Panerai and Stallone - the truth?

[thsiao]

Found this article while perusing on my IG... crazy if true.

https://perezcope.com/2020/12/23/the...tory-debunked/

[antelope]

crazy story. if true many bad actors ( article seems pretty convincing)

[henrylee]

Thanks for the article, very interesting. Too bad Panerai is in trouble again

[Waitlisted Watches]

This makes total sense now, thanks for sharing

[lig]

Thanks for sharing- interesting read for sure!

[NYG1121]

Ouch for panerai. In the end, just love their unique style and could care less about any of this though

[thsiao]

Originally Posted by NYG1121

Ouch for panerai. In the end, just love their unique style and could care less about any of this though

True. Doesn’t change the fact that I like how their watches look. But it does suck that they misrepresented themselves if true. Their “fake” narrative was too perfect. This story seems to make more sense to me, except for the part that Panerai would be giving watches for free and not even have a contract signed . Isn’t that Business 101?

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by NYG1121

In the end, just love their unique style and could care less about any of this though

^^^ this.

Soooooo looking fwd to getting the 1118 as ONLY Panerai could pull off successfully imho. Panerai is Panerai, Bell & Ross is... You know exactly what brand it is instantly.

[CanPam]

Strange that this article was published yesterday and not some days before the auction. For the author there was nothing new under the sun.
His campaign on IG ("General strike! Don't buy Panerai! Boycot that shit!") is too sensational and really poor in my opinion...

[Cru Jones]

Conspiracy theorists are EVERYWHERE! And really BORED!!

[turpe]

Whilst this is a fascinating, and well-researched, article, every time Perezscope writes about Panerai, it always comes across as though he asked Panerai to prom, and she said no - and now he’s trying to badmouth her to the whole school to make himself feel better about the rejection.

For me, I’m a lot less concerned about how a Luminor ended up on Sly’s wrist than I am about the fact that, if it hadn’t, I may not have had the opportunity to strap one onto my own.

[EdmundGTP]

Even if the article is 100% true, it doesn't make me love my 312 any less, nor would it stop me from buying another Panerai.

[Dan2010]

Originally Posted by EdmundGTP

Even if the article is 100% true, it doesn't make me love my 312 any less, nor would it stop me from buying another Panerai.

Exactly. Still a great watch with a great history.

[emtee]

Interesting but makes absolutely no difference whatsoever to my love of Panerai watches. I don’t even see it as an issue, pretty much all brands do this sort of thing. And as someone else mentioned if this hadn’t have happened there’s a good chance we wouldn’t even be posting in the Panerai forum as the brand may have died.

[1William]

As an early Paneristi and a one time collector with a significant Panerai Collection, I can tell you the article does matter and the brand is dead to me and many others. The misrepresentation of material facts regarding the brands origin and history, by the brand, is not what I support or will tolerate. Panerai has been called out across multiple platforms and has had to back up from many of the stories they have told. Another example is Bremont and when they announced they did an in-house movement only to be outed that it was a modified outside movement I stopped considering a purchase. I know that the advertising game is as much about what you do not say as much as what you do say but facts as significant as what is mentioned in the article and other articles from other credible sources is enough to take me away from the brand and I will never return.

[Sublovin]

Originally Posted by 1William

As an early Paneristi and a one time collector with a significant Panerai Collection, I can tell you the article does matter and the brand is dead to me and many others. The misrepresentation of material facts regarding the brands origin and history, by the brand, is not what I support or will tolerate. Panerai has been called out across multiple platforms and has had to back up from many of the stories they have told. Another example is Bremont and when they announced they did an in-house movement only to be outed that it was a modified outside movement I stopped considering a purchase. I know that the advertising game is as much about what you do not say as much as what you do say but facts as significant as what is mentioned in the article and other articles from other credible sources is enough to take me away from the brand and I will never return.

How “early” of a Paneristi are you? I started following the brand in 1997, and I’m not sure what you mean.
The problem with Panerai is that too many people romanticized the folklore. It’s a watch...
It became a badge of honor and people made it seem like they had a museum artifact.....it’s a watch.
I liked Panerai in 1997 for the same reason I like it in 2021, it’s a great design and relatively unique brand. When you see someone wearing a Panerai, you typically have an enthusiast who wants to talk about it. With a Rolex, you typically have an uninterested party who received it as a gift, or just bought it because they made a few bucks and thought Rolex was the best, or a status badge.
You are certainly entitled to your thoughts, I just find it interesting how many people were drawn in by the story, and not the watch.

Next you are going to tell me that Matthew Mcconaughey doesn’t really drive a Lincoln, Howie Long doesn’t wear Skechers, and the guy from Crocodile Dundee doesn’t eat at Outback Steakhouse!

This article was clearly written as a “gotcha” piece, but not sure who was “gotten”. Seems like a lot of wasted time on something that nobody should really care about.

I’m glad all the hype went away and the watches are attainable. Now the instagrammers are more concerned with their position on the list for the new “Pepsi”.


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[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by Sublovin

When you see someone wearing a Panerai, you typically have an enthusiast who wants to talk about it. With a Rolex, you typically have an uninterested party who received it as a gift, or just bought it because they made a few bucks and thought Rolex was the best, or a status badge.

Excellent point! Rolex are a dime a dozen at the hundreds of luxury audio events I have attended for decades, yet only ONCE out of every 20 or so times was the owner a timepiece enthusiast. Love some of the 'uniquely weird' timepieces the guys from Russia and other parts of the world wear too.

[MeepHead]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Excellent point! Rolex are a dime a dozen at the hundreds of luxury audio events I have attended for decades, yet only ONCE out of every 20 or so times was the owner a timepiece enthusiast. Love some of the 'uniquely weird' timepieces the guys from Russia and other parts of the world wear too.

I always talk to Rolex wearers and have found them to be enthusiastic.. I see one of 3,000 people wearing a watch so we are all in a small club regardless of brand the only time I was treated in a snobby way was when I asked a guy about his breitling
L. He was extremely rude. Otherwise, Rolex wearers and others have been extremely nice and their watch has meant something to them personally.

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by MeepHead

I always talk to Rolex wearers and have found them to be enthusiastic.

oh yes, Rolex enthusiasts are enthusiastic. Yet most seem to not be enthusiasts. It's the IWC, Panerai, Breitling, Bvlgari, Omega, Poljot, Ming, etc guys who (odds are) have taken time to carefully choose what's on their wrist. B&R guys are always fun to chat with too.

Ya know, kinda reminds me of car clubs and personalties.

[Sublovin]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Excellent point! Rolex are a dime a dozen at the hundreds of luxury audio events I have attended for decades, yet only ONCE out of every 20 or so times was the owner a timepiece enthusiast. Love some of the 'uniquely weird' timepieces the guys from Russia and other parts of the world wear too.

Yep, of all the people who I work with that wear a Rolex (several), exactly zero of them are watch enthusiasts. It’s just an expensive watch.


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[Ravager135]

Originally Posted by 1William

As an early Paneristi and a one time collector with a significant Panerai Collection, I can tell you the article does matter and the brand is dead to me and many others. The misrepresentation of material facts regarding the brands origin and history, by the brand, is not what I support or will tolerate. Panerai has been called out across multiple platforms and has had to back up from many of the stories they have told. Another example is Bremont and when they announced they did an in-house movement only to be outed that it was a modified outside movement I stopped considering a purchase. I know that the advertising game is as much about what you do not say as much as what you do say but facts as significant as what is mentioned in the article and other articles from other credible sources is enough to take me away from the brand and I will never return.

I first took interest in the brand around 2010. I wasn't an early admirer like you were, but I appreciated the overall aesthetic. I owned a PAM024 and a PAM005. As Panerai began to introduce in house movements, I began to see a change in the collections coupled with ridiculous price increases. This coupled with deliberate choices to add unnecessary text to dials, add too many novel case materials, and pivot to some kind of "lifestyle" brand really made me fall out of love with Panerai.

I never really cared much about the Stallone backstory; if anything, I found it kind of a cringeworthy selling point for the brand. Instead of relying in their interesting case designs and simple dials, Panerai seems to have built their reputation more and more on historical nonsense. It doesn't surprise me that this article completely debunks a myth that I never felt was interesting in the first place, but it does put the cherry on the top of a marketing campaign that is suspect at best.

I've owned around eight Panerai over the past decade and they've all been flipped. Brand image and reputation is still important to me especially when a brand is moving away from the aesthetic that I fell in love with: simple dials in steel cases with minimal fuss. Looking around the brand now, there's only a handful of models that I would say are vestiges of what once was. Couple that with scandals of unfinished movements, questionable movements, snap-on case backs, special editions that get released nearly identically a year later as regular releases, an emphasis on expensive case materials; I think I am not alone in falling out of love.

I am sure others will come along and say that if I don't like a brand, to keep it to myself; but I think, like you are saying, there was SOMETHING about the brand that initially made us fans and that seems to be gone. Panerai can't correct all the fake history it has put out, but it can retool their design language. I often liken the brand to IWC. IWC was a brand that a few years back (prior to the John Mayer letter) was really losing sight of its direction. The course correction they have made has made me a huge fan. Just my two cents. The purpose of this post is not to bash Panerai fans or even the brand itself, because there is something there. I just think their focus is way off.

[rootbeer7]

Perezcope is a member here I believe. His articles are thoroughly researched and in my opinion well written. The Panerai history has truly been embellished which is rather sad and I think it’s correct that the truth is outed. He also happily shows images of genuine older and original models.

[Dan2010]

Originally Posted by rootbeer7

Perezcope is a member here I believe. His articles are thoroughly researched and in my opinion well written. The Panerai history has truly been embellished which is rather sad and I think it’s correct that the truth is outed. He also happily shows images of genuine older and original models.

Yes, he does a great job in his research. Part of the problem early on was that very few actually knew the details of Panerai's history. It's not so much that the history has been embellished, its that in some instances the details were off and people both tried to fill in the blanks while others flat out lied. As more actual details of its history come out, we are finding that the real history is actually just as good or better than the made up or misinformation that was originally spread. The issue that many of the old guard Paneristi have I believe is that modern Panerai won't change its marketing and media when new facts dispell the old information.

At the end of the day, Panerai has a great product with a truly unique and interesting history. I believe as time goes by they will "get it straight" on the marketing side.

[dbfagan]

The auction house, Phillips, should share the majority of the blame if the article is true. They do most of the presale advertising to peak interest. Just my two cents.

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by dbfagan

The auction house, Phillips, should share the majority of the blame if the article is true.

Auction houses.... ROFLOL!!! For many years they've been cohorts to 'selling the sizzle' as it brings in higher prices, which in turn brings higher commissions for their auctions (follow the money). So next time to read "rare and important' as associated with ANY timepiece description, i'd ignore it 99% of the time as marketing fluff.

Originally Posted by Burlington

One would have to be pretty naïve not to think this kind of thing goes on all the time across multiple industries.

Exactly.

IMHO the bottom line is to get what YOU love, as offered by mechanical timepiece companies that provide a MINIMUM of five-year warranty and excellent customer service. Any warranty less than five years nowadays brings into question their product's reliability / quality... especially at these luxury goods pricing. Panerai products are reliable, the company provides a generous warranty, plus Panerai service times are very reasonable too.

PS: As a member of the press within the luxury goods sector for decades, odds are many here would be... 'surprised'... at some of the marketing BS some manufacturers try to pass off within their press releases. Sadly, few journalists seem to 'out', or at a minimum remove or outright ignore and thus never publish their marketing BS. And yes, have endured backlash (from time to time) from certain members of the luxury sector for not blindly parroting a manufacturer's marketing BS.

Here's some food for thought:

[rajurama]

90% of the current buyers don't care of the history or Stallone or auctions. The brand name , quality , R&D after sales service is currently at its top with Panerai. Long term things are looking good as of now. Panerai has achieved a cult status and a strong following , the design language is similar to Porsche.

[Burlington]

Interesting read, thanks for posting

Looking at the timeline of watches was most fascinating, especially a certain RO like model from the very early days.

It doesn’t overtly skew my thinking of the brand to the negative though after reading.

Good on Sly for sticking with the story, maybe no one told him they wanted to change the narrative.

One would have to be pretty naïve not to think this kind of thing goes on all the time across multiple industries.

[Mystro]

Ugh, let the Panerai haters have a platform and it’s comical how predictable it gets. Conspiracy theories, perceptions of reality, etc... Everyone has their own special spin or “reliable sources” to promote themselves. Perception of reality “is” reality in marketing and it has always been that way. I love where Panerai is today and hope the mainstream stays away.

[Eyenigma]

Originally Posted by Mystro

I love where Panerai is today and hope the mainstream stays away.

Guessing you mean as a brand and where the collection(s) are going. I suspect the financials on the other hand are in dire straits. Boutique sales have probably dried up considerably and the days of guys running out to get any model they could get their hands on are long gone. I wouldn't be shocked to have it fade into obscurity and relative unknown much like Franck Muller watches did after their day in the spotlight ended.

As crazy as it sounds, the only brands doing phenomenally well right now are those that are pushed by mainstream culture and hip-hop. If I were in charge of marketing, I would be trying to engage influencers and rap culture to get the pieces back in favor. I know that will sound like sacrilege but the truth can hurt.

[lig]

@enjoythemusic - an epic gonzo quote. :)

I love my 111. I’d have a couple more PAMs if I could get them at MSRP but the whole limited edition thing has ruled that out.

To be honest I bought *in spite* of the folklore, not because of it.

Buying a timepiece used by an Axis power military isn’t exactly a selling point to me - I just dig the watch.