Be careful

[Johnnybonkel]

I sold my Panerai PAM 89 for $6k to buy a new president. I checked the money had been wired. It was received into my account and everything was cool - SO I THOUGHT. I bought my President and sent this Guy KELLY STUART IN CALIFORNIA - A THIEF...AND A VERY GOOD ONE! the watch.

Did you know wired money CAN BE REVERSED!!!!

I just had my $6000 taken back out of my account 8 days after receiving it as there are "no funds". The watch has gone. The phone number is out of service. The email he used now dead. I even used this Guys own UPS account to print shipped label - He was good!!!!( His "office manager sent me details of his UPS account - How to use a temporary password to enter it etc). The parcel was signed for at the address.

I've been had. Don't trust anything but pay pal. Even cashiers checks are no good unless you wait...SIX WEEKS!!!!!!!
Seriously - Cashiers checks are NOT SAFE!

I learnt all this the hard way.

The watch I lost was a Titanium LNIB PAM 89.

BE CAREFUL!

[MoBe]

Sorry to hear it Johnny.

How is it possible for wired money to be taken from your account,can you explain,I`ve never heard of this before?

[FeelingTheBlues]

Originally Posted by MoBe

Sorry to hear it Johnny.

How is it possible for wired money to be taken from your account,can you explain,I`ve never heard of this before?

x2! I always thought wired money was impossible to reverse...

Either way, I'm sorry about your misfortune and hope you can still work something out...

[Johnnybonkel]

Thanks...I didnt know wired money was not safe either. I just wired the money for my new President!

Its all about the initial "Banking terms" you get when you open an account. I bank with Wells Fargo and they have just confirmed that if you accept wired payment or Cashiers check you are not 100% safe. (I believe you can pay to have funds cleared faster). In future...Its paypal or cash for me.

My best friend is a stck broker and they deal in transferred money all the time. The issue here is the money is spent straight away so it cannot be recovered. If the money wired remains in your account then IT CAN BE TAKEN BACK. So if you recieve wired money - Move it...do not leave it in the same account as it was wired to or it can be reversed and incredibly the bank says "you've lost nothing...the money came in we've pulled it back...net/net no loss. They totally disregard I sent off my watch. Furthermore - as soon as you give you account number to someone to enable a wire - you have violated the terms of your banking agreement and so you loose. NEVER SHARE YOUR ACCOUNT NUMBER EVEN! (amazing isn't) it!)

[MoBe]

Originally Posted by Johnnybonkel

Thanks...I didnt know wired money was not safe either. I just wired the money for my new President!

Its all about the initial "Banking terms" you get when you open an account. I bank with Wells Fargo and they have just confirmed that if you accept wired payment or Cashiers check you are not 100% safe. (I believe you can pay to have funds cleared faster). In future...Its paypal or cash for me.

My best friend is a stck broker and they deal in transferred money all the time. The issue here is the money is spent straight away so it cannot be recovered. If the money wired remains in your account then IT CAN BE TAKEN BACK. So if you recieve wired money - Move it...do not leave it in the same account as it was wired to or it can be reversed and incredibly the bank says "you've lost nothing...the money came in we've pulled it back...net/net no loss. They totally disregard I sent off my watch. Furthermore - as soon as you give you account number to someone to enable a wire - you have violated the terms of your banking agreement and so you loose. NEVER SHARE YOUR ACCOUNT NUMBER EVEN! (amazing isn't) it!)

You mean the money that was deposited to your account was fraudulent and didn`t exist in the first place?

[Alcan]

Sounds like US banking procedures are different from Canadian. When someone wires money to me here in Canada, it doesn't come directly to my account. It's sent to my bank's head office where they verify it. Only after that are the funds transferred to my account in my branch. That's why it can take 2 - 3 days for a wire transfer to clear up here.

[Johnnybonkel]

If you have a good record with your bank (I'm a platinum member of Wells Fargo) then no hold is placed. 8 days it took and yes they reclaimed the money!!!

I feel so stupid but this Guy was so slick...Thanks John.

[ev8296]

i think the only way to reverse, is if he ( the buyer ) said it wasen't he who sent the wire?

[eag310]

even paypal will tell you "sorry customer open a claim directly with their credit card company there is nothing we can do." paypal will NOT protect you in an event of a charge back or unauthorized payment sent to you.

Even if you transfer the money out to another account your first account will go into negative balance and you still responsible for it.

next step if you haven't already file a police report.

[Rjwareagle]

Was it someone on the forum, eBay, or Craig's list? It's odd, this is the second or third story about this happening today.

[mastermixer]

Are you sure he sent a bank wire and not a direct deposit?

[Goiguidoc]

Waow!!! Thank you for the lesson.
Sorry you lost so much money.

[MonBK]

Originally Posted by mastermixer

Are you sure he sent a bank wire and not a direct deposit?

I read it as a cashiers check which we all now are fraudsters weapon.

[bayerische]

Thank god, over here a wire is a wire. When deposited, that's it. No "checking" anymore.

[HL65]

Wires are final once they go and can't be reversed. A wire can be investigated due to fraud but not simply reversed. They are Federal Fund wires and are cleared instantly by the way as well. Sorry....

[robertneville]

sorry to hear! hope you can work something out.