired RN, who loves nice watches. My obvious enthusiasm for watches, in general, and Rolex in particular, might work in my favor, but I’m nobody special. Just being my usual friendly, outgoing, direct self is what has worked for me. The people who say they refuse to play the AD games, and would rather pay more for a used watch perplex me. If their first encounter at an AD was met with rudeness, or snootiness, they should try another AD. I think these people just lack patience.

Kat


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Kat is one of those annoying people who summarize the matter clearly and draws a logical conclusion without insulting anyone. She should therefore not be on the web.

[Stupot]

Originally Posted by KatGirl

The reality is that demand is still greater than supply, and you must have patience. I started my relationship with my AD exactly 2 years ago. I decided I wanted an Op 36 silver, first because it was different from the rest, with its gold accents, and it has such a classic appearance. I was always assured they were working on it, and it did take a full year. My second AD watch was my Wimbledon TT, where I just got very lucky, and was offered it, when someone else turned down his allocation, while I was visiting my AD. That was 8 months after the first watch. Now, I am awaiting a third watch, an Explorer 36. I’ve been assured by the store Mgr. that he will get it for me, sooner, rather than later. I don’t have any way of knowing whether my journey is typical, or not. I do know my AD seems to like me, and want to get me what I want. I would love to walk into a store and just buy the Rolex I want, but that’s not reality, and I understand there is some waiting involved. Somebody here asked if I’m a VIP. Nope! Just a retired RN, who loves nice watches. My obvious enthusiasm for watches, in general, and Rolex in particular, might work in my favor, but I’m nobody special. Just being my usual friendly, outgoing, direct self is what has worked for me. The people who say they refuse to play the AD games, and would rather pay more for a used watch perplex me. If their first encounter at an AD was met with rudeness, or snootiness, they should try another AD. I think these people just lack patience.

Kat


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This is quite an interesting thread, although I’m finding it quite frustrating, as I get where the OP is coming from, but seeing a lot of you misinterpreting it.

I’m quoting Kat, but I am not aiming this at you, so please don’t read any tone into this, I just think everyone seems to be slightly missing the point of the OP’s original gripe.

I’ll say this again.

The OP is UK based.

The recent comments mostly aren’t as applicable to the UK.

There will be exceptions, there always are, but as a general rule of thumb, this is the situation we are facing here.

The AD’s claim that Rolex have told them they should only deal with customers in their geographical patch, your local one effectively, based on the postcode of your house.

If you travel further away to another city, they will pretty much not deal with you at all.

In the UK Rolex have been gradually shutting down most of the independent smaller AD’s awarding the new outlet licences to the Watches Of Switzerland group, who are willing to invest in large plush glass palaces. They trade under Goldsmiths, Mappin and Web, WOS themselves and some are just branded as Rolex boutiques, this has got to a point now where we are facing almost a monopoly.

This has destroyed competition, there is no competition between different companies and there is no competition within the large company themselves as they only deal with locals, so absolutely no desire at all for your business, unless it suits them. Which is where the spend games and bundling etc come in.

So if your unlucky and your local AD is one of these WOS outlets, it’s almost game over straight away. I really don’t know the criteria they use to distribute their watches, but I suspect it rewards their whales greatly and doesn’t place being a proper enthusiast very high up their criteria list!

Now yes, that’s business 101, and to an extent we understand, but the implications of that are, if you are in the UK, unlucky that your local AD is a WOS outlet, now highly likely given the sheer number of them, and you are not already a whale with them, you can’t go to another AD further afield because they won’t deal with you, you are going to find it monumentally difficult/ impossible to buy a Rolex.

You are going to need to go into your local one, get patronised, take the rudeness and disinterest, try and play the whole condescending game, try and create relationships, potentially buying jewellery and things that benefit them, etc, etc, you all know the score.

Ralistically you could have the most affable personality, you could be hilarious at cracking jokes, you could be a professional relationship builder, supermodel looks, the patience of a saint, but you aren’t getting allocated an in demand steel sports Rolex.

I think the frustration in the UK is down to the fact you can’t really influence the above, it’s been thrust upon us by business decisions made higher up.

If I am reading things correctly I think in the US you have more of the nicer, smaller, fairer, local AD’s and seem to have more choice with which ones you can use/will deal with you, and also have more of a personal influence on your situation, coming across as a genuine enthusiast, visiting regularly, being a nice person and not entitled.

We don’t really have those options.

I feel a lot of you aren’t understanding this and are judging by your own situation, where you can personally make that difference. Hopefully that explains a bit more where I think the OP is coming from, and I would hope you would understand why this is frustrating to a genuine watch enthusiast, rather than being critical.

First world problems and all, lol!

PS, I have been talking about steel GMT, Daytona, SkyDweller. not 36 OP’s and two tone models.

[bluestreak]

Originally Posted by Stupot

This is quite an interesting thread, although I’m finding it quite frustrating, as I get where the OP is coming from, but seeing a lot of you misinterpreting it.

I’m quoting Kat, but I am not aiming this at you, so please don’t read any tone into this, I just think everyone seems to be slightly missing the point of the OP’s original gripe.

I’ll say this again.

The OP is UK based.

The recent comments mostly aren’t as applicable to the UK.

There will be exceptions, there always are, but as a general rule of thumb, this is the situation we are facing here.

The AD’s claim that Rolex have told them they should only deal with customers in their geographical patch, your local one effectively, based on the postcode of your house.

If you travel further away to another city, they will pretty much not deal with you at all.

In the UK Rolex have been gradually shutting down most of the independent smaller AD’s awarding the new outlet licences to the Watches Of Switzerland group, who are willing to invest in large plush glass palaces. They trade under Goldsmiths, Mappin and Web, WOS themselves and some are just branded as Rolex boutiques, this has got to a point now where we are facing almost a monopoly.

This has destroyed competition, there is no competition between different companies and there is no competition within the large company themselves as they only deal with locals, so absolutely no desire at all for your business, unless it suits them. Which is where the spend games and bundling etc come in.

So if your unlucky and your local AD is one of these WOS outlets, it’s almost game over straight away. I really don’t know the criteria they use to distribute their watches, but I suspect it rewards their whales greatly and doesn’t place being a proper enthusiast very high up their criteria list!

Now yes, that’s business. 101, and to an extent we understand, but the implications of that are, if you are in the UK, unlucky that your local AD is a WOS outlet, now highly likely given the sheer number of them, and you are not a whale with them, and you can’t go to another AD further afield because they won’t deal with you, you are going to find it monumentally difficult to buy a Rolex.

You are going to need to go into your local one, get patronised, take the rudeness and disinterest, try and play the whole condescending game, try and create relationships, potentially buying jewellery and things that benefit them, etc, etc, you all know the score.

Ralistically you could have the most affable personality, you could be hilarious at cracking jokes, you could be a professional relationship builder, supermodel looks, the patience of a saint, but you aren’t getting allocated an in demand steel sports Rolex.

I think the frustration in the UK is down to the fact you can’t really influence the above, it’s been thrust upon us by business decisions made higher up.

If I am reading things correctly I think in the US you have more of the nicer, smaller, fairer, local AD’s and seem to have more choice with which ones you can use/will deal with you, and also have more of a personal influence on your situation, coming across as a genuine enthusiast, visiting regularly, being a nice person and not entitled.

We don’t really have those options.

I feel a lot of you aren’t understanding this and are judging by your own situation, where you can personally make that difference.

First world problems and all, lol, but hopefully that explains a bit more where I think the OP is coming from!

PS, I have been talking about steel GMT, Daytona, SkyDweller. not 36 OP’s and two tone models.

If it’s really this bad, I sympathize. But I’d just buy another watch. Like you said, it’s only a few watches that are affected.


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[Cambo]

I have never been treated poorly at ANY North American AD’s. they have been courteous, friendly and professional.
Caribbean AD’s on the other hand….

[Stupot]

Originally Posted by bluestreak

If it’s really this bad, I sympathize. But I’d just buy another watch. Like you said, it’s only a few watches that are affected.


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Yep, agree, I have taken it as an opportunity and have an IWC, TAG Monaco, Panerai and AP I would never have thought about before.

It’s sad though, I wore a Rolex for 20 years straight before all this nonsense and I do miss that rock solid quality they are rightly famous for.

Their loss to an extent!

[Kevin of Larchmont]

Originally Posted by Stupot

This is quite an interesting thread, although I’m finding it quite frustrating, as I get where the OP is coming from, but seeing a lot of you misinterpreting it.

I’m quoting Kat, but I am not aiming this at you, so please don’t read any tone into this, I just think everyone seems to be slightly missing the point of the OP’s original gripe.

I’ll say this again.

The OP is UK based.

The recent comments mostly aren’t as applicable to the UK.

There will be exceptions, there always are, but as a general rule of thumb, this is the situation we are facing here.

The AD’s claim that Rolex have told them they should only deal with customers in their geographical patch, your local one effectively, based on the postcode of your house.

If you travel further away to another city, they will pretty much not deal with you at all.

In the UK Rolex have been gradually shutting down most of the independent smaller AD’s awarding the new outlet licences to the Watches Of Switzerland group, who are willing to invest in large plush glass palaces. They trade under Goldsmiths, Mappin and Web, WOS themselves and some are just branded as Rolex boutiques, this has got to a point now where we are facing almost a monopoly.

This has destroyed competition, there is no competition between different companies and there is no competition within the large company themselves as they only deal with locals, so absolutely no desire at all for your business, unless it suits them. Which is where the spend games and bundling etc come in.

So if your unlucky and your local AD is one of these WOS outlets, it’s almost game over straight away. I really don’t know the criteria they use to distribute their watches, but I suspect it rewards their whales greatly and doesn’t place being a proper enthusiast very high up their criteria list!

Now yes, that’s business. 101, and to an extent we understand, but the implications of that are, if you are in the UK, unlucky that your local AD is a WOS outlet, now highly likely given the sheer number of them, and you are not already a whale with them, you can’t go to another AD further afield because they won’t deal with you, you are going to find it monumentally difficult/ impossible to buy a Rolex.

You are going to need to go into your local one, get patronised, take the rudeness and disinterest, try and play the whole condescending game, try and create relationships, potentially buying jewellery and things that benefit them, etc, etc, you all know the score.

Ralistically you could have the most affable personality, you could be hilarious at cracking jokes, you could be a professional relationship builder, supermodel looks, the patience of a saint, but you aren’t getting allocated an in demand steel sports Rolex.

I think the frustration in the UK is down to the fact you can’t really influence the above, it’s been thrust upon us by business decisions made higher up.

If I am reading things correctly I think in the US you have more of the nicer, smaller, fairer, local AD’s and seem to have more choice with which ones you can use/will deal with you, and also have more of a personal influence on your situation, coming across as a genuine enthusiast, visiting regularly, being a nice person and not entitled.

We don’t really have those options.

I feel a lot of you aren’t understanding this and are judging by your own situation, where you can personally make that difference. Hopefully that explains a bit more where I think the OP is coming from, and I would hope you would understand why this is frustrating to a genuine watch enthusiast, rather than being critical.

First world problems and all, lol!

PS, I have been talking about steel GMT, Daytona, SkyDweller. not 36 OP’s and two tone models.

This explanation is appreciated but the OP did not ask a regional question even though that appears now to have been his intent, so the answers reflecting the US experience are understandable. And now better understanding the UK Rolex buying experience the OP’s generalization about the AD experience is also completely understandable.

[rockysw]

with WoS in UK, I have had ok ok experience.

I have had really good experience with Laings. Very friendly and welcoming.

[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by Stupot

This is quite an interesting thread, although I’m finding it quite frustrating, as I get where the OP is coming from, but seeing a lot of you misinterpreting it.

I’m quoting Kat, but I am not aiming this at you, so please don’t read any tone into this, I just think everyone seems to be slightly missing the point of the OP’s original gripe.

I’ll say this again.

The OP is UK based.

The recent comments mostly aren’t as applicable to the UK.

There will be exceptions, there always are, but as a general rule of thumb, this is the situation we are facing here.

The AD’s claim that Rolex have told them they should only deal with customers in their geographical patch, your local one effectively, based on the postcode of your house.

If you travel further away to another city, they will pretty much not deal with you at all.

In the UK Rolex have been gradually shutting down most of the independent smaller AD’s awarding the new outlet licences to the Watches Of Switzerland group, who are willing to invest in large plush glass palaces. They trade under Goldsmiths, Mappin and Web, WOS themselves and some are just branded as Rolex boutiques, this has got to a point now where we are facing almost a monopoly.

This has destroyed competition, there is no competition between different companies and there is no competition within the large company themselves as they only deal with locals, so absolutely no desire at all for your business, unless it suits them. Which is where the spend games and bundling etc come in.

So if your unlucky and your local AD is one of these WOS outlets, it’s almost game over straight away. I really don’t know the criteria they use to distribute their watches, but I suspect it rewards their whales greatly and doesn’t place being a proper enthusiast very high up their criteria list!

Now yes, that’s business 101, and to an extent we understand, but the implications of that are, if you are in the UK, unlucky that your local AD is a WOS outlet, now highly likely given the sheer number of them, and you are not already a whale with them, you can’t go to another AD further afield because they won’t deal with you, you are going to find it monumentally difficult/ impossible to buy a Rolex.

You are going to need to go into your local one, get patronised, take the rudeness and disinterest, try and play the whole condescending game, try and create relationships, potentially buying jewellery and things that benefit them, etc, etc, you all know the score.

Ralistically you could have the most affable personality, you could be hilarious at cracking jokes, you could be a professional relationship builder, supermodel looks, the patience of a saint, but you aren’t getting allocated an in demand steel sports Rolex.

I think the frustration in the UK is down to the fact you can’t really influence the above, it’s been thrust upon us by business decisions made higher up.

If I am reading things correctly I think in the US you have more of the nicer, smaller, fairer, local AD’s and seem to have more choice with which ones you can use/will deal with you, and also have more of a personal influence on your situation, coming across as a genuine enthusiast, visiting regularly, being a nice person and not entitled.

We don’t really have those options.

I feel a lot of you aren’t understanding this and are judging by your own situation, where you can personally make that difference. Hopefully that explains a bit more where I think the OP is coming from, and I would hope you would understand why this is frustrating to a genuine watch enthusiast, rather than being critical.

First world problems and all, lol!

PS, I have been talking about steel GMT, Daytona, SkyDweller. not 36 OP’s and two tone models.

The OP’s original post could apply to any AD. The watches I want are probably easier to get than some of the ones you guys want, but in reality, OPs and Wimbledon Datejusts are not that easy to get. The regional requirements also apply to US ADs. They want to sell to locals, and mine told me as much. I did not see WOS mentioned in the OP’s initial post. I was merely talking about supply and demand, and having some patience. You say you didn’t mean to single me out, and yet you did. Why? I just call ‘em like I see ‘em. That’s what forums are for, aren’t they?

Kat


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[Stupot]

Originally Posted by KatGirl

The OP’s original post could apply to any AD. The watches I want are probably easier to get than some of the ones you guys want, but in reality, OPs and Wimbledon Datejusts are not that easy to get. The regional requirements also apply to US ADs. They want to sell to locals, and mine told me as much. I did not see WOS mentioned in the OP’s initial post. I was merely talking about supply and demand, and having some patience. You say you didn’t mean to single me out, and yet you did. Why? I just call ‘em like I see ‘em. That’s what forums are for, aren’t they?

Kat


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Your post had the points in it I wanted to address.

[Neil McCauley]

Originally Posted by Stupot

This is quite an interesting thread, although I’m finding it quite frustrating, as I get where the OP is coming from, but seeing a lot of you misinterpreting it.

I’m quoting Kat, but I am not aiming this at you, so please don’t read any tone into this, I just think everyone seems to be slightly missing the point of the OP’s original gripe.

I’ll say this again.

The OP is UK based.

The recent comments mostly aren’t as applicable to the UK.

There will be exceptions, there always are, but as a general rule of thumb, this is the situation we are facing here.

The AD’s claim that Rolex have told them they should only deal with customers in their geographical patch, your local one effectively, based on the postcode of your house.

If you travel further away to another city, they will pretty much not deal with you at all.

In the UK Rolex have been gradually shutting down most of the independent smaller AD’s awarding the new outlet licences to the Watches Of Switzerland group, who are willing to invest in large plush glass palaces. They trade under Goldsmiths, Mappin and Web, WOS themselves and some are just branded as Rolex boutiques, this has got to a point now where we are facing almost a monopoly.

This has destroyed competition, there is no competition between different companies and there is no competition within the large company themselves as they only deal with locals, so absolutely no desire at all for your business, unless it suits them. Which is where the spend games and bundling etc come in.

So if your unlucky and your local AD is one of these WOS outlets, it’s almost game over straight away. I really don’t know the criteria they use to distribute their watches, but I suspect it rewards their whales greatly and doesn’t place being a proper enthusiast very high up their criteria list!

Now yes, that’s business 101, and to an extent we understand, but the implications of that are, if you are in the UK, unlucky that your local AD is a WOS outlet, now highly likely given the sheer number of them, and you are not already a whale with them, you can’t go to another AD further afield because they won’t deal with you, you are going to find it monumentally difficult/ impossible to buy a Rolex.

You are going to need to go into your local one, get patronised, take the rudeness and disinterest, try and play the whole condescending game, try and create relationships, potentially buying jewellery and things that benefit them, etc, etc, you all know the score.

Ralistically you could have the most affable personality, you could be hilarious at cracking jokes, you could be a professional relationship builder, supermodel looks, the patience of a saint, but you aren’t getting allocated an in demand steel sports Rolex.

I think the frustration in the UK is down to the fact you can’t really influence the above, it’s been thrust upon us by business decisions made higher up.

If I am reading things correctly I think in the US you have more of the nicer, smaller, fairer, local AD’s and seem to have more choice with which ones you can use/will deal with you, and also have more of a personal influence on your situation, coming across as a genuine enthusiast, visiting regularly, being a nice person and not entitled.

We don’t really have those options.

I feel a lot of you aren’t understanding this and are judging by your own situation, where you can personally make that difference. Hopefully that explains a bit more where I think the OP is coming from, and I would hope you would understand why this is frustrating to a genuine watch enthusiast, rather than being critical.

First world problems and all, lol!

PS, I have been talking about steel GMT, Daytona, SkyDweller. not 36 OP’s and two tone models.

Conversely, if you approach it with the right expectations and understand the dynamics of the levels of demand involved in this space, then you can indeed get what you want without doing any dancing outside of what you're comfortable with.

I'm case in point, a UK Goldsmiths customer, not the most hilarious, affable or supermodel-like or a professional relationship builder. I've managed to get pretty much everything I've wanted from my AD in recent years, with a few small jewellery buys for my wife and family which I wanted to buy anyway. I talk to my SA very regularly and bring in a drink/cakes at Christmas. In turn, everyone in the store knows my name and greets me - which, out of the hundreds of people they get in per week, including the dorks who aggressively demand stuff, is quite nice.

Fact is, it really isn't as bad out there as a lot of these posts make it out to be. The real truth is, we as customers seem to be split into 3 categories:

- Ones who are happy to be nice and polite, friendly, have low expectations and understand the situation from all angles, they maybe buy a few other bits, a pair of earrings for their spouse etc. They also might pop in regularly or be in contact a lot, talking watches and other stuff.

- Ones who don't care at all and are not in touch with the situation at all, put their name on a list and walk away

- Ones who hold themselves in far too high regard and think they are above a salesperson, or above a luxury brand assessing if they want you as a customer or not, given the extreme demand, these companies are able to take advantage of this. Typically these people are vocal about the situation, but realistically they would never get a call to get one anyway, and even if they did, they'd probably turn it down, for fear of feeling good...

[Krash]

Originally Posted by KatGirl

The OP’s original post could apply to any AD. The watches I want are probably easier to get than some of the ones you guys want, but in reality, OPs and Wimbledon Datejusts are not that easy to get. The regional requirements also apply to US ADs. They want to sell to locals, and mine told me as much. I did not see WOS mentioned in the OP’s initial post. I was merely talking about supply and demand, and having some patience. You say you didn’t mean to single me out, and yet you did. Why? I just call ‘em like I see ‘em. That’s what forums are for, aren’t they?

Kat


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Yes, regional requirements apply to most US ADs. They ask where you live. But I think they might make exceptions for places like Las Vegas, and other places with a lot of tourists.

Also, I don’t think some folks realize how massive the United States is. Texas, by itself, is almost three times bigger than the United Kingdom. The UK is roughly comparable to the state of Oregon in terms of size.

There are people in the middle of Montana, Idaho, Wyoming, etc., that are as far away from an AD as London is to Paris, maybe more.


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[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by Neil McCauley

Conversely, if you approach it with the right expectations and understand the dynamics of the levels of demand involved in this space, then you can indeed get what you want without doing any dancing outside of what you're comfortable with.

I'm case in point, a UK Goldsmiths customer, not the most hilarious, affable or supermodel-like or a professional relationship builder. I've managed to get pretty much everything I've wanted from my AD in recent years, with a few small jewellery buys for my wife and family which I wanted to buy anyway. I talk to my SA very regularly and bring in a drink/cakes at Christmas. In turn, everyone in the store knows my name and greets me - which, out of the hundreds of people they get in per week, including the dorks who aggressively demand stuff, is quite nice.

Fact is, it really isn't as bad out there as a lot of these posts make it out to be. The real truth is, we as customers seem to be split into 3 categories:

- Ones who are happy to be nice and polite, friendly, have low expectations and understand the situation from all angles, they maybe buy a few other bits, a pair of earrings for their spouse etc. They also might pop in regularly or be in contact a lot, talking watches and other stuff.

- Ones who don't care at all and are not in touch with the situation at all, put their name on a list and walk away

- Ones who hold themselves in far too high regard and think they are above a salesperson, or above a luxury brand assessing if they want you as a customer or not, given the extreme demand, these companies are able to take advantage of this. Typically these people are vocal about the situation, but realistically they would never get a call to get one anyway, and even if they did, they'd probably turn it down, for fear of feeling good...

Good assessment, and your description of your approach sounded identical to mine, except for bringing in gifts. For some reason, THEY give ME gifts, even on random drop in visits, for a nice chat. We know there are folks who think how we approach obtaining the watches we want, somehow demeans us, when, in fact, we are just being ourselves, and treating our SAs, as we would anyone we meet. I’m always surprised at how some react to our approach. The bottom line is just being ourselves and treating others the way we wish to be treated is the not so magical answer to “How to get a new Rolex from an AD.”

Kat


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[N0trub]

Kat, thanks for being here your post are well written thoughtful and on point…I think you are a mole sent here from The Crown! I have been trying what is prescribed here for over two years and no new Rolex. I wish i had bought grey immediately this would have been cheaper at the time much easier and it would have saved me some heart ache. I don't have to sell to anyone and neither does the crown or their ADs i understand this.

Had to edit… i meant this with kindness and humor Kat I enjoy reading your posts and viewing your watch pictures. Sincerely Roy

[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by N0trub

Kat, thanks for being here your post are well written thoughtful and on point…I think you are a mole sent here from The Crown! I have been trying what is prescribed here for over two years and no new Rolex. I wish i had bought grey immediately this would have been cheaper at the time much easier and it would have saved me some heart ache. I don't have to sell to anyone and neither does the crown or their ADs i understand this.

Had to edit… i meant this with kindness and humor Kat I enjoy reading your posts and viewing your watch pictures. Sincerely Roy

Thanks, Roy. I’m sorry you’ve had trouble getting what you want. There is some luck involved. I hope to be putting up pics of my new Explorer soon, and still hoping for a 36 Celebration dial, though that’s a long shot.

Kat


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[JonnyOld Boy]

Originally Posted by Neil McCauley

Read back through the responses in this thread, Jonny; nobody is grovelling, cringing or fawning.

Only the people who sound grumpy, miserable, or jaded say that people who have a good experience are doing that.

Too many people have too high of an opinion of themselves, and think they are above going to speak to someone who works in a shop. "Get on some radar of a salesman in a cheap suit, smelling of indifferent aftershave" Is there a reason you hate these salespeople so much? Which one hurt you?

Lastly - you've said you wont be buying from an AD next, and that there is no way you're going waste your time... why bother even letting us know about that? or is it just to make you feel better about it? I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that you've not even bought a watch from an AD in the last 10 years and aren't even positioned to have an opinion in this, and you're just on the "embittered AD hating bandwagon".

EDIT: Turns out I'm right... out of all 29 of Jonnys posts, at least 45% of them are moaning about the "process" of buying a Rolex. Blithering on about self respect and whinging about people "pretending to be interested in sales people's lives". Make of that what you will, folks.

Building a "relationship" is cheesy and empty in my opinion. I know loads of decent ADs and some of those are Rolex retailers. With them there is no need to "spend on crap", "form a relationship" or anything else other than walk in, have a chat and buy a watch. Your choice of verbs seems lacking in articulation and very defensive. I seemed to have touched on a nerve ....

[Neil McCauley]

Originally Posted by JonnyOld Boy

Building a "relationship" is cheesy and empty in my opinion. I know loads of decent ADs and some of those are Rolex retailers. With them there is no need to "spend on crap", "form a relationship" or anything else other than walk in, have a chat and buy a watch. Your choice of verbs seems lacking in articulation and very defensive. I seemed to have touched on a nerve ....

Meh, no nerve touched. Your post history makes your opinion null and void to me.

[bluestreak]

People here get ruffled about the term “build a relationship”. But I definitely have a relationship with my AD. A business relationship. They sell me things. I buy them. As I become a more loyal customer, they offer me things that they don’t offer anyone else. As they become a more loyal seller, I take more of my business there. This is how most businesses work.

[JonnyOld Boy]

Originally Posted by bluestreak

People here get ruffled about the term “build a relationship”. But I definitely have a relationship with my AD. A business relationship. They sell me things. I buy them. As I become a more loyal customer, they offer me things that they don’t offer anyone else. As they become a more loyal seller, I take more of my business there. This is how most businesses work.

I think the nuance here the illusion of exclusivity and how sometimes that illusion brings a sense of false achievement and aspiration. When "Champions of the relationship" celebrate their "specialness", I just find that funny and cheesy. The reason we are all here is because we all own/like/love/want/aspire to Rolex watches. But one has to be naive not to see the "Emperors new clothes situation" here when ready some of the posts... Especially those about what to wear ... Also some would argue buying a Rolex is not a "business transaction" and there is no "business relationship". It's just "shopping".

[JonnyOld Boy]

Originally Posted by Neil McCauley

Meh, no nerve touched. Your post history makes your opinion null and void to me.

So null and void, you feel the need to keep posting ....

[codecow]

Originally Posted by Krash

Good question. Supply and demand is one of the easiest theories to learn in college. Economics 101. You would expect TRF subscribers to have a good grip on it. But for some, it’s apparently as difficult as quantum mechanics, which is arguably the hardest class to master.


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At least half the politicians in the world don’t understand it, so it’s really not that surprising.