Verify GMT ll pics for me

[donas]

I was just about to pull the trigger on a GMT ll pepsi, when I noticed the style number in one of the pictures. It shows 16710A and has a red and blue bezel. Was there ever any variance in this? From my research, it appears that this model should be 16710B???? This watch is for sale by sale2day, who appears to have quite a good reputation. I contacted him and he states the original owner did not change the bezel. Is this gonna be a good purchase?

[Rscmaine]

I recently did a search about those A B C follow on numbers and found that they don't have any direct relationship to the bezel colors. Just another example of Rolex pulling model and serial numbers out of thin air, as I understand it.

If the watch has papers, as that one seems to, the GMT bexel color is typed right on them - ask for a photo.

[Rscmaine]

This is especially true with the transitional models like that one - the stick dial pepsi with the new 3186 mov't is one of the most scrutinized models lately, and has been researched to death

Here's a WAAAY too detailed analysis (but a fun read)

http://www.rolexreferencepage.com/16710B/16710B.html

[Speed]

Here you go...the 16710 watch you are looking at was likely a Coke - Red/Black GMTII to start...

The papers do not have color written on them - except to designate dial color.

Per this site, the Pepsi code is BLRO. Black is LN.

http://www.gmtmasterhistory.com/gmt-...ref_16710.html

Available with three different bezels:

* Red/Black aka Coke (Bezel 315-16760-7)
* BLRO, Blue/Red aka Pepsi (bleu/rouge), (Bezel 315-16700-6)
* LN, Black (lunette noire), (Bezel 315-16700-1)


To answer your question...the purchase can still be "good" (not sure what you are paying) if the watch is genuine. You may want to get a coke bezel....but you may have difficulty unless you buy on TRF.

<edit> I just checked my papers for my D-Series Coke. I have that exact style # (R16710A30B7879) on my papers...

[Rscmaine]

[Safetrends]

I like Bills Rolex photo link that is authentic.

[Rscmaine]

I got my sub for the "bulletproof" nature of the 1000 ft WR and the long history of the 3135 movement - it is a workhorse which, with proper service, should run for 42-50 hours longer than I will.

But I'm fascinated by the new Parachrom - with it's anti-magnetic properties and anti-Swatch sourcing.

The less outside involvement in my watch the better - and when (not if) Swatch decides to stop or restrict the availablility of the Nivarox hairspring is the day that it becomes much harder to service my watch.

This is an anal retentive concern, I admit, but here I am.

[Hkspwrsche]

FYI I asked and this is not a 3186 its a 3185 per seller unless something has changed. I dont think he mentions 3186 in the ad if it's the same one.

[Hkspwrsche]

http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=107438

Notice no mention of 3186 only mentions stick dial. I asked and he clarified for me. Hope youre not expecting a 3186 out of the deal.

[Juggernaut]

Z series: I don't even know if ANY of the latest Z's had the 3186, just the later M's, but I can certainly be wrong.

[donas]

This thread has become side tracked. I wasn't asking about the movement, the original question was about the bezel and model #.

I am more concerned about the paperwork not matching the watch than I am with the movement. After all, does it make that big a difference?

I was hoping the replies would be on the same sheet of music, now I'm more confused.

[SLS]

Looks good! Some late Z serials do have the 3186.
Scott

[Tools]

Get the watch if you like it and the price is right...bezel inserts can be changed to any color; so don't ever pay extra for a particular one....

It is likely that it was changed to the red/blue because that is what most are looking for - but it's no biggy..

The stick ll font is meaningless too. both the Exp II and the GMT II have had both dial fonts through the years...

[Speed]

Originally Posted by donas

I am more concerned about the paperwork not matching the watch than I am with the movement. After all, does it make that big a difference?

I was hoping the replies would be on the same sheet of music, now I'm more confused.

It seems to me your watch was originally a Coke bezel insert. Black & Red. Someone switched to Pepsi. If the serial on your Papers match your watch, that is most important...although some believe papers can be faked.

Worst case, you don't have the bezel color which originally came with your watch. Does that bother you???? If not, then make your best deal.

Make sense???

<edit> Larry types faster than I ;-)

[donas]

tools,

I have had a submariner since about 93, but haven't been bitten by the bug until recently, just getting into the Rolex collecting thing. I would assume it is a big deal for the papers to not match the watch being sold, is this not so? I realize the ease of changing bezel, but more concerned about why it was changed or why the papers don't match.

The first response I received states Rolex got away from having the bezel color indicated by model #, not true?

I do appreciate all the replies-love this forum

I just found this-makes since if true-anyone else have a black dial or pepsi that could check style # on paperwork?

R16710 = model number
A30 = black dial
B = end link type
7879(0) = bracelet ref. #

[Tools]

Well, no, that is not really the case.... unless, like some - you personally want it to.

You need to decide what you want.... There is no law or statute that says the numbers and papers need to always be perfect.. The critical numbers would be serial numbers... that is the only way you know what paper goes with what watch.

It's generally accepted that, from the factory, the warranty card will say 16710A for the red/black and 16710B for the red/blue. But, it's just an identifier... it will also have the bracelet type (Jubilee or Oyster) as part of that number..but people change those too.


16710 - GMT
A-red/black insert
30 - Black Dial
B78790 - Oyster SEL bracelet

The key is to know what you have, or what you don't have and not to blindly insist that you are only going to buy if everything is as forum members dictate, and who quibble about these things daily.

As to why it is a 16710A with a Pepsi insert, I would say that you may never know...but it could be as simple as the original owner having the Dealer change it.. many will. Or it may be as I said earlier.. during a clean-up to sell this time, the seller thought he might get more offers if it was a Pepsi.. As to the sellers story, My advice is to nod your head politely, then make your own decision - but it should make zero difference on the cost, and it shouldn't make any difference to you if this is the insert you want..

Originally Posted by donas

tools,

I have had a submariner since about 93, but haven't been bitten by the bug until recently, just getting into the Rolex collecting thing. I would assume it is a big deal for the papers to not match the watch being sold, is this not so? I realize the ease of changing bezel, but more concerned about why it was changed or why the papers don't match.

The first response I received states Rolex got away from having the bezel color indicated by model #, not true?

I do appreciate all the replies-love this forum

[SDDS]

look great

[bluemartinifan]

I bought a 16710 earlier this year
Z serial
The style # on the warranty paper says R16710N30B7879
The sales receips says 16710LN (it does have a black bezel)
Hope this helps.

[Tools]

Originally Posted by bluemartinifan

I bought a 16710 earlier this year
Z serial
The style # on the warranty paper says R16710N30B7879
The sales receips says 16710LN (it does have a black bezel)
Hope this helps.

Yes..... we have been leaving the Noir (black) insert out of the conversation.. This would be the third color of GMT Bezel insert available for the 16710

[PeterT]

I have been looking at the warranty paper for 2 of my F serial GMT II watches. Both have 16710 but nothing else apart from the serial number. Both of these are UK watches.
Where is the long number quoted in this thread?

Peter

[Tools]

It seems that each market is a bit different..

The OP's first photo is how the paper warranty used to look for US watches. They were printed and this was at the top right corner.

The Warranty cards are hit or miss.. Some seem to come with the identifier letter and others not..

[Speed]

Larry,

With the death grip Rolex maintains on so many aspects of their product / anti-counterfeiting measures etc. I wonder why they are so inconsistent here???

[TurboWatch]

Originally Posted by Tools

Well, no, that is not really the case.... unless, like some - you personally want it to.

You need to decide what you want.... There is no law or statute that says the numbers and papers need to always be perfect.. The critical numbers would be serial numbers... that is the only way you know what paper goes with what watch.

It's generally accepted that, from the factory, the warranty card will say 16710A for the red/black and 16710B for the red/blue. But, it's just an identifier... it will also have the bracelet type (Jubilee or Oyster) as part of that number..but people change those too.


16710 - GMT
A-red/black insert
30 - Black Dial
B78790 - Oyster SEL bracelet

The key is to know what you have, or what you don't have and not to blindly insist that you are only going to buy if everything is as forum members dictate, and who quibble about these things daily.

As to why it is a 16710A with a Pepsi insert, I would say that you may never know...but it could be as simple as the original owner having the Dealer change it.. many will. Or it may be as I said earlier.. during a clean-up to sell this time, the seller thought he might get more offers if it was a Pepsi.. As to the sellers story, My advice is to nod your head politely, then make your own decision - but it should make zero difference on the cost, and it shouldn't make any difference to you if this is the insert you want..

According to your paper, the watch was originally fitted with a Coke bezel insert. Because changing insert is so easy, it could be that the previous had it changed to a Pepsi.

Just make sure the Pepsi that is on the watch now is genuine . You can always get an extra Coke at a later time.

[donas]

How do I determine if the bezel is genuine or not? The pictures are obviously of the watch I am planning to buy. Does it appear to be an authentic pepsi bezel?......well, some of the resident experts please chime in on the authenticity of the bezel.

[HL65]

Some Z's have the 3186 and an A is a coke and a B is a Pepsi.

[DVR]

Originally Posted by donas

Does it appear to be an authentic pepsi bezel?

Yes

[kgglonghorn]

Authentic Rolex Bezels are cheap...don't let a $40 item dictate a $5k purchase. IF the rest of the watch is authentic, you are rock solid. ENJOY YOUR PEPSI.

[HDHNTER]

Originally Posted by Juggernaut

Z series: I don't even know if ANY of the latest Z's had the 3186, just the later M's, but I can certainly be wrong.

You are incorrect, late Z's & all M's have the 3186. No one has reported otherwise yet.

[bluemartinifan]

I have a 16710 black bezel an early Z serial
Style # on paperwork is - R16710N30B7879

Hope this helps.

[kgglonghorn]

Actually, I have a Z 1xxxx Pepsi with 3186 and roman numerals.