A confirmation came from the Isle of Man, and the wait begins

[Ichiran]

My AD is an official partner of Roger Smith and he was invited to meet up with a small group of collectors in October 2023. Over the session, Roger heartily shared information of his manufacture, his watches and of course, stories of the late George Daniels. It was fun sitting next to a watchmaker who is charming, witty and passionate about his crafts.

He was wearing his Series 1 Great Britain (pictured) and we were given all the time to handle it. I was blown away by the fantastic engine-turned dial. It is simple but the Union Jack is subtle and tastefully done with his signature blue hands. The movement (sorry for the poor picture) does not have the typical anglage we see on other Swiss independents and there are no interior angles, but I respect his philosophy that focuses more on the mechanical aspects of the watches.

He told us his current production is 18 pieces annually and to date, he has made 150 watches since he started his career. He used to produce less watches but 18 is the current number. He also shared he is starting on a new Series 6 but I'm not sure if that info is embargoed hence can't divulge here now.

I understand he is not taking on new orders as the order book has been closed for a few years. After the meet up, I then tried my luck with my AD because my AD could have placed an order earlier with no particular allocation to a customer. This shooting the moon tactic works thankfully

After a few calls and emails, I decided on the Series 5 open dial (will post a pic in the next post). This means I will not get to enjoy the famed guilloche but I thought the open dial is aesthetically more appealing to me and I will enjoy that dial more. I also have some options with the engravings behind.

In terms of delivery, I'm not sure when I will get it and that remains to be ironed out with my AD. I will be expected to pay a 30% deposit closer to delivery date. Caroline informed me each watch takes 2 years to manufacture, and the variable here is when they will start to make my watch. The total duration is the start date plus another 2 years.

In the Patek subforum, I have a thread for an application for a minute repeater and that has since been canned due to my preference for this Series 5. All my friends have advised me against choosing a simple 4-hander over a minute repeater but I have followed my heart. I have also dropped my order for a Vingt-8 with the same AD. Effectively I'm choosing the Series 5 over a Patek MR plus a Vingt-8. It's ridiculous I know

Sorry for this long post and I hope to update as soon as I get more news from my AD.

[Ichiran]

This is a picture of the Series 5 which I took from A Collected Man. I'm so smitten with it.

[Russell996]

Many congratulations and I look forward to reading about the journey to ownership.

[1William]

Nice.

[ChetBaker]

That’s a lovely piece. Open dial is much nicer to look at. Look forward to your updates.

[ButtButt]

Amazing choice and congrats, can't wait to see photos of the journey.

[brandrea]

Wow, congratulations (in advance) Michael

Your collecting journey is super interesting to follow. Thanks for taking us along

[Ichiran]

Originally Posted by Russell996

Many congratulations and I look forward to reading about the journey to ownership.

Originally Posted by 1William

Nice.

Originally Posted by ChetBaker

That’s a lovely piece. Open dial is much nicer to look at. Look forward to your updates.

Originally Posted by ButtButt

Amazing choice and congrats, can't wait to see photos of the journey.

Thank you!
I will update along the way as and when I hear from my AD or Caroline.

[Ichiran]

Originally Posted by brandrea

Wow, congratulations (in advance) Michael

Your collecting journey is super interesting to follow. Thanks for taking us along

Thanks Brian!
Finger cross the wait is not too long. That said, I felt like I have almost come to the end of my collecting journey. If this is my last watch, I'm contented.

[enjoythemusic]

Wow... incredible.... and agree with your decision.

well-played.jpg

[rockdrock]

My dear friend, congratulations ! Well deserved and I can see how this will be well placed along your amazing collection.

[FrugalGreubel]

That’s amazing news. Congrats on being one of the truly lucky few. I love seeing watches like this get into the hands of well deserving collectors.

[Ichiran]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Wow... incredible.... and agree with your decision.

Originally Posted by FrugalGreubel

That’s amazing news. Congrats on being one of the truly lucky few. I love seeing watches like this get into the hands of well deserving collectors.

Thank you!

Originally Posted by rockdrock

My dear friend, congratulations ! Well deserved and I can see how this will be well placed along your amazing collection.

Thanks my dear friend, for giving me invaluable input during my deliberation process! Always appreciate your knowledge and views!

[Justindo]

Congratulations, but it will be a tough wait. They are amazing watches in the metal, especially when you consider the handwork involved. It will be a capstone piece for sure. Cheers!

[JMac6]

Originally Posted by Ichiran

My AD is an official partner of Roger Smith and he was invited to meet up with a small group of collectors in October 2023. Over the session, Roger heartily shared information of his manufacture, his watches and of course, stories of the late George Daniels. It was fun sitting next to a watchmaker who is charming, witty and passionate about his crafts.

He was wearing his Series 1 Great Britain (pictured) and we were given all the time to handle it. I was blown away by the fantastic engine-turned dial. It is simple but the Union Jack is subtle and tastefully done with his signature blue hands. The movement (sorry for the poor picture) does not have the typical anglage we see on other Swiss independents and there are no interior angles, but I respect his philosophy that focuses more on the mechanical aspects of the watches.

He told us his current production is 18 pieces annually and to date, he has made 150 watches since he started his career. He used to produce less watches but 18 is the current number. He also shared he is starting on a new Series 6 but I'm not sure if that info is embargoed hence can't divulge here now.

I understand he is not taking on new orders as the order book has been closed for a few years. After the meet up, I then tried my luck with my AD because my AD could have placed an order earlier with no particular allocation to a customer. This shooting the moon tactic works thankfully

After a few calls and emails, I decided on the Series 5 open dial (will post a pic in the next post). This means I will not get to enjoy the famed guilloche but I thought the open dial is aesthetically more appealing to me and I will enjoy that dial more. I also have some options with the engravings behind.

In terms of delivery, I'm not sure when I will get it and that remains to be ironed out with my AD. I will be expected to pay a 30% deposit closer to delivery date. Caroline informed me each watch takes 2 years to manufacture, and the variable here is when they will start to make my watch. The total duration is the start date plus another 2 years.

In the Patek subforum, I have a thread for an application for a minute repeater and that has since been canned due to my preference for this Series 5. All my friends have advised me against choosing a simple 4-hander over a minute repeater but I have followed my heart. I have also dropped my order for a Vingt-8 with the same AD. Effectively I'm choosing the Series 5 over a Patek MR plus a Vingt-8. It's ridiculous I know

Sorry for this long post and I hope to update as soon as I get more news from my AD.

I have to ask - is the cost of the Series 5 really a Patek MR + a Vingt-8? i.e., somewhere in the realm of $500,000? Whether it is worth it or not is obviously up to the person ordering. But that is far higher than I thought it was.

[Ichiran]

Originally Posted by JMac6

I have to ask - is the cost of the Series 5 really a Patek MR + a Vingt-8? i.e., somewhere in the realm of $500,000? Whether it is worth it or not is obviously up to the person ordering. But that is far higher than I thought it was.

The price of the Series 5 in Oct 2023 was £391,200 (gold) and £411,200 (platinum) respectively. Comparatively the pricing of 5178G and platinum Vingt-8 in Oct 2023 were CHF 430,000 and CHF 95,800, totaling CHF 525,800, or approximately £480,000.

The Patek MR + Vingt-8 is definitely more expensive, but I canned my Vingt-8 order because I have another Vingt-8 ordered, and it doesn't make sense for me to have 2 Vingt-8 given the number of other interesting watches in the market

[WatchEater666]

Curious, what appeals to you about someone like Roger Smith VS some of the other pieces you have en route like Gauthier/Kari/etc?

To me, the others seem like a substantial quality difference, but maybe I'm missing something.

[kunlun]

Originally Posted by JMac6

I have to ask - is the cost of the Series 5 really a Patek MR + a Vingt-8? i.e., somewhere in the realm of $500,000? Whether it is worth it or not is obviously up to the person ordering. But that is far higher than I thought it was.

RWS prices rose dramatically after auction results went up.

Originally Posted by WatchEater666

Curious, what appeals to you about someone like Roger Smith VS some of the other pieces you have en route like Gauthier/Kari/etc?

To me, the others seem like a substantial quality difference, but maybe I'm missing something.

How so? Interested in your thoughts. Surely we're not talking about the finishing styles?

[Ichiran]

Originally Posted by Justindo

Congratulations, but it will be a tough wait. They are amazing watches in the metal, especially when you consider the handwork involved. It will be a capstone piece for sure. Cheers!

Thank you!

[Ichiran]

Originally Posted by kunlun

RWS prices rose dramatically after auction results went up.

Yes, RWS prices appear to follow auction prices. These auction results also featured prominently in his website.

[Ichiran]

Originally Posted by WatchEater666

Curious, what appeals to you about someone like Roger Smith VS some of the other pieces you have en route like Gauthier/Kari/etc?

To me, the others seem like a substantial quality difference, but maybe I'm missing something.

The movements of RWS watches do not have the typical anglage we see in other Swiss independents and there are no interior angles, but I respect his philosophy that focuses more on the mechanical aspects of the watches. RWS is a protege of George Daniels whose watches are also finished in the same way.

That said, there appears to be 4 inward angles on 1 bridge of the Series 5. I haven't had the chance to use a loupe but it is obvious in pictures.

[WatchEater666]

Originally Posted by kunlun

RWS prices rose dramatically after auction results went up.



How so? Interested in your thoughts. Surely we're not talking about the finishing styles?

Originally Posted by Ichiran

The movements of RWS watches do not have the typical anglage we see in other Swiss independents and there are no interior angles, but I respect his philosophy that focuses more on the mechanical aspects of the watches. RWS is a protege of George Daniels whose watches are also finished in the same way.

That said, there appears to be 4 inward angles on 1 bridge of the Series 5. I haven't had the chance to use a loupe but it is obvious in pictures.

For me, it's just stuff like this:
https://quillandpad.com/2015/04/10/b...mith-series-2/

In both the image immediately above and the prior dial-side images, some of the glitches with this particular example of the Series 2 become evident, including the rough edges of the Romans VII and VIII, uneven lacquer fill in some of the engraved numerals, and (a bit less visible) non-uniform color of the blued hands.

There are probably another half dozen images I've seen from auctions with equally avoidable errors. It's not like these require a macro lesn/tons of zoom to see really.

To me, those are mistakes you won't ever see on some of the other watches you have on order. IE Gauthier, Voutilainen & Pinaud. RW also uses CNC now so I don't think the handmade aspect has much credence.

I don't want to shit on this thread though lol, wasn't my intention, was more so genuinely curious what made you fall in love with RW VS the other pieces you have en route, which make way more sense to me.

[Ichiran]

Originally Posted by WatchEater666

I don't want to shit on this thread though lol, wasn't my intention, was more so genuinely curious what made you fall in love with RW VS the other pieces you have en route, which make way more sense to me.

No problem, I have a tolerance for handmade watches. I'm very drawn to the aesthetics of the Series 5 and that alone is good enough for me. I also buy Patek for the same reason.

[WatchEater666]

Originally Posted by Ichiran

No problem, I have a tolerance for handmade watches. I'm very drawn by the aesthetics of the Series 5 and that alone is good enough for me.

Yeah the movement architecture is nice.

[BNA/LION]

Beautiful! Really interesting and I'm very happy for you. Thanks for sharing!

[Ichiran]

Originally Posted by BNA/LION

Beautiful! Really interesting and I'm very happy for you. Thanks for sharing!

Thanks Larry!

[mozchron]

Whoa. I don't think I'll ever get a chance to see a Roger Smith, let alone own one :). Congrats!

[FrugalGreubel]

Originally Posted by mozchron

Whoa. I don't think I'll ever get a chance to see a Roger Smith, let alone own one :). Congrats!

I’m pretty sure Ichiran said when he gets his we can all take turns borrowing it for a few days :)

But damn you’re right I don’t think I’ll probably ever see one in person either. Kind of crazy to think about how rare they truly are.

[Ichiran]

Originally Posted by mozchron

Whoa. I don't think I'll ever get a chance to see a Roger Smith, let alone own one :). Congrats!

Thank you, I'm just lucky I have a good relationship with my AD

Originally Posted by FrugalGreubel

I’m pretty sure Ichiran said when he gets his we can all take turns borrowing it for a few days :)

But damn you’re right I don’t think I’ll probably ever see one in person either. Kind of crazy to think about how rare they truly are.

With the increase in production to 18 per year, we are expecting to see more RWS watches released

[Ichiran]

No update for my watch but I saw this in IG. It's a customized Series 3 open dial for another customer. This is other-worldly spectacular. It makes my Series 5 look ordinary