GMT Insert Valuation Help? Grail Copper

[BigBlue1]

Hi guys. I have an opportunity to purchase a grail insert of mine.
It is the Copper colored Insert Fat Silver Font.
I have been chasing one down for a long time and couldn't seem to find one. Released in the late 60s early 70s, they are scarce.
I was hoping someone could give me a valuation?
Please and Thank You.
John

[BigBlue1]

I am only asking for a valuation on the Insert and not the watch. The reason I ask for the valuation is because the price the seller wants I am unsure if it’s in the ball park or not.

[Lgear080]

$1-1.5... do you have a photo of the back of an authentic one? I’d want to know it came off the same production line.

[BigBlue1]

The seller wants more than that. It’s kind of expensive. No photo of the back, but seems legit.

[77T]

Originally Posted by BigBlue1

The seller wants more than that. It’s kind of expensive. No photo of the back, but seems legit.

How can you tell it’s legit without a picture of the back?

Edit: BTW, and legit seller provides pics of the back as well as the front.

There are 2 on eBay; one at $1500 and another at $2100.


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[springer]

Originally Posted by BigBlue1

The seller wants more than that. It’s kind of expensive. No photo of the back, but seems legit.

Just curious, but, if you have been looking at them for a while, I would say that you have a pretty good idea of what one sells for...right?

It's hard placing a value on these vintage inserts and basically, it's only worth what someone is willing to pay for one.

If you like it, fire away and drop the hammer.

[BigBlue1]

Originally Posted by springer

Just curious, but, if you have been looking at them for a while, I would say that you have a pretty good idea of what one sells for...right?

It's hard placing a value on these vintage inserts and basically, it's only worth what someone is willing to pay for one.

If you like it, fire away and drop the hammer.

I have been looking at them for a while, but haven’t seen one come up for sale. I have seen the Blueberrys come up for sale and they sell for a bit for sure. There are copper tone with gold colored font and some silver with skinny font, but I haven’t seen a silver fat font copper come up for sale.

Thank you.

John.

[BigBlue1]

The ones on eBay are Gold Font, not silver.

I’m talking from this site.

http://rolexnessreviews.blogspot.com...after.html?m=1

[saskmh]

Every time I see a GMT insert with the bottom of the 22 in a straight line my first impression is that the insert is aftermarket. The bottom of the 22 is flat....all genuine GMT inserts that I am aware of from my research have bottom edges of the numerals on the 22 that follow the curve of the insert. Even the super fat font versions. Can anyone else confirm this one way or the other?

[springer]

Originally Posted by saskmh

Every time I see a GMT insert with the bottom of the 22 in a straight line my first impression is that the insert is aftermarket. The bottom of the 22 is flat....all genuine GMT inserts that I am aware of from my research have bottom edges of the numerals on the 22 that follow the curve of the insert. Even the super fat font versions. Can anyone else confirm this one way or the other?

You are correct. I've detailed this with plenty of photos in my fake and genuine GMT bezel insert threads that exhibit these qualities.

[saskmh]

Like this...

[Gmt21]

Originally Posted by saskmh

Like this...

And this....

[Gmt21]

Originally Posted by BigBlue1

Hi guys. I have an opportunity to purchase a grail insert of mine.
It is the Copper colored Insert Fat Silver Font.
I have been chasing one down for a long time and couldn't seem to find one. Released in the late 60s early 70s, they are scarce.
I was hoping someone could give me a valuation?
Please and Thank You.
John

I paid $1650 for an absolute mint one off ebay last year in very heavy bidding.
Given that I think 2K is the ceiling max price.

[BigBlue1]

I hope you are not implying the one I posted is aftermarket. You should research some Fuchsia Inserts from the same time frame and you will see that the 22s are just about identical. Some can seem well rounded if they ride the curve at the edge of the insert.

[77T]

Originally Posted by BigBlue1

I hope you are not implying the one I posted is aftermarket. You should research some Fuchsia Inserts from the same time frame and you will see that the 22s are just about identical. Some can seem well rounded if they ride the curve at the edge of the insert.

Ummm...easy there fella. Don’t go off half cocked.

Springer has seen more bezels of all types than you’ve got hairs on your head.


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[BigBlue1]

Originally Posted by 77T

Ummm...easy there fella. Don’t go off half cocked.

Springer has seen more bezels of all types than you’ve got hairs on your head.


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I’m bald.
I am not going off half cocked. I have done some comparisons of my own and have found some similar from the same time frame is all.
Jesssh Paul.

[Dan S]

When you ask for advice, it's probably best to just sit back and listen to the responses and encourage the free exchange of information instead of trying to bias the discussion one way or the other. I have been there, and I've received conflicting opinions, which is typical on the internet. If I'm unsure, I'll also reach out to people by PM and/or email.

In the end, it's your decision and your decision alone whether to buy it. And if you love it, you will pay what you need to pay.

[BigBlue1]

Originally Posted by Dan S

When you ask for advice, it's probably best to just sit back and listen to the responses and encourage the free exchange of information instead of trying to bias the discussion one way or the other. I have been there, and I've received conflicting opinions, which is typical on the internet. If I'm unsure, I'll also reach out to people by PM and/or email.

In the end, it's your decision and your decision alone whether to buy it. And if you love it, you will pay what you need to pay.

Thank you.
I’ll heed the advice.

[Lgear080]

No photos of the back? Pass.

[BigBlue1]

Updated Pictures

[PVR]

The bezel is authentic. 100% authentic and the fade is also very attractive.

Worth 2000-3000, but no more. TOPS

[BigBlue1]

Thank you. It is beautiful. Hoping to take some better photos of it to show you it’s true beauty.

Also Thank You to J/P for all you do for the community in regards to constructive criticism to your unwavering dedication to all members with your wealth of knowledge.

Thanks.

[springer]

Originally Posted by BigBlue1

Thank you. It is beautiful. Hoping to take some better photos of it to show you it’s true beauty.

Also Thank You to J/P for all you do for the community in regards to constructive criticism to your unwavering dedication to all members with your wealth of knowledge.

Thanks.

Thanks, but I didn't know I was criticizing any inserts in this thread. I don't recall or see anything that I posted regarding any of these inserts not being genuine. Carry on.

[BigBlue1]

Originally Posted by springer

Thanks, but I didn't know I was criticizing any inserts in this thread. I don't recall or see anything that I posted regarding any of these inserts not being genuine. Carry on.

[Lgear080]

Wow... very very nice. Money well spent.

[BigBlue1]

Originally Posted by Lgear080

Wow... very very nice. Money well spent.

Thank you.

[uncleluck]

Always interesting reading these threads. Who do you believe on authenticity calls!

Fake because the 2’s are flat, Real because, well it’s real?

What colour were they when new? If it’s “attractively faded” then obviously it must have been a darker brown? If so, why is the underside the same faded colour & not looking like new. Did the owner remove it and keep it on the window sill for years turning it like a sausage on the bbq

I’m not suggesting foul play just genuinely interested as I’m into my Vintage Seiko and you remove a faded chapter ring and the bits that have been out the sun look like new still as you’d expect.

It’s also interesting that Rolex parts seems to be the only ones where a faded part can be more expensive. Suggestions of $3k, what would be the price of a NOS copper bezel, $5k? Or $500? A NOS Seiko Pogue bezel I’m sure someone would pay $250-$300 for, a faded one is worthless relatively speaking.

I think it’s down to what Rolex do when servicing these watches, ie making them look new again. You can see a lot of new, refurbished Rolex as they’ll come back from service as so but to see a new looking Pogue for example is a rare sight and people would be more impressed by that.

I assume you can’t buy these inserts from Rolex, if it was sent for service (and you purposely damaged your copper bezel) what new bezel would it come back wearing?

One thing I’d be weary of with this stuff is the fact there would have been people making replacement inserts back 30/40/50 years ago that will have that old ‘original’ look. Are the only people you can really trust to authenticate parts Rolex? there’s too much money to be made in this game to trust a layman surely?

[BigBlue1]

[Lgear080]

I like fat fonts and I cannot lie those other watch lovers can’t deny

[BigBlue1]

Its a beaut and is right up there with the Blueberry