Rolex Sea-Dweller

[Greg1980]

Hi

I am new here and am just putting this watch on for a friend.
He is looking for an authenticity check and as much info as possible and an idea on current market prices.
I have added a few pics I have additional ones if necessary.
It comes with the original box and paperwork.
Any input will be appreciated!
Thanks
Greg

[Greg1980]

Additional images

[Haywood_Milton]

This appears to be a genuine “Great White” 1665 Sea-Dweller with so-called “Mark I” tritium dial, on Oyster 93150 bracelet with Fliplock.

We really need to confirm that the certificate (tantalisingly captured in one photo, with green text and printing) features the correct seven digit number (punched in holes at top right) to match the seven digit case number on the watch. This can be found between the lugs at 6 o’clock, once the bracelet is removed. Incorrect papers were too commonly given out with watches for this not to be worth checking now. Mis-matched papers add next to nothing.

Prices have strengthened recently (they have never really reversed much, but can often plateau for a few years). A watch without papers might see in the region of £10,000 in the U.K. With matching papers one might add several thousand again, but be aware that selling / buying prices can fall within quite a “spread.”

Condition is key, most especially of the dial and then the case.

Haywood M

[Greg1980]

Hi Haywood

Thanks for your input.

The numbers you detailed do all match accordingly.

My friend was looking for around 18k as he has seen this models sell for that price in the last few years.

This watch is in immense condition (as seen in the photos) and has never been polished or had any replacement parts, everything is original.

Is his estimation realistic?

Greg

[rootbeer7]

Originally Posted by Greg1980

Hi Haywood

Thanks for your input.

The numbers you detailed do all match accordingly.

My friend was looking for around 18k as he has seen this models sell for that price in the last few years.

This watch is in immense condition (as seen in the photos) and has never been polished or had any replacement parts, everything is original.

Is his estimation realistic?

Greg

£18k for a Gt White plus a few extras even from a respected seller with some sort of guarantee is pushing it. Haywood is incredibly knowledgeable and that bezel insert is unlikely to be original. It’s a beautiful piece.

[Haywood_Milton]

I don’t think so.

Where has he seen white dial 1665s sell for £18k GBP in the last few years - can you provide links?

Do not confuse the same models with red writing on the dial - they are valued more highly.

Original bezel insert, he reckons?

I’d be careful lest this thread is seen as a sales post, fairly or otherwise.

H

[Greg1980]

Heywood this is definitely not a sales thread, as I detailed in the original post, I have put this on for a friend who is looking to get opinions on authenticity and information on the watch which, of course, would include current market value.

Could you elaborate on what you mean by “original bezel insert he reckons”

[Greg1980]

Hi rootbeee thanks for your input. This is what we are looking to find out. So if the bezel insert is not original does this massively affect the value?

[05carbondrz]

18K USD or 18K Euro?

[NukeMan]

Check out Chrono24.com to get some input on value. Search for Rolex 1665 and find some Great white ones. Remember though, that most of the entries come from professional dealers, and that prices are offered prices, not actual deal prices. My experience is that there’s often a significant leeway for negotiations, much like buying an expensive car.

The watch of your friend is nice looking indeed, but to get that absolute premium you need everything to be original. The price difference if everythings not original? Beats me, how hard can you negotiate and how long do you want to wait for that one crazy buyer. Good luck!

[scooba]

Originally Posted by NukeMan

Check out Chrono24.com to get some input on value. Search for Rolex 1665 and find some Great white ones. Remember though, that most of the entries come from professional dealers, and that prices are offered prices, not actual deal prices. My experience is that there’s often a significant leeway for negotiations, much like buying an expensive car.

The watch of your friend is nice looking indeed, but to get that absolute premium you need everything to be original. The price difference if everythings not original? Beats me, how hard can you negotiate and how long do you want to wait for that one crazy buyer. Good luck!

Chrono24 Is where overpriced watches go to rest before they eventually die unsold

[Haywood_Milton]

Originally Posted by scooba

Chrono24 Is where overpriced watches go to rest before they eventually die unsold

Ha! Indeed, chrono24 is generally a sound indicator of prices significantly ahead of what the market will bear

[NukeMan]

Stirling (pounds). There’s a few currencies left in europe besides the Euro...

[Greg1980]

Nukeman again thanks for your response

I do appreciate everybody’s input!

I have spoken to my friend and the watch he saw was £18k Euro so I’m averaging what 14k GBP?

So just to confirm the input of you all is that the bezel is not original so must have been changed?

If so would the 14k GBP not be achieveable?

Sorry for all the questions but as I detailed I’m just sewkibg info and by no means a watch expert!

[Greg1980]

So I’ve just realised the bezel insert is the ring around the outside!

I have googled this for the 1665 and the images appear to match the style on the bezel insert of my friends watch? Again I may be wrong!

So are you guys saying it’s not original based on the condition as you would expect more wear and tear?

[lee fowler]

The anchor is not correct either!

[Haywood_Milton]

Originally Posted by lee fowler

The anchor is not correct either!

Indeed, a 1000ft anchor with a 2000ft watch....on green wool from the knitting box?

The description and claims from the original owner don’t quite tally for me. That’s a shame, as it’s probably a decent watch but perhaps oversold by some of the description he appears to have fed the OP.

None of the price suggestions could be upheld without examining the dial under a 10x. It is impossible to tell from the images whether, for example, there is slight damage around some of the chapter ring.

[Haywood_Milton]

Now it’s just one watch he saw....with an asking price (presumably) of 18,000....only in Euros now, as well.

I’ll stick with my original price guide —- and furthermore suggest that a realistic view is taken on dealer asking prices vs realisable private seller values.

Others can continue the bezel insert discussion, as they don’t really excite me on these.

It may be interesting to see the papers in full (obscuring perhaps the last three digits is the convention) and the clasp plate which bears various numbers (all of which can be shown).

Haywood

[Greg1980]

Thanks Heywood! Like I said I’m just the messenger so don’t shoot!

[saskmh]

Just a quick note on the case condition...It is a beautiful watch but it has been polished before. You can tell from the slight dishing on the lug holes and the lack of bevels on the lugs.

[Greg1980]

Haywood not heywood sorry! I do appreciate your input.

[Greg1980]

Well I appreciate the fact you guys know what your talking about and will be sure to give all feedback exactly!

[Greg1980]

Guys I have added the paperwork, apologies for the quality but I was unable to do actual size as the site requested specific dimensions

[Haywood_Milton]

You may not be aware of it, but Rolex were for decades made / allocated case numbers in batches of one model at a time. It is comforting to find in my records other 1665s with case numbers very close to this number.

Note "1665" punched in the papers where one would normally expect to find the territory code.

[Greg1980]

Haywood you really know your stuff! I obviously had no clue!

So I’m gauging here and correct me if I’m wrong, that this watch is genuine but it has had input over the years be that polishing or bezel changes etc.. so couldn’t be bought or sold as in “original state”

[Haywood_Milton]

Originally Posted by Greg1980

Haywood you really know your stuff! I obviously had no clue!

So I’m gauging here and correct me if I’m wrong, that this watch is genuine but it has had input over the years be that polishing or bezel changes etc.. so couldn’t be bought or sold as in “original state”

I wouldn't worry about it: there is no need to over-describe a watch like this, whose value will be clear enough to most who look at it. Many buyers are happier to consider a used watch presented candidly than the same watch being presented as something it may not be.

[rootbeer7]

If your friend is trying to sell, why not take it to an expert. There are a few down in your direction. That way all parts of the watch and accessories can be assessed for originality.

[Greg1980]

Thanks for all the help guys much appreciated

[05carbondrz]

It is still a very nice example that will bring very good money in Today’s Market.

[chows99]

Is your friend the only owner in the history of this watch? It seems there are things he is not disclosing fully. It's important not to overstate certain claims such as unpolished. In a respected rolex forum, this term is forbidden.