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Bwadd · 19 February 2011, 12:25 AM

First post, but I have been reading through this site for a couple years now...

Looking to purchase my first PAM, and have narrowed it down to one... the 177!

Love the look of the Titanium, and after seeing one in person on Valnetines day at a restaurant i was in with the wife, I think it might be time.

So I thought I would post my story here with a deal I'm working on and maybe you guys can help me answer some questions and figure out if this deal is going to work etc...

I have found a 177 on ebay with a BIN of $4400, which is a little below average resale price I believe. I am aware they are around $5800+ new.

Here is the link for the watch:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Panerai-Luminor-...item4aa85c0a69

Seller says it has a small scratch in the crystal at the 12 and a small piece of dust, I asked if it was noticeable for daily use, this was his reply to my email:

"No not at all, you have to be atleast a feet 8 inches away until you barely notice it."

I checked with our "1" Panerai AD in Toronto and the claim approx $700 to repair crystal and service. I would put an offer in for less to account for the possible repair later.

Since this is used, and if the scratch is not noticeable, it will be ok since it will be my daily watch. At least I will have the option to send it in for service in the future to have the watch repaired to like new...

My other concern is that i asked for better pictures which he says he will provide. I also asked for serial # to check authenticity, to which he replied he does not do that... yet his listing says her will provide the serial # and picture of certificate if requested... this is the red flag!

Thoughts, advice?

kilyung · 20 February 2011, 12:32 AM

Don't get off the Bay. Plenty of reputable sellers here and on other forums that can get you a clean 177. Why go through the hassle of a piece needing fixing?

DCgator · 20 February 2011, 12:44 AM

If you're not comfortable with the way seller is acting and seller is not giving straight answers then you should maybe pass on that watch and look elsewhere.

Good hunting and welcome aboard!

drtooth73 · 20 February 2011, 12:51 AM

Serial number is on the box.
if there is dust inside, you will have to do a service, also, that means there was some work done by non-Panerai tech.
Service is $700 including crystal? Give an offer with that in mind.
Or ask bodybump for the same watch in better condition at similar price.

44Jewels · 20 February 2011, 03:56 AM

I would pass on anything on ebay.

ocwatching · 20 February 2011, 09:15 AM

Panerais on the Bay is just a tough sell...
some of the guys here can source one for ya..

Speed · 20 February 2011, 10:33 AM

Try BodyBump and/or Mosco for PAMs

Athas · 20 February 2011, 08:26 PM

Careful with ebay

Stack · 20 February 2011, 09:46 PM

When I was looking to buy my first PAM i was thinking about the 177 and saw this exact one on ebay. I actually talked to the seller for a while through messages and is located in southern California and was willing to meet me at the Beverly Hills boutique to confirm authenticity and says that is where he got it from to begin with.

Just wanted to give you some info on it. This was about 2 months ago. So it's been a while that he hasn't been able to sell it.

akira23 · 21 February 2011, 01:32 AM

Due diligence! Buy the seller as well.....get more info...maybe have him email more close up pics as well!

Bwadd · 21 February 2011, 02:59 PM

just looking for some help with my first Panerai purchase. I have been around the site for a couple years, but only recently registered, and it looks like I'm pretty close to getting my first PAM....

Looking to pick up a 177 and recently came across one. I figured I would share some pictures and you guys can assure me I'm making the right move.

I have found a 177 H on ebay, here is the sellers description...

Important Notes:

Bought the watch a few years back brand new at beverly hills panerai boutique

and had rebrushed/refinish done on the titanium case

and bezel recently so it looks almost brand new. Aside from that, the crystal

has a small knick on 12 o'clock position and has a small tiny dust underneath,

this is easly replaced and removed once complete service is done by panerai.

That being said, the watch keeps time and power reserve flawlessly and its in great working condition

I will provide pictures of the ones the seller sent me, I tried posting the ebay link oreviously but I think it was removed.

I told the seller that to repair the watch here in Toronto, it would cost me approx $700 and he said we could discuss a better price once I made up my mind... I have an offer in mind but would prefer some feedback on authenticity before making my move... Any feedback as to what service and crystal would cost in the US. I am close to the border so I could have it done in the US instead of Canada.

I have requested further pictures of the face of the watch, another of the backing, and one with my name on a piece of paper along with the watch...

What do the experts say?

I'm thinking this is a good move, price is in my budget, it is the model that I really want, titanium, sandwich, seconds... etc. Since it is a used watch, and it will be worn daily. I can simply have it serviced and crystal replaced later down the line. From what I can see it looks legit, but I am new after all.

Stack · 21 February 2011, 04:26 PM

Is this same watch that your asking for help in this one?

http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=164472

ocwatching · 21 February 2011, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stack

Is this same watch that your asking for help in this one?

http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=164472

same one...and I guess he didn't like the responses?

Bwadd · 22 February 2011, 01:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stack

Is this same watch that your asking for help in this one?

http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=164472

Quote:

Originally Posted by ocwatching

same one...and I guess he didn't like the responses?

Sorry guys.... new to the forum, and for some reason I could not find my original post...

I submitted the post and searched everywhere for it and for some reason it never came up, even when I searched my latest posts nothing came up... weird... didnt mean to make a duplicate post.

mfer · 22 February 2011, 02:16 AM

Pass.

Bwadd · 22 February 2011, 03:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfer

Pass.

Care to explain?

ocwatching · 22 February 2011, 11:48 AM

Bwadd...

I know you are keen on this piece and the main motivator is the price. However, there seem to be too many red flags...

1) Does the serial number on the back of the watch match the sticker on the outer brown box?
2) It is not a complete set and obviously the price reflects this fact. Nothing wrong with buying non-complete sets but off ebay is a bit scary.
3) Buy the seller. If you hang around the forums enough you will know who's who.
4) If you feel any bit funny about the deal, trust your instincts.

Honestly, for the peace of mind. I would pass like what Mik says. Non-complete sets are harder to sell later ( you never know).

Save up a bit and maybe PM some of the sellers on this site to see what they can do.

I would wait and save and buy one that you are 100% sure of...

good luck...

Bwadd · 22 February 2011, 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ocwatching

Bwadd...

I know you are keen on this piece and the main motivator is the price. However, there seem to be too many red flags...

1) Does the serial number on the back of the watch match the sticker on the outer brown box?
2) It is not a complete set and obviously the price reflects this fact. Nothing wrong with buying non-complete sets but off ebay is a bit scary.
3) Buy the seller. If you hang around the forums enough you will know who's who.
4) If you feel any bit funny about the deal, trust your instincts.

Honestly, for the peace of mind. I would pass like what Mik says. Non-complete sets are harder to sell later ( you never know).

Save up a bit and maybe PM some of the sellers on this site to see what they can do.

I would wait and save and buy one that you are 100% sure of...

good luck...

Thanks for the info...

Not that many red flags....

1) serial # matches the box
2) it is a complete set ( see picture above)
3) Seller has been very good at sending me everything i have asked for.

I was hoping that you guys could confirm that it was not a fake, that it looked legit. I'm 98% certain that it is legit, was hoping for that 2% push.. LOL

Anyone have any feedback regarding Panerai service and crustal replace??

snog · 22 February 2011, 12:08 PM

even if this watch turned out to be real,I still think it is a bad deal,if by a small chance you were to get $700 knocked of the price for the repairs,it is still a second hand watch at just under new price because that $700 is not a saving but will be needed for the repairs,it has also been repolished and I bet that is when the dust got there,he doesn't say if it went to Panerai for that repolish and I would also think a service too because of the dust,if it was Panerai it would have the paper work to say so I would be asking for that,if not Panerai,sounds like it was a not so good watchmaker because of the dust,so you need to ask yourself why the service was needed and if a good job was done on it and were real Panerai parts used?

way too many doubts for me,buy from here.I bet you will be surprised at the price wou could get,and the watch will not have a chipped crystal,or dust or an unknow service history and a fresh case not a repolished one.

ocwatching · 22 February 2011, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bwadd

2) it is a complete set ( see picture above)

google and see more pix for a complete set for historic series...
this is not complete...

Bwadd · 22 February 2011, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by snog

even if this watch turned out to be real,I still think it is a bad deal,if by a small chance you were to get $700 knocked of the price for the repairs,it is still a second hand watch at just under new price because that $700 is not a saving but will be needed for the repairs,it has also been repolished and I bet that is when the dust got there,he doesn't say if it went to Panerai for that repolish and I would also think a service too because of the dust,if it was Panerai it would have the paper work to say so I would be asking for that,if not Panerai,sounds like it was a not so good watchmaker because of the dust,so you need to ask yourself why the service was needed and if a good job was done on it and were real Panerai parts used?

way too many doubts for me,buy from here.I bet you will be surprised at the price wou could get,and the watch will not have a chipped crystal,or dust or an unknow service history and a fresh case not a repolished one.

Very good points, I have seen a few 177 come up just this evening that I could get for a better price than dealing with these issues...

Quote:

Originally Posted by ocwatching

google and see more pix for a complete set for historic series...
this is not complete...

You are correct thanks!

Bwadd · 25 February 2011, 04:10 AM

Could someone please tell what is included in a complete set for a Historic model.

Maybe put it into list form, so I can make sure a seller has all the pieces...

Thanks

snog · 25 February 2011, 04:14 AM

can't help with that as I only know for sure what my Pam came with,you could always take a look in the for sale section,should have been some full sets sold in there with pics,untill you get a reply.

19 February 2011, 12:25 AM	#1
Bwadd "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 11	Help with my pruchase... First post, but I have been reading through this site for a couple years now... Looking to purchase my first PAM, and have narrowed it down to one... the 177! Love the look of the Titanium, and after seeing one in person on Valnetines day at a restaurant i was in with the wife, I think it might be time. So I thought I would post my story here with a deal I'm working on and maybe you guys can help me answer some questions and figure out if this deal is going to work etc... I have found a 177 on ebay with a BIN of $4400, which is a little below average resale price I believe. I am aware they are around $5800+ new. Here is the link for the watch: http://cgi.ebay.com/Panerai-Luminor-...item4aa85c0a69 Seller says it has a small scratch in the crystal at the 12 and a small piece of dust, I asked if it was noticeable for daily use, this was his reply to my email: "No not at all, you have to be atleast a feet 8 inches away until you barely notice it." I checked with our "1" Panerai AD in Toronto and the claim approx $700 to repair crystal and service. I would put an offer in for less to account for the possible repair later. Since this is used, and if the scratch is not noticeable, it will be ok since it will be my daily watch. At least I will have the option to send it in for service in the future to have the watch repaired to like new... My other concern is that i asked for better pictures which he says he will provide. I also asked for serial # to check authenticity, to which he replied he does not do that... yet his listing says her will provide the serial # and picture of certificate if requested... this is the red flag! Thoughts, advice?

20 February 2011, 09:15 AM	#6
ocwatching "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Real Name: Phil Location: CA Posts: 5,374	Panerais on the Bay is just a tough sell... some of the guys here can source one for ya.. __________________ too much into watches...

20 February 2011, 09:46 PM	#9
Stack "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Orange County, CA Watch: PAM312\|AP 15400ST Posts: 302	When I was looking to buy my first PAM i was thinking about the 177 and saw this exact one on ebay. I actually talked to the seller for a while through messages and is located in southern California and was willing to meet me at the Beverly Hills boutique to confirm authenticity and says that is where he got it from to begin with. Just wanted to give you some info on it. This was about 2 months ago. So it's been a while that he hasn't been able to sell it. __________________ PAM 312 Panerai Central \| Panerai Central Instagram

21 February 2011, 02:59 PM	#11
Bwadd "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 11	Help with my first.... just looking for some help with my first Panerai purchase. I have been around the site for a couple years, but only recently registered, and it looks like I'm pretty close to getting my first PAM.... Looking to pick up a 177 and recently came across one. I figured I would share some pictures and you guys can assure me I'm making the right move. I have found a 177 H on ebay, here is the sellers description... Important Notes: Bought the watch a few years back brand new at beverly hills panerai boutique and had rebrushed/refinish done on the titanium case and bezel recently so it looks almost brand new. Aside from that, the crystal has a small knick on 12 o'clock position and has a small tiny dust underneath, this is easly replaced and removed once complete service is done by panerai. That being said, the watch keeps time and power reserve flawlessly and its in great working condition I will provide pictures of the ones the seller sent me, I tried posting the ebay link oreviously but I think it was removed. I told the seller that to repair the watch here in Toronto, it would cost me approx $700 and he said we could discuss a better price once I made up my mind... I have an offer in mind but would prefer some feedback on authenticity before making my move... Any feedback as to what service and crystal would cost in the US. I am close to the border so I could have it done in the US instead of Canada. I have requested further pictures of the face of the watch, another of the backing, and one with my name on a piece of paper along with the watch... What do the experts say? I'm thinking this is a good move, price is in my budget, it is the model that I really want, titanium, sandwich, seconds... etc. Since it is a used watch, and it will be worn daily. I can simply have it serviced and crystal replaced later down the line. From what I can see it looks legit, but I am new after all. Attached Images

21 February 2011, 04:26 PM	#12
Stack "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Orange County, CA Watch: PAM312\|AP 15400ST Posts: 302	Is this same watch that your asking for help in this one? http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=164472 __________________ PAM 312 Panerai Central \| Panerai Central Instagram

20 February 2011, 12:32 AM	#2
kilyung "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Cave Watch: Sundial Posts: 33,962	Don't get off the Bay. Plenty of reputable sellers here and on other forums that can get you a clean 177. Why go through the hassle of a piece needing fixing?

20 February 2011, 12:44 AM	#3
DCgator "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: PNW Watch: DS,BLNR,SubLV,DJ2 Posts: 8,123	If you're not comfortable with the way seller is acting and seller is not giving straight answers then you should maybe pass on that watch and look elsewhere. Good hunting and welcome aboard!

20 February 2011, 12:51 AM	#4
drtooth73 Banned Join Date: Feb 2009 Real Name: W. Stutman Location: Motor City Watch: TT GMT IIC Posts: 2,223	Serial number is on the box. if there is dust inside, you will have to do a service, also, that means there was some work done by non-Panerai tech. Service is $700 including crystal? Give an offer with that in mind. Or ask bodybump for the same watch in better condition at similar price.

20 February 2011, 03:56 AM	#5
44Jewels Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: all over Watch: Daytona Posts: 56	I would pass on anything on ebay.

20 February 2011, 10:33 AM	#7
Speed "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: USA Posts: 19,749	Try BodyBump and/or Mosco for PAMs

20 February 2011, 08:26 PM	#8
Athas "TRF" Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Australia Watch: SD,Daytona,P233,PO Posts: 163	Careful with ebay

21 February 2011, 01:32 AM	#10
akira23 "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Real Name: Marty Location: Florida Watch: Pam 1313 Posts: 456	Due diligence! Buy the seller as well.....get more info...maybe have him email more close up pics as well!

22 February 2011, 02:16 AM	#15
mfer "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Real Name: Mik Location: USA Posts: 13,724	Pass. __________________ member#3242

22 February 2011, 11:48 AM	#17
ocwatching "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Real Name: Phil Location: CA Posts: 5,374	Bwadd... I know you are keen on this piece and the main motivator is the price. However, there seem to be too many red flags... 1) Does the serial number on the back of the watch match the sticker on the outer brown box? 2) It is not a complete set and obviously the price reflects this fact. Nothing wrong with buying non-complete sets but off ebay is a bit scary. 3) Buy the seller. If you hang around the forums enough you will know who's who. 4) If you feel any bit funny about the deal, trust your instincts. Honestly, for the peace of mind. I would pass like what Mik says. Non-complete sets are harder to sell later ( you never know). Save up a bit and maybe PM some of the sellers on this site to see what they can do. I would wait and save and buy one that you are 100% sure of... good luck... __________________ too much into watches...

22 February 2011, 12:08 PM	#19
snog "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: UK Posts: 908	even if this watch turned out to be real,I still think it is a bad deal,if by a small chance you were to get $700 knocked of the price for the repairs,it is still a second hand watch at just under new price because that $700 is not a saving but will be needed for the repairs,it has also been repolished and I bet that is when the dust got there,he doesn't say if it went to Panerai for that repolish and I would also think a service too because of the dust,if it was Panerai it would have the paper work to say so I would be asking for that,if not Panerai,sounds like it was a not so good watchmaker because of the dust,so you need to ask yourself why the service was needed and if a good job was done on it and were real Panerai parts used? way too many doubts for me,buy from here.I bet you will be surprised at the price wou could get,and the watch will not have a chipped crystal,or dust or an unknow service history and a fresh case not a repolished one.

25 February 2011, 04:10 AM	#22
Bwadd "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 11	Complete set Could someone please tell what is included in a complete set for a Historic model. Maybe put it into list form, so I can make sure a seller has all the pieces... Thanks

25 February 2011, 04:14 AM	#23
snog "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: UK Posts: 908	can't help with that as I only know for sure what my Pam came with,you could always take a look in the for sale section,should have been some full sets sold in there with pics,untill you get a reply.

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