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5onic · 17 June 2009, 01:00 AM

Apart from the obvious cosmetic change does anyone know is there are any mechanical differences between the two ?

I have not heard many issues regarding the earlier 233s (apart from they take a bit more winding ?) so curious as to why the change.

Thanks

Steve

argee1977 · 17 June 2009, 01:12 AM

God knows why they changed it, people like Panerai with a nice clean dial, the dot was easy to use and didn't spoil the dial. The AM/PM isn't too great in my mind, what's the point of having a second hand on the sub-dial that uses the sub-dial as a 24 hour dial.

It's a waste of effort for me, there will have had to be minor tweaks to the movement to accomodate the AM/PM indicator and additional hand, but nothing more than that, if anything i'd think this would reduce the power of the watch?

Trurolexer · 17 June 2009, 01:45 AM

I love dot, but if someday someone offer me the 233 with AM/PM with a good price, I will grab it!!!

rotan · 17 June 2009, 01:51 AM

I love the dot....

TswaneNguni · 17 June 2009, 01:52 AM

I prefer "The Dotted" one .

rotan · 17 June 2009, 01:57 AM

It's the same as the IWC Big Pilot 5002 vs 5004. Don't know why they go change the design as 5002 is more true to its origins and it's much nicer IMO.

Trurolexer · 17 June 2009, 01:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rotan

It's the same as the IWC Big Pilot 5002 vs 5004. Don't know why they go change the design as 5002 is more true to its origins and it's much nicer IMO.

But the hands is more close to original one is 5004 IMO.

rotan · 17 June 2009, 02:01 AM

But 5002 nicer.... Of course it's my opinion.... It looks closer to the B-Uhr if I'm not wrong...

Trurolexer · 17 June 2009, 02:39 AM

I love 5002 too, that's my Grail watch...

rotan · 17 June 2009, 04:23 AM

Thinking of getting it too... Pretty rare in the market now though...

5onic · 17 June 2009, 04:31 AM

Im a dot person myself :-) (and will own one before March 2010 :-))

rotan · 17 June 2009, 07:02 PM

Great! Go for it Bro!

Trurolexer · 17 June 2009, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rotan

Thinking of getting it too... Pretty rare in the market now though...

What? Big Pilot? Great!!! 5002 or 5004?

Zed · 17 June 2009, 09:34 PM

has anyone seen the 233 am/pm... i only saw the Dot..

louie · 17 June 2009, 10:59 PM

nope not anywhere in Singapore yet...

rotan · 18 June 2009, 12:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trurolexer

What? Big Pilot? Great!!! 5002 or 5004?

Think only... Planning stages... But if I get will be 5002 for sure...

tech_controller · 19 June 2009, 06:56 PM

Prefer the Dot here...as I was thinking about pulling the trigger on the 270 but that am/pm indicator was just a tad too cluttered for me...

argee1977 · 19 June 2009, 11:26 PM

One day Panerai will tell us why they did this, adding the AM/PM just removes the basic princple of keeping the dial clean and easy to read

In my business we have a saying, 'keep it simple stupid', and that's what the dot was, it was like the sun, when it was white it was daytime, black was nighttime and it was easy to understand, so 4am would be black, 4pm would be white and everybody knew how to use it with ease and with just a glance.

Now we have the AM/PM, which adds an extra hand onto the subdial, you have to then look at it and work out where the little hands pointing as it uses the subdial like a 24 hour clock, then you look at the GMT hand to get the hour, it's not easy to quickly glance and work out the time and it's butt ugly

rotan · 20 June 2009, 01:12 AM

The am/pm indicator is not really that ugly.. The bad thing is it makes the whole dial cluttered. And most of us would agree that Panerai is all about simplicity so having that just takes off that origin of Panerai. I would love the 233 to have the number "9" and smaller sub seconds dial. That would really make it perfect IMO.

argee1977 · 20 June 2009, 04:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rotan

The am/pm indicator is not really that ugly.. The bad thing is it makes the whole dial cluttered. And most of us would agree that Panerai is all about simplicity so having that just takes off that origin of Panerai. I would love the 233 to have the number "9" and smaller sub seconds dial. That would really make it perfect IMO.

Again i'm not a fan of the smaller subdials, that's more a radiomir thing, if you like that configuration then the 312 has the smaller radiomir style subdial.

hflee55 · 20 June 2009, 10:48 AM

Dottie for me...

GBJIV · 20 June 2009, 04:08 PM

dot for me as well.

TswaneNguni · 20 June 2009, 04:15 PM

Dotted it is .......

Zed · 21 June 2009, 05:30 PM

Still guys, i think it is a smoke screen.. no one i know have seen the 233 with the am/pm, only the dot... the am/pm is on the 270... anyone can confirm that they have seen it??????????????

rotan · 21 June 2009, 11:53 PM

Think it's on the L series. Don't think the L is out yet... As least not in Singapore..

argee1977 · 22 June 2009, 01:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zed

Still guys, i think it is a smoke screen.. no one i know have seen the 233 with the am/pm, only the dot... the am/pm is on the 270... anyone can confirm that they have seen it??????????????

It's in the 2009 catalogue, when they're released later this year they will have the AM/PM indicator, and cost £8400.

rotan · 22 June 2009, 03:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by argee1977

It's in the 2009 catalogue, when they're released later this year they will have the AM/PM indicator, and cost £8400.

So how does it look? Can post some photos pls? I'm dying to see it... Only to be relieved my dot is nicer

Zed · 22 June 2009, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by argee1977

It's in the 2009 catalogue, when they're released later this year they will have the AM/PM indicator, and cost £8400.

Thanks Ryan,
i am glad i've got the DOT coming my way ..

argee1977 · 23 June 2009, 12:23 AM

I've only seen it in pictures, it's not really something i'm a fan off, the AM/PM thing was what put me off the 270, and i had the chance of a BNIB 270 but just couldn't get over the cluttered dial and that 9 that seems to be forced onto the dial

rotan · 23 June 2009, 02:19 AM

It seems that you are right on this . Panerai=Simple. So anything complicated just don't do it for Panerai. That is why I love 233 in the first place and now I love the 312 too.

17 June 2009, 01:00 AM	#1
5onic Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Real Name: Steve Location: Little Ann, UK Watch: Panerai 233K Posts: 96	233 Dot vs AM/PM Apart from the obvious cosmetic change does anyone know is there are any mechanical differences between the two ? I have not heard many issues regarding the earlier 233s (apart from they take a bit more winding ?) so curious as to why the change. Thanks Steve

17 June 2009, 01:12 AM	#2
argee1977 "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Real Name: Ryan Location: England Watch: AP ROC Posts: 1,462	God knows why they changed it, people like Panerai with a nice clean dial, the dot was easy to use and didn't spoil the dial. The AM/PM isn't too great in my mind, what's the point of having a second hand on the sub-dial that uses the sub-dial as a 24 hour dial. It's a waste of effort for me, there will have had to be minor tweaks to the movement to accomodate the AM/PM indicator and additional hand, but nothing more than that, if anything i'd think this would reduce the power of the watch? __________________ PANERAI, MORE THAN A WATCH, LESS THAN A KITKAT

17 June 2009, 01:51 AM	#4
rotan "TRF" Member Join Date: May 2009 Real Name: Leong Location: Singapore Watch: AP 15202ST Posts: 210	I love the dot.... __________________ Rolex Batman 116710BLNR Audemars Piguet 15202ST H series

17 June 2009, 01:57 AM	#6
rotan "TRF" Member Join Date: May 2009 Real Name: Leong Location: Singapore Watch: AP 15202ST Posts: 210	It's the same as the IWC Big Pilot 5002 vs 5004. Don't know why they go change the design as 5002 is more true to its origins and it's much nicer IMO. __________________ Rolex Batman 116710BLNR Audemars Piguet 15202ST H series

17 June 2009, 02:01 AM	#8
rotan "TRF" Member Join Date: May 2009 Real Name: Leong Location: Singapore Watch: AP 15202ST Posts: 210	But 5002 nicer.... Of course it's my opinion.... It looks closer to the B-Uhr if I'm not wrong... __________________ Rolex Batman 116710BLNR Audemars Piguet 15202ST H series

17 June 2009, 01:45 AM	#3
Trurolexer Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: USA Watch: 5513MaxiI+PreComex Posts: 18,421	I love dot, but if someday someone offer me the 233 with AM/PM with a good price, I will grab it!!!

17 June 2009, 01:52 AM	#5
TswaneNguni "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Real Name: Chris Location: . Watch: Daytonas/Subs/GMTs Posts: 12,609	I prefer "The Dotted" one .

17 June 2009, 02:39 AM	#9
Trurolexer Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: USA Watch: 5513MaxiI+PreComex Posts: 18,421	I love 5002 too, that's my Grail watch...

17 June 2009, 04:23 AM	#10
rotan "TRF" Member Join Date: May 2009 Real Name: Leong Location: Singapore Watch: AP 15202ST Posts: 210	Thinking of getting it too... Pretty rare in the market now though... __________________ Rolex Batman 116710BLNR Audemars Piguet 15202ST H series

17 June 2009, 04:31 AM	#11
5onic Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Real Name: Steve Location: Little Ann, UK Watch: Panerai 233K Posts: 96	Im a dot person myself :-) (and will own one before March 2010 :-))

17 June 2009, 07:02 PM	#12
rotan "TRF" Member Join Date: May 2009 Real Name: Leong Location: Singapore Watch: AP 15202ST Posts: 210	Great! Go for it Bro! __________________ Rolex Batman 116710BLNR Audemars Piguet 15202ST H series

17 June 2009, 09:34 PM	#14
Zed Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: UK Watch: Panerai 186 & 233 Posts: 489	has anyone seen the 233 am/pm... i only saw the Dot..

17 June 2009, 10:59 PM	#15
louie "TRF" Member Join Date: May 2008 Real Name: Louis Location: Earth Watch: The Beast Posts: 1,352	nope not anywhere in Singapore yet... __________________ " I THINK PERFECTION IS UGLY. SOMEWHERE IN THE THINGS HUMANS MAKE, I WANT TO SEE SCARS, FAILURE, DISORDER AND DISTORTION" - YOHJI YAMAMOTO

19 June 2009, 06:56 PM	#17
tech_controller 2025 Pledge Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Real Name: Daniel Location: みな& Watch: Me Bleed... Posts: 690	Prefer the Dot here...as I was thinking about pulling the trigger on the 270 but that am/pm indicator was just a tad too cluttered for me... __________________ M336934 \|126711CHNR \| 326935 \| 11613 black \| 11613 serti \| 16610 \| 116660 \| 116610LV \| 116713LN 116519 panda \| 116710LN \| 116713LB \| 116713LB diamond

19 June 2009, 11:26 PM	#18
argee1977 "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Real Name: Ryan Location: England Watch: AP ROC Posts: 1,462	One day Panerai will tell us why they did this, adding the AM/PM just removes the basic princple of keeping the dial clean and easy to read In my business we have a saying, 'keep it simple stupid', and that's what the dot was, it was like the sun, when it was white it was daytime, black was nighttime and it was easy to understand, so 4am would be black, 4pm would be white and everybody knew how to use it with ease and with just a glance. Now we have the AM/PM, which adds an extra hand onto the subdial, you have to then look at it and work out where the little hands pointing as it uses the subdial like a 24 hour clock, then you look at the GMT hand to get the hour, it's not easy to quickly glance and work out the time and it's butt ugly __________________ PANERAI, MORE THAN A WATCH, LESS THAN A KITKAT

20 June 2009, 01:12 AM	#19
rotan "TRF" Member Join Date: May 2009 Real Name: Leong Location: Singapore Watch: AP 15202ST Posts: 210	The am/pm indicator is not really that ugly.. The bad thing is it makes the whole dial cluttered. And most of us would agree that Panerai is all about simplicity so having that just takes off that origin of Panerai. I would love the 233 to have the number "9" and smaller sub seconds dial. That would really make it perfect IMO. __________________ Rolex Batman 116710BLNR Audemars Piguet 15202ST H series

20 June 2009, 10:48 AM	#21
hflee55 "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Real Name: Andy Location: Kuala Lumpur, MY Watch: Me Watching You!! Posts: 3,260	Dottie for me...

20 June 2009, 04:08 PM	#22
GBJIV "TRF" Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Real Name: Jackson Location: So. California Posts: 2,893	dot for me as well. __________________ Jackson

20 June 2009, 04:15 PM	#23
TswaneNguni "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Real Name: Chris Location: . Watch: Daytonas/Subs/GMTs Posts: 12,609	Dotted it is ....... Attached Images

21 June 2009, 05:30 PM	#24
Zed Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: UK Watch: Panerai 186 & 233 Posts: 489	Still guys, i think it is a smoke screen.. no one i know have seen the 233 with the am/pm, only the dot... the am/pm is on the 270... anyone can confirm that they have seen it??????????????

21 June 2009, 11:53 PM	#25
rotan "TRF" Member Join Date: May 2009 Real Name: Leong Location: Singapore Watch: AP 15202ST Posts: 210	Think it's on the L series. Don't think the L is out yet... As least not in Singapore.. __________________ Rolex Batman 116710BLNR Audemars Piguet 15202ST H series

23 June 2009, 12:23 AM	#29
argee1977 "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Real Name: Ryan Location: England Watch: AP ROC Posts: 1,462	I've only seen it in pictures, it's not really something i'm a fan off, the AM/PM thing was what put me off the 270, and i had the chance of a BNIB 270 but just couldn't get over the cluttered dial and that 9 that seems to be forced onto the dial __________________ PANERAI, MORE THAN A WATCH, LESS THAN A KITKAT

23 June 2009, 02:19 AM	#30
rotan "TRF" Member Join Date: May 2009 Real Name: Leong Location: Singapore Watch: AP 15202ST Posts: 210	It seems that you are right on this . Panerai=Simple. So anything complicated just don't do it for Panerai. That is why I love 233 in the first place and now I love the 312 too. __________________ Rolex Batman 116710BLNR Audemars Piguet 15202ST H series

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