Thierry Stern Brilliance Could Extend Beyond Patek Philippe

[enjoythemusic]

All truly great and legendary watchmakers have their name on timepieces. Breguet, MB&F, Kari V, Gerald Genta, Rexhep Rexhepi, etc. and Simon Brette. Thierry is kinda being robbed of that. His brilliance with having 20 new designs at-the-ready may be him saying he is being held back, perhaps struggling under the sheer weight of Dad's legacy and the limitations of Patek Philippe's 'design language' and tooling for production style.

TS chose the Cubitus for Patek Philippe as his first, as it may be the best he can do given the company's now-large scale production and, thus, TS' possible 'design language' limitations. A square movement was surely considered, one would think, so what happened? Surely Patek Philippe can create square movements, and it could have been manual wind with a PP record-setting 20 or 30-day power reserve. The lack of square movement is very curious.

With TS' immense responsibility to many workers, PP has grown in production from perhaps 10,000 back in the 1960s fabled Trinity days ~60 years ago, to today's modern-day PP mass production of over 50,000 pieces per year.

I would love to see Thierry given full freedom with his own brand, his own design style, and a company that follows his unique vision without limitations. He said there are 20 designs, perhaps more brilliance if he is allowed full freedom to any design style he can dream of and a truly blank sheet of paper.

Finally, Thierry Stern would have his name on the dial as we see with other legendary watchmakers.

[Calatrava r]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

All truly great and legendary watchmakers have their name on timepieces. Breguet, MB&F, Kari V, Gerald Genta, Rexhep Rexhepi, etc. and Simon Brette. Thierry is kinda being robbed of that. His brilliance with having 20 new designs at-the-ready may be him saying he is being held back, perhaps struggling under the sheer weight of Dad's legacy and the limitations of Patek Philippe's 'design language' and tooling for production style.

TS chose the Cubitus for Patek Philippe as his first, as it may be the best he can do given the company's now-large scale production and, thus, TS' possible 'design language' limitations. A square movement was surely considered, one would think, so what happened? Surely Patek Philippe can create square movements, and it could have been manual wind with a PP record-setting 20 or 30-day power reserve. The lack of square movement is very curious.

With TS' immense responsibility to many workers, PP has grown in production from perhaps 10,000 back in the 1960s fabled Trinity days ~60 years ago, to today's modern-day PP mass production of over 50,000 pieces per year.

I would love to see Thierry given full freedom with his own brand, his own design style, and a company that follows his unique vision without limitations. He said there are 20 designs, perhaps more brilliance if he is allowed full freedom to any design style he can dream of and a truly blank sheet of paper.

Finally, Thierry Stern would have his name on the dial as we see with other legendary watchmakers.

The watchmakers with their names on the dial in the new era, actually make the watch themselves, start to finish, don't they?

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by Calatrava r

The watchmakers with their names on the dial in the new era, actually make the watch themselves, start to finish, don't they?

Great question, Max and Brette don't, RR has others who contribute their talents as i recall. R. Smith does his thing. As a musician myself, it's normal to see 'break outs', Michael Jackson, Justin Timberlake, John Lennon, the guys from the Eagles, Eric Clapton, etc. All brilliant imho. Some play solo and some have a band with them.

[Chiboy]

I can’t tell if you’re being serious or sarcastic.

[ajw45]

A double stamped dial like Tiffany dialed Patek but instead a Patek dialed Thierry Stern would be instant success but frankly a little expected. Instead of his name on the dial he should but his face on the dial of all his watches, I bet all the people around him would say that will work. But why stop at watches? How about some Thierry Stern steaks or a daily tv show?

[metallic]

This sounds like sarcasm but I’m not sure either.

He could just call the factory that makes those $100,000 Trump tourbillon’s and put his name on a limited series of those. But definitely make them square.

[Russell996]

Originally Posted by Chiboy

I can’t tell if you’re being serious or sarcastic.

Originally Posted by metallic

This sounds like sarcasm but I’m not sure either.

He could just call the factory that makes those $100,000 Trump tourbillon’s and put his name on a limited series of those. But definitely make them square.

You can’t tell! Enjoythemusic is a habitual Patek mudslinger.

[martinr]

Originally Posted by Russell996

You can’t tell! Enjoythemusic is a habitual Patek mudslinger.

He was better for a while but Cubitus caused him to relapse. Triggered.

[77T]

I don't think TS is particularly inventive. Thus, no likelihood he'd create something iconic.

Instead, he seems to be hunting for someone inside PP who could create the next big thing (and I don't mean the Cubitus).

From a recent interview last spring:
"As for the future, I don’t have a crystal ball, but I find myself in the same position as my father years ago. I’m trying to teach my young colleagues the importance of innovation while staying faithful to the codes of Patek Philippe. Ultimately, it’s crucial to combine innovation with tradition in order to continue surprising and pleasing our customers."


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by Chiboy

I can’t tell if you’re being serious or sarcastic.

Serious. Look, he grew up around an incredible environment for horology. Walking the museum as one wishes, plus the many, many decades of activities within the many facets of the business. Recently, he kinda sounds like a frustrated musician in a band.

[TheHolyLuck]

Now I want a plastic Perpetual Calendar Quartz x Swatch collaboration with his face on it as a QR code.
Engraves on the back : « haters can’t afford this ».

[Bearxj86]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Serious. Look, he grew up around an incredible environment for horology. Walking the museum as one wishes, plus the many, many decades of activities within the many facets of the business. Recently, he kinda sounds like a frustrated musician in a band.

At the same time TS expresses his passion for food/gluttony really well. He is a bit of a porky tubba. Perhaps he is a stress eater.

[subtona]

Originally Posted by martinr

He was better for a while but Cubitus caused him to relapse. Triggered.

[subtona]

Just curious, what comes to mind when you think of Phillippe Stern?

For me it would be the 3940.

Thinking about some of the changes over the years


5270
Cubitus
5327 (5140/3940 replacement)

Not improvements imho

Why not shoot for an updated 2499 or 1518? Ie BALANCED

Why not make some amazing time only offerings ?

Missed opportunities over the years.

Aquanaut line has been successful

And I like the new box for the cubitus

[Dr.Stu]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

All truly great and legendary watchmakers have their name on timepieces. Breguet, MB&F, Kari V, Gerald Genta, Rexhep Rexhepi, etc. and Simon Brette. Thierry is kinda being robbed of that. His brilliance with having 20 new designs at-the-ready may be him saying he is being held back, perhaps struggling under the sheer weight of Dad's legacy and the limitations of Patek Philippe's 'design language' and tooling for production style.

TS chose the Cubitus for Patek Philippe as his first, as it may be the best he can do given the company's now-large scale production and, thus, TS' possible 'design language' limitations. A square movement was surely considered, one would think, so what happened? Surely Patek Philippe can create square movements, and it could have been manual wind with a PP record-setting 20 or 30-day power reserve. The lack of square movement is very curious.

With TS' immense responsibility to many workers, PP has grown in production from perhaps 10,000 back in the 1960s fabled Trinity days ~60 years ago, to today's modern-day PP mass production of over 50,000 pieces per year.

I would love to see Thierry given full freedom with his own brand, his own design style, and a company that follows his unique vision without limitations. He said there are 20 designs, perhaps more brilliance if he is allowed full freedom to any design style he can dream of and a truly blank sheet of paper.

Finally, Thierry Stern would have his name on the dial as we see with other legendary watchmakers.

Thanks, I needed the laugh!

Originally Posted by subtona

Just curious, what comes to mind when you think of Phillippe Stern?

For me it would be the 3940.

Thinking about some of the changes over the years


5270
Cubitus
5327 (5140/3940 replacement)

Not improvements imho

Why not shoot for an updated 2499 or 1518? Ie BALANCED

Why not make some amazing time only offerings ?

Missed opportunities over the years.

Aquanaut line has been successful

And I like the new box for the cubitus

Would that be the boxitus?

And for me the first PS pieces would be the 3940 of course (the watch he wore), the 5711, a 5170p (but that's one of my favorites) or any of a number of the PC Chronos.

[Vipes]

Wasn’t his claim to fame the 5970 or am I mistaken?

[Dr.Stu]

Yup, the 5970s would be the "any number of PC chronos" I was referring to (but without the numbers)

[Gamut]

I think we need to understand that Mr.Stern needs to maintain his large factory and his workers, and to do so he needs to produce 70,000 watches per year. By reaching this scale, he has enabled Patek to produce connoisseur watches at accessible prices for the rest of us who cannot afford to hire independent watchmakers.

We also need to understand that although Patek is a powerful brand, they are not powerful enough to turn the trend so that their precious metal dress watches start selling like their steel sports watches overnight. It should be much more straight forward business-wise to terminate all their dress lines like AP did. And in order to maintain it's connoisseur lines (the dome clocks, rare handcrafts, complications, calatravas, golden ellipses, etc.), he needs to devote 40% of the production to sports lines while restraining their desirability so that they won't outshine and damage the demand of the connoisseur lines.

We need to understand Mr.Stern's descision to terminate the 5711 and to replace this with the Cubitus in this light. Cubitus was needed to maintain Patek's devotion for the connoisseurs and for the rest of us.

[Tonski74]

Originally Posted by Gamut

I think we need to understand that Mr.Stern needs to maintain his large factory and his workers, and to do so he needs to produce 70,000 watches per year. By reaching this scale, he has enabled Patek to produce connoisseur watches at accessible prices for the rest of us who cannot afford to hire independent watchmakers.

We also need to understand that although Patek is a powerful brand, they are not powerful enough to turn the trend so that their precious metal dress watches start selling like their steel sports watches overnight. It should be much more straight forward business-wise to terminate all their dress lines like AP did. And in order to maintain it's connoisseur lines (the dome clocks, rare handcrafts, complications, calatravas, golden ellipses, etc.), he needs to devote 40% of the production to sports lines while restraining their desirability so that they won't outshine and damage the demand of the connoisseur lines.

We need to understand Mr.Stern's descision to terminate the 5711 and to replace this with the Cubitus in this light. Cubitus was needed to maintain Patek's devotion for the connoisseurs and for the rest of us.

Very well said!


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[nyc2la]

Originally Posted by Gamut

We need to understand Mr.Stern's descision to terminate the 5711 and to replace this with the Cubitus in this light. Cubitus was needed to maintain Patek's devotion for the connoisseurs and for the rest of us.

I question TS’ judgement and can’t understand his decision — he discontinued the 5711 and replaced it with a watch with an inferior design.

He should have just left the 5711 in production. If he did that, the devotion would have remained high without all the negativity and self-inflicted chinks in the PP armor.

I wish someone in the room told TS that sometimes doing nothing is doing something.

[Gamut]

Originally Posted by nyc2la

I question TS’ judgement and can’t understand his decision — he discontinued the 5711 and replaced it with a watch with an inferior design.

I imagine Mr.Stern needed to terminate the 5711 because the hyperinflation of its desirability started inevitably to cast the perception that the precious metal connoisseur models are undesirable items that are merely bought in order to gain the qualification to buy a 5711, resultantly placing the symbolic status of those precious metal models as being inferior to a production model in steel.

So I assume Mr.Stern needed to come up with a replacement of the Nautilus that does not go the Neptune route, because he does need models that are relatively easy to sell in order to maintain his business, while not becoming an excessively popular model like the Nautilus, which he had to terminate due to its side-effect.

[scurfa]

Originally Posted by Gamut

I imagine Mr.Stern needed to terminate the 5711 because the hyperinflation of its desirability started inevitably to cast the perception that the precious metal connoisseur models are undesirable items that are merely bought in order to gain the qualification to buy a 5711, resultantly placing the symbolic status of those precious metal models as being inferior to a production model in steel.

So I assume Mr.Stern needed to come up with a replacement of the Nautilus that does not go the Neptune route, because he does need models that are relatively easy to sell in order to maintain his business, while not becoming an excessively popular model like the Nautilus, which he had to terminate due to its side-effect.

They caused their own problems by making the 5711 like the Daytona and it was planned.


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[elmoboy]

He should have put his face on every dial of the watch..

[Gebbeth]

Originally Posted by elmoboy

He should have put his face on every dial of the watch..

What part of "original" do you not understand!!!!!! HE'S AN ORIGINAL!!!!!

He's already placed a portrait of his dad on a watch. He does not repeat his originality. He is the original original.

TS finds new ways to express artistic originality, like realizing that a square is not an oval. Ergo, different and original.

That a "cube" does not have to have equal length sides.

That cubitus is NOT the Latin for elbow. It is a square...ummm...cube Nautilus (look that up, he's put it in the Oxford).

On top of his originality, he has perfected the art of the smirk. He is a g*damn master of the smirk. The Olympic, FIA, World Champion smirker.

And don't you all forget it.

[nyc2la]

Originally Posted by Gamut

So I assume Mr.Stern needed to come up with a replacement of the Nautilus that does not go the Neptune route, because he does need models that are relatively easy to sell in order to maintain his business, while not becoming an excessively popular model like the Nautilus, which he had to terminate due to its side-effect.

So then he knowingly designed a watch with an inferior design? I don’t think he would say that.

I’ll add (and reiterate), it was poor judgement and decision making by TS. A shame, really.

[Ichiran]

As much as I dislike the Romain Gauthier Continuum, I do not evaluate him negatively because he has other brilliant watches in his line up, like the Logical 1 and Insight Micro-Rotor. Many collectors do like his Continuum though.

Similarly at Rolex I don't like all their offerings, for example the Deep-sea, Skydweller, YM2 and 42mm YM amongst a few others, but I'm sure other people like them because they sell, and I don't rate Rolex negatively simply because they have a few models I don't like.

Extrapolate this to other brands as well, there are always models I don't like but I don't hate the brands or the watchmakers for it because taste is never uniform.

Back to OP's question, Patek already has the connoisseurs series but they are in the highest complications. The 6301P's hand-finishing is as good as any independents whose name is not Rexhep.

[Cmmatthews]

I don't think its possible to be in a position like he is and have a grasp on reality.

[MangoTree1]

Originally Posted by nyc2la

I question TS’ judgement and can’t understand his decision — he discontinued the 5711 and replaced it with a watch with an inferior design.

He should have just left the 5711 in production. If he did that, the devotion would have remained high without all the negativity and self-inflicted chinks in the PP armor.

I wish someone in the room told TS that sometimes doing nothing is doing something.

How arrogant does you have to be to make a statement like that? Who are you?

Thierry i like you better with each of these comments!!!!

[enjoythemusic]

Thierry said he has about 20 more designs. For those who don't like this new design, there are 20 more possibilities, perhaps many more. If Thierry was a musician, it would be like going into the studio with the band and having the next two (rap / pop / trap / EDM) albums ready to record.

Heck, 20 songs is three albums worth for a talented prog band, mmmaybe four albums depending on talent.

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by Ichiran

As much as I dislike the Romain Gauthier Continuum, I do not evaluate him negatively because he has other brilliant watches in his line up, like the Logical 1 and Insight Micro-Rotor. Many collectors do like his Continuum though.

Similarly at Rolex I don't like all their offerings, for example the Deep-sea, Skydweller, YM2 and 42mm YM amongst a few others, but I'm sure other people like them because they sell, and I don't rate Rolex negatively simply because they have a few models I don't like.

Extrapolate this to other brands as well, there are always models I don't like but I don't hate the brands or the watchmakers for it because taste is never uniform.

Back to OP's question, Patek already has the connoisseurs series but they are in the highest complications. The 6301P's hand-finishing is as good as any independents whose name is not Rexhep.

Well said Michael