Panerai market

[Coffee]

Is it worth purchasing one? Will it hold it's value? I understand the whole if you like it just get it.. but I like to buy on a policy of not losing money when I know I won't have it forever more than likely. Look forward to hearing your opinions.

[JP Chestnut]

It's impossible to guess. However a strong collector community tends to be required for a flip which doesn't lose you money. I'm not sure his brand has that anymore.

[Cru Jones]

If that's your biggest concern, start with a 000, 005 or 111 used and you'll be fine.

[nick c]

Originally Posted by Cru Jones

If that's your biggest concern, start with a 000, 005 or 111 used and you'll be fine.

X2

[Urosfan]

Originally Posted by cru jones

if that's your biggest concern, start with a 000, 005 or 111 used and you'll be fine.

x2

[TickTopia]

Originally Posted by cru jones

if that's your biggest concern, start with a 000, 005 or 111 used and you'll be fine.

+1

[Randy]

Purchase a base model and you'll only lose several hundred when you sell, given you acquire a discount from retail. Panerai has lost a huge segment of collectors due to obvious reasons. Best to purchase a Rolex if you want better resale value.

[Ruud Van Driver]

Originally Posted by Randy

Purchase a base model and you'll only lose several hundred when you sell, given you acquire a discount from retail. Panerai has lost a huge segment of collectors due to obvious reasons. Best to purchase a Rolex if you want better resale value.

This depends where you buy. Try getting a discount on new Panerai in the UK and you'll be disappointed. Sure, they are possible but usuallyonly if you have a relationship with an AD.

I was worried about resale value and agree with your comment about picking a Rolex instead. However, there's nothing more I want to add that's hugely different to what I already own (not a fan of pm or dress watches) hence me now looking at Panerai

[nigelUK]

Originally Posted by Cru Jones

If that's your biggest concern, start with a 000, 005 or 111 used and you'll be fine.

X 5 !

Do not get 1000, 1005 new base logo's ... They will not hold value. IMHO

[Coffee]

Originally Posted by Cru Jones

If that's your biggest concern, start with a 000, 005 or 111 used and you'll be fine.

Thank you for this. I intended on buying used, I should have mentioned that.

[improviz]

Crap, duplicate, sorry...

[improviz]

Originally Posted by Coffee

Thank you for this. I intended on buying used, I should have mentioned that.

Glad they banned this guy. Seems to me to be the same guy who's been posting here as chrisrolexguy and other handles with same MO, always starting gobs of "should I buy this or that" threads (in fact some with the same topics as those started by chrisrolexguy), or others with mundane questions, etc...

[WristEnvy]

Originally Posted by Cru Jones

If that's your biggest concern, start with a 000, 005 or 111 used and you'll be fine.

Do you think the same is true for a minty preowned 233?

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

[josephashburnnn]

My perception: Panerai is a sinking ship.

[Ruud Van Driver]

Originally Posted by josephashburnnn

My perception: Panerai is a sinking ship.

On what basis have you formed that opinion?

OP, I asked a similar question recently and was given the same advice. However, the 'solid' models which hold their value really do not appeal to me so I'm going with what I like. However, I'm not a pathological flipper; I buy to wear and each of very modest collection gets worn for a week at a time.

If you're buying with the intention to flip and really don't want to get burnt, then buy used. Again, that's not an option that appeals to me because, whilst I don't like scratches on my watches, any that happen to find their way there I want to have put them on myself

[eyeheartny]

Originally Posted by josephashburnnn

My perception: Panerai is a sinking ship.

Based on what specific evidence, facts, etc, beyond your perception?

[masyv6]

Originally Posted by josephashburnnn

My perception: Panerai is a sinking ship.

I agree. The Due collection that they recently released was silly, to me. I like some of the older models (like the PAM 512) but I find most Panerai models to be less than desirable.

[rootbeer7]

how do the Pam guys feel about 424 with date?

[stockae92]

Originally Posted by rootbeer7

how do the Pam guys feel about 424 with date?

If you want a 424, get the no date version. Its much more pleasing to the eyes.

Most people would be after the no date version as well.

On the other hand, the date version would be a short production and may be the value will sky rocket 30 yr later ... who knows. :D

[rootbeer7]

Originally Posted by stockae92

If you want a 424, get the no date version. Its much more pleasing to the eyes.

Most people would be after the no date version as well.

On the other hand, the date version would be a short production and may be the value will sky rocket 30 yr later ... who knows. :D

thanks, not sure I can handle a no-date watch (don't abuse me!!)

[Cru Jones]

Originally Posted by rootbeer7

thanks, not sure I can handle a no-date watch (don't abuse me!!)

The no date version is probably the smarter buy, value wise if you want to flip, but I actually prefer the aesthetics of the original date version with that particular Cali/gold hands combo. Definitely get what you like best, and then you don't have to worry about flipping it....

[vman]

+1 on the 111 model. Bought mine brand new and sold with a minimal loss. As for the brand, it needs to tighten up a bit. The lineup of model is all over the place and, frankly, the brand has been overplayed. It used to be more of a boutique player, but the market got oversaturated quickly while the perceived quality of the movements lagged behind. While I would love to get a Panerai again, I just can't shell out that much $ for a watch given other opportunities out there... As far as non-Rolex pieces go, JLC, VC, GO, PP and even Nomos are much better buys-and-keeps IMHO.

[eyeheartny]

Originally Posted by vman

+1 on the 111 model. Bought mine brand new and sold with a minimal loss. As for the brand, it needs to tighten up a bit. The lineup of model is all over the place and, frankly, the brand has been overplayed. It used to be more of a boutique player, but the market got oversaturated quickly while the perceived quality of the movements lagged behind. While I would love to get a Panerai again, I just can't shell out that much $ for a watch given other opportunities out there... As far as non-Rolex pieces go, JLC, VC, GO, PP and even Nomos are much better buys-and-keeps IMHO.

The Nomos secondary market is soft. Have you looked at WatchRecon? They're such a small brand that they aren't even close to the top 10 on WR and when I was considering them I saw some pretty dramatic price drops on LNIB pieces...close to 30% for pieces a few months old. I wouldn't really say JLC has a great secondary market either; at least 30% discounts for LNIB or lightly used pieces. VC and PP are way above Panerai price points so not really a fair comparison either. I'm not saying Panerai doesn't have a weak secondary market, but honestly other than Rolex, what brands in the rough Panerai price point have a strong used market?

[Ruud Van Driver]

Originally Posted by eyeheartny

The Nomos secondary market is soft. Have you looked at WatchRecon? They're such a small brand that they aren't even close to the top 10 on WR and when I was considering them I saw some pretty dramatic price drops on LNIB pieces...close to 30% for pieces a few months old. I wouldn't really say JLC has a great secondary market either; at least 30% discounts for LNIB or lightly used pieces. VC and PP are way above Panerai price points so not really a fair comparison either. I'm not saying Panerai doesn't have a weak secondary market, but honestly other than Rolex, what brands in the rough Panerai price point have a strong used market?

This is probably one of the most profound observations I've read on the subject of used Panerai values.

I'm about to make a pick up in a few days time and the above has set my mind firmly rest. Thank you

[sechsgang]

Originally Posted by eyeheartny

The Nomos secondary market is soft. Have you looked at WatchRecon? They're such a small brand that they aren't even close to the top 10 on WR and when I was considering them I saw some pretty dramatic price drops on LNIB pieces...close to 30% for pieces a few months old. I wouldn't really say JLC has a great secondary market either; at least 30% discounts for LNIB or lightly used pieces. VC and PP are way above Panerai price points so not really a fair comparison either. I'm not saying Panerai doesn't have a weak secondary market, but honestly other than Rolex, what brands in the rough Panerai price point have a strong used market?

Mainly this is true. Certain models preowned will be able to hold up depending on what price they were attained for. For instance a Big Pilot bought for 8k, you've maybe got 800 to lose max...but even for new rolex you get hammered normally. Other than a couple models like the cameron Deep Sea and daytona and maybe the BLNR though those seem to be losing an extra couple hundred every month as the preowned market grows...youll get hammered unless given a healthy discount.

[Ruud Van Driver]

Originally Posted by sechsgang

Mainly this is true. Certain models preowned will be able to hold up depending on what price they were attained for. For instance a Big Pilot bought for 8k, you've maybe got 800 to lose max...but even for new rolex you get hammered normally. Other than a couple models like the cameron Deep Sea and daytona and maybe the BLNR though those seem to be losing an extra couple hundred every month as the preowned market grows...youll get hammered unless given a healthy discount.

You've forgotten SS Submariners. Over the long term i.e. ten years plus, the watch will be worth more than the original retail price. Same goes for SS Daytona and I would expect it to be so for the BLNR, but I guess we won't know about that one for another eight years or so.

As many others and I have said already, this is not an investment hobby. Buy, wear and enjoy.

[JP Chestnut]

Originally Posted by Ruud Van Driver

You've forgotten SS Submariners. Over the long term i.e. ten years plus, the watch will be worth more than the original retail price. Same goes for SS Daytona and I would expect it to be so for the BLNR, but I guess we won't know about that one for another eight years or so.

As many others and I have said already, this is not an investment hobby. Buy, wear and enjoy.

My best buy ever was a lnib gmt2 16710. I've had it since 2005, or so, and I could easily get 2.5x what I paid.

That fact has zero to do with how much I enjoy it.

[Gotgolf52]

I am new to Panerai and has been reading a lot about the brand, one thing I realized that hardcore Panerai fans are bashing most of the new 2016 models like the Due which quite expensive with only 30m WR and some even said that crown guard is only for posuer without technicality function. I want to buy a new Panerai but this brand seem to have too many model numbers making me dizzying reading through all of them. Now I am even more confuse. Should I just buy a used base model and cherish it forever, if so which one? I am seriously considering 392 but 1392 has thinner case which I like but hate the blue second hand.

[improviz]

Same rule always holds for watch purchases: buy them right and you won't lose your shirt provided you don't buy an unpopular brand, and even there you can still keep your shirt on if you buy preowned.

Also, this isn't an investment game...most assets depreciate, after all, so if you really love a watch and are not a serial flipper, is a few grand's worth of loss gonna kill you? If so, you shouldn't be buying one in the first place, frankly...some of the people around here act more like accountants than hobbyists.

[eyeheartny]

Originally Posted by sechsgang

Mainly this is true. Certain models preowned will be able to hold up depending on what price they were attained for. For instance a Big Pilot bought for 8k, you've maybe got 800 to lose max...but even for new rolex you get hammered normally. Other than a couple models like the cameron Deep Sea and daytona and maybe the BLNR though those seem to be losing an extra couple hundred every month as the preowned market grows...youll get hammered unless given a healthy discount.

I assume many people on here and in the US buy through trusted sellers to get a solid discount and avoid the massive initial depreciation off an MSRP + tax purchase. I know when I got my SubC I got a solid deal with Takuya for a NIB 114060 that was close to the price of a pre-owned one based on what I was seeing on WR. If people pay retail, sure-- they get hit hard. There's an initial depreciation hit on any purchase, but as annual price increases stack up, many people can recoup what they paid for their watches down the road if they choose to sell and got a good deal.

Originally Posted by improviz

Same rule always holds for watch purchases: buy them right and you won't lose your shirt provided you don't buy an unpopular brand, and even there you can still keep your shirt on if you buy preowned.

Also, this isn't an investment game...most assets depreciate, after all, so if you really love a watch and are not a serial flipper, is a few grand's worth of loss gonna kill you? If so, you shouldn't be buying one in the first place, frankly...some of the people around here act more like accountants than hobbyists.

Agree 100%. Buying with an eye toward value retention is a losing game in any hobby involving consumer goods. I certainly have never purchased bicycles, cameras, or other expensive items expecting them to go up in value! And you're right-- these are decidedly not investments, and it drives me nuts when I hear people describe them that way. I also think obsessing about the secondary market is the worst way to enjoy watches. I don't want to sit around wondering how much I could sell my watch for-- I want to wear it, enjoy it, and make it a part of my life.