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Old 24 February 2019, 05:58 AM   #1
oldman2005
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Rolex giving up SS sport watch market to other manufactures such as Omega,...?

The other day, I dropped by my favourite AD just to chitchat a bit and collect some Rolex magazines, of course as usual the AD had nothing in SS sport. An asian couple walked in and I overheard them asking for a SS Submariner and I was not surprised that they walked out empty handed. We shopped around and later on dropped by a huge watch retailer in the same mall that carries everything from Patek, JLC, to Omega and other brands. We walked to the Omega display and met the same couple at the Rolex AD, they were in process of purchasing a new Omega Seamaster 300.

The lower priced stainless steel sport watch market competition is fierce with so many brands, do you think that Rolex is giving up this market segment and move to higher priced higher profit margin of DJ/TT/PM and leaving this stainless steel market for others to feed on?

Many even think the new Omega Seamaster is a better watch than the Submariner:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9vhi5-dZSQ
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Old 24 February 2019, 06:05 AM   #2
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No and No
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Old 27 February 2019, 09:33 PM   #3
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No and No

The first reply said it all
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Old 24 February 2019, 06:09 AM   #4
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Certainly if there isn’t a Rolex in the case and a buyer wants/needs a new watch, they will be buying another brand. It’s just a watch and most would never wait a few months to purchase a SS watch. Omega has to be seeing stronger sales. Being better or not is meaningless if Rolex doesn’t show up to be considered in the purchase process. Rolex loses these sales by their own strategy. Normal buyers won’t be bothered by the buying process for a Rolex. Remember to the sane world...”It’s just a watch”.
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Old 24 February 2019, 07:06 AM   #5
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Certainly if there isn’t a Rolex in the case and a buyer wants/needs a new watch, they will be buying another brand. It’s just a watch and most would never wait a few months to purchase a SS watch. Omega has to be seeing stronger sales.
That's wishful thinking. While "luxury" watches in the U.S. went up across the board over the last 18 months, Omega sales numbers have been relatively flat.

In the over-$5K range, divide the market into three pieces:

  • "Fashion" brands (expensive brands without deep watch roots e.g. Jimmy Choo, Michael Kors) are way down.
  • Most of the rest had slight increases as the overall market expanded 15% (evenly split - +14% $5-10K, +16% $10K+)
  • Rolex and Patek Philippe have gained a lot; NPD has those two together at 70% of the $10K+ U.S. market. And Grand Seiko has entered the Top-10 in the $5K-$10K range.

Omega and other Swatch brands are doing really well in Asia, but relatively flat in the U.S.

FWIW, Patek Philippe's success is a surprise to me too. I like the Calatrava, but the 5196G variant, close to a Stowa Antea or Nomos Orion in many ways, is about 10 times more expensive, close to $20K, outside of my viewscope.
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Old 24 February 2019, 08:13 AM   #6
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That's wishful thinking. While "luxury" watches in the U.S. went up across the board over the last 18 months, Omega sales numbers have been relatively flat.

In the over-$5K range, divide the market into three pieces:

  • "Fashion" brands (expensive brands without deep watch roots e.g. Jimmy Choo, Michael Kors) are way down.
  • Most of the rest had slight increases as the overall market expanded 15% (evenly split - +14% $5-10K, +16% $10K+)
  • Rolex and Patek Philippe have gained a lot; NPD has those two together at 70% of the $10K+ U.S. market. And Grand Seiko has entered the Top-10 in the $5K-$10K range.

Omega and other Swatch brands are doing really well in Asia, but relatively flat in the U.S.

FWIW, Patek Philippe's success is a surprise to me too. I like the Calatrava, but the 5196G variant, close to a Stowa Antea or Nomos Orion in many ways, is about 10 times more expensive, close to $20K, outside of my viewscope.
Do you have inside information on Omega’s sales figures in the US?
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Old 24 February 2019, 08:26 AM   #7
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For enthusiasts like us no. We are clued up and we know what want. However I can totally see the casual buyer with a few grand in the pocket who fancies picking up a sub, being told no and going over the street and buying a Seamaster instead just to scratch the itch.

I mean the amount of times I’ve gone to buy a paticular item of clothing and got something else just because they didn’t have my size and i wanted something there and then

Edit: However I would add I usually end up buying something more expensive than I intended to in that situation just to make myself feel better. Which is slightly different than going from sub to seamaster
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Old 27 February 2019, 09:53 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by Late View Post
That's wishful thinking. While "luxury" watches in the U.S. went up across the board over the last 18 months, Omega sales numbers have been relatively flat.

In the over-$5K range, divide the market into three pieces:

  • "Fashion" brands (expensive brands without deep watch roots e.g. Jimmy Choo, Michael Kors) are way down.
  • Most of the rest had slight increases as the overall market expanded 15% (evenly split - +14% $5-10K, +16% $10K+)
  • Rolex and Patek Philippe have gained a lot; NPD has those two together at 70% of the $10K+ U.S. market. And Grand Seiko has entered the Top-10 in the $5K-$10K range.

Omega and other Swatch brands are doing really well in Asia, but relatively flat in the U.S.

FWIW, Patek Philippe's success is a surprise to me too. I like the Calatrava, but the 5196G variant, close to a Stowa Antea or Nomos Orion in many ways, is about 10 times more expensive, close to $20K, outside of my viewscope.
I am not surprised at all about Patek's success. They have been mentioned in nearly every single rap song made in the past 3-5 years. It's gotten so bad there's even a song called Patek water! Patek Water

Look at any rap video and chances are you're going see an iced out Nautilus or 2.
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Old 25 February 2019, 12:06 AM   #9
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Certainly if there isn’t a Rolex in the case and a buyer wants/needs a new watch, they will be buying another brand. It’s just a watch and most would never wait a few months to purchase a SS watch. Omega has to be seeing stronger sales. Being better or not is meaningless if Rolex doesn’t show up to be considered in the purchase process. Rolex loses these sales by their own strategy. Normal buyers won’t be bothered by the buying process for a Rolex. Remember to the sane world...”It’s just a watch”.

This. Seems like a poor strategy on Rolex’ part. Sales are just walking away.


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Old 24 February 2019, 06:11 AM   #10
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Honestly the scarcity makes Rolex more of a challenge and therefore more desirable.
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Old 24 February 2019, 08:37 AM   #11
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Honestly the scarcity makes Rolex more of a challenge and therefore more desirable.
Only to the FOMO herd. Most other people just want a watch, and they probably start by asking for the most recognizable brand name and then go from there.
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Old 24 February 2019, 01:11 PM   #12
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Honestly the scarcity makes Rolex more of a challenge and therefore more desirable.
That's exactly how many of us, including myself, see the shortage. Having said that, the SS scarcity has made me really want a PM piece. Never saw myself as a gold guy, either.

I bought a TT GMT (yellow and black) a few months ago. I would have never considered one in the past. And, if I could be honest, it's my favorite watch. I have a BLNR and a Hulk, too, which I know is crazy to say. The TT GMT just sings to me. I absolutely love it. The little bit of extra heft makes me feel like I am wearing a truly special piece every time I put it on.
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Old 26 February 2019, 02:00 AM   #13
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That's exactly how many of us, including myself, see the shortage. Having said that, the SS scarcity has made me really want a PM piece. Never saw myself as a gold guy, either.

I bought a TT GMT (yellow and black) a few months ago. I would have never considered one in the past. And, if I could be honest, it's my favorite watch. I have a BLNR and a Hulk, too, which I know is crazy to say. The TT GMT just sings to me. I absolutely love it. The little bit of extra heft makes me feel like I am wearing a truly special piece every time I put it on.
That's great. I actually think the TT GMT is a pretty underrated watch. Black and gold accents working together is a great look. I think I like the black face much better in TT than the Bluesy Sub.
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Old 26 February 2019, 03:37 AM   #14
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That's great. I actually think the TT GMT is a pretty underrated watch. Black and gold accents working together is a great look. I think I like the black face much better in TT than the Bluesy Sub.
Agree I saw one in the flesh and got it in jan this year very underrated.
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Old 24 February 2019, 06:19 AM   #15
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Rolex are selling as many SS sport watches as they want to make. And, until we definitively hear different, which of course we never will, we can safely assume that they are producing as many SS sport models as they ever have. Just look at the ocean of grey offerings, many with the plastic still on.

That they do not appear to be knee jerking to the exponential demand, says more about their confidence and long term plans for brand protection than it does about "giving up".

Seamaster better than Submariner? Subjective. I like Omega. I like their styles. I have a very nice Speedie. But I don't think their quality comes close to Rolex. I suppose it's a matter of opinion.
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Old 24 February 2019, 06:20 AM   #16
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Old 24 February 2019, 06:23 AM   #17
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If you want a Rolex, you’ll never be happy with simply an Omega. You’ll either wait for the Rolex or end up buying both.
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Old 24 February 2019, 06:25 AM   #18
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If you want a Rolex, you’ll never be happy with simply an Omega. You’ll either wait for the Rolex or end up buying both.
Ha, you beat me to it!
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Old 24 February 2019, 11:47 PM   #19
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If you want a Rolex, you’ll never be happy with simply an Omega. You’ll either wait for the Rolex or end up buying both.
An Omega isn’t simple, how dare you sir!

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Old 25 February 2019, 01:51 PM   #20
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If you want a Rolex, you’ll never be happy with simply an Omega. You’ll either wait for the Rolex or end up buying both.


Very true! I was in this boat.


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Old 25 February 2019, 05:00 PM   #21
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If you want a Rolex, you’ll never be happy with simply an Omega. You’ll either wait for the Rolex or end up buying both.
This exactly. I recently purchased the new SMP 300 and although it’s a great watch and a huge leap forward for omega from the previous SMP, it always left me feeling underwhelmed and I just needed a Rolex on my wrist.

I flipped it after just 3 weeks and part exchanged it for a DJ41. Very happy with my new Rolex and no regrets!

I also found the Omega a bit tacky after a while. Bit too much bling and the laser cut ceramic wave dial was starting to irritate me..
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Old 25 February 2019, 05:10 PM   #22
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If you want a Rolex, you’ll never be happy with simply an Omega. You’ll either wait for the Rolex or end up buying both.
exactly
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Old 24 February 2019, 06:24 AM   #23
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Sounds like the couple settled in my opinion, which is never good when it comes to buying a watch. I learned that settling, regardless of what you purchase, just leaves you longing all that much more. Nothing against Omega, but a SeaMaster is not a Sub and vice versa.
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Old 24 February 2019, 06:25 AM   #24
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Absolutely not
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Old 24 February 2019, 06:26 AM   #25
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Absolutely not


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Old 24 February 2019, 06:29 AM   #26
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Unable to buy a Sub, I purchased a Pelagos.

So I am an example of a transaction lost, I could have just as easily picked up an Omega.

I must say, if I’m left without the Rolex option, I’ll be looking at brands like Omega as an alternative.

Being laughed away or on some fictional list is not desirable to me.
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Old 24 February 2019, 07:53 AM   #27
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Unable to buy a Sub, I purchased a Pelagos.

So I am an example of a transaction lost, I could have just as easily picked up an Omega.

I must say, if I’m left without the Rolex option, I’ll be looking at brands like Omega as an alternative.

Being laughed away or on some fictional list is not desirable to me.


For me personally, it was a Sub or nothing. The Pelagos is a great watch. It just isn’t the Sub.

If I couldn’t have gotten a Sub from an AD, I would have went grey, not settled for a Pelagos.

If you wanted the Pelagos, great. But it’s not the same.
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Old 24 February 2019, 09:08 AM   #28
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For me personally, it was a Sub or nothing. The Pelagos is a great watch. It just isn’t the Sub.

If I couldn’t have gotten a Sub from an AD, I would have went grey, not settled for a Pelagos.

If you wanted the Pelagos, great. But it’s not the same.
I was going on a beach vacation, I wanted a diver. It’s not about settling, my AD says six months for a sub, my trip was in two weeks. I was a sub shopper, leaving with a Tudor.

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Tudor is owned by Rolex so they did not lose out on a sale.


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$8k became $4k, they certainly lost. Also, now I’m looking at Omega or AP.
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Old 24 February 2019, 08:18 AM   #29
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Unable to buy a Sub, I purchased a Pelagos.

So I am an example of a transaction lost, I could have just as easily picked up an Omega.

I must say, if I’m left without the Rolex option, I’ll be looking at brands like Omega as an alternative.

Being laughed away or on some fictional list is not desirable to me.


Tudor is owned by Rolex so they did not lose out on a sale.


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Old 24 February 2019, 06:45 AM   #30
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The idea that Rolex is somehow losing out on business because of personal and/or anecdotal inability to find a SS piece is misguided. Rolex couldn’t care less about you not being able to find the watch you want. They are making and selling just as many as they want to. Trying to find some justification for them to stop SS production at this point is absurd.
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