Diver Help Needed

[chloebear]

I am a Rolex guy and I really want to add a dive watch to my collection. I love the Submariner but I’m a little worried it’s too similar to my LN GMT. I’ve really been digging Panerai’s lately, in particular the PAM 682 (42mm Submersible).

I realize the Panerai won’t hold its value like the Rolex. I’m not too worried about that. Could anyone with experience with both comment on these two please? Any pictures or feedback would be greatly appreciated!


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[eltonbalch]

This Hodinkee review should answer most of your questions. I have not seen this one in person, but, for comparison my 243 (44mm) is much like my DSSD size wise. This looks like a very nice piece in the 42 mm size.

https://www.hodinkee.com/articles/pa...-42mm-hands-on

[Ravager135]

I own a couple Submariners and while I don't have experience with the PAM 682 in particular, I do own several Panerai and am very familiar with the brand. The Submariner is the Submariner and I would agree it is very similar aesthetically to the GMT-Master II LN.

I think a Panerai Submersible (regardless of model) would be a great pairing. From what I understand the PAM 682 is very wearable despite its 42mm diameter. It is very clearly a robust, masculine diver and will stand apart from your more refined GMT-Master II more significantly.

What I have seen when it comes to Panerai and this model in particular is that once you get into the brand, people tend to go up in size. They regret smaller models despite initially wanting one. The smaller models are just not as emblematic to the brand. That said, the 682 has been getting nothing but positive reviews from most watch organizations. I am interested in a Panerai Submersible, but in the 1950 case there really isn't anything currently being made between the 42mm and 47mm case. There have been releases in the past and the classic PAM 1024 is always an option at 44mm.

If you like the way the 682 looks, I say go ahead and get it. It's equal to the task of the Submariner and is far more sporty looking. It will contrast well with your GMT-Master II. Just be aware, once you get one PAM, you tend to want another. You also tend to want larger pieces.

[chloebear]

Thank you both for the well thought out advice. Really interesting about people wishing they'd gone bigger when they move to Panerai. I absolutely think the Panerai look is larger. I also think that in my Rolex mind that 42 is huge, but I think that's wrong. I think Rolex sizes are skewed up because of their lugs.

I am falling hard for a Panerai of late. The more I look at them the more I like them.

[Cru Jones]

682 is a great watch and one of the best recent Panerai. Enjoy!

[J!m]

Just for further confusion, I’m going to throw the Omega Planet Ocean in the mix. But, with a caveat- avoid colors. I love my 45.5 first gen but would be equally happy with a 42 first gen.

For a diver, ithits all the marks- durable, stylish, sea dweller depth rating, DOMED sapphire with ar coating, so legibility in all conditions (even without my glasses) is outstanding, Chernobyl grade lume, chronometer rated, solid build and very cheap (in Rolex terms) second hand. I’d also suggest avoiding the display back gimmick but that’s not a big deal other than making the case thicker a bit.

[chloebear]

Originally Posted by J!m

Just for further confusion, I’m going to throw the Omega Planet Ocean in the mix. But, with a caveat- avoid colors. I love my 45.5 first gen but would be equally happy with a 42 first gen.

For a diver, ithits all the marks- durable, stylish, sea dweller depth rating, DOMED sapphire with ar coating, so legibility in all conditions (even without my glasses) is outstanding, Chernobyl grade lume, chronometer rated, solid build and very cheap (in Rolex terms) second hand. I’d also suggest avoiding the display back gimmick but that’s not a big deal other than making the case thicker a bit.

Funniest comment of the year....."Chernobyl grade lume." That is damn funny!!!!!!

[J!m]

Well, it’s damn bright!

I don’t know how the new ones are (on the wrist- they seem heavy with a crystal back and metal filled ceramic insert) but the first gen really hit it out of the park for me. I love it.

Seiko durability and Rolex class.

[Ravager135]

Originally Posted by chloebear

Thank you both for the well thought out advice. Really interesting about people wishing they'd gone bigger when they move to Panerai. I absolutely think the Panerai look is larger. I also think that in my Rolex mind that 42 is huge, but I think that's wrong. I think Rolex sizes are skewed up because of their lugs.

I am falling hard for a Panerai of late. The more I look at them the more I like them.

No problem. I'll add that the Submersibles (even the PAM 24 that I used to own, which is the "bargain" Submersible) are really well made. The bezel is very reassuring and the case finish is well done. The 1950 case models are even more refined and elegant. Part of the "problem" with Panerai is that they never give you everything in one model. If you buy a Rolex Submariner or GMT-Master II, you are getting a pretty iconic model that has a ton of the Rolex DNA. Rolex really only makes one professional case: the Oyster case. Panerai on the other hand has multiple cases in multiple sizes. Even the Luminor is very different from the Luminor 1950 in terms of curves and finish. The newer 1950 models (noted with a "1" in front of them) have slightly thinner cases than their predecessors. As a result, the 1305 is subtly thinner than the 305 even though they are essentially the same watch.

I only say all this because each Panerai reference is different from the next and once you have one model, you tend to start to miss the things that your model doesn't have that others do. The 682 and 1305 are basically the same watch. The former is 42mm and the latter is 47mm. The 1305 is a big watch. I am not suggesting you jump right to a 47mm piece. I am also in no way saying that the 42mm 682 is a bad choice. What I am saying is that if I were to guide someone into the Panerai brand, I would recommend a 44mm base Luminor model first. In lieu of that, I'd strongly recommend spending a considerable amount of time at an AD trying on as many Panerai as you can (even models you don't like) just to get an idea of size, strap options, clasp, crown, look, etc.

I myself am looking for a 1950s case model and literally change my mind every day regarding whether I want the 1305, 233, or 372 and each model is radically different.

[chloebear]

Hey Evan,

Thanks for the feedback. I think I need to take my time, do some research, then get to an AD and spend some time. I stopped and looked at them when I was in Vegas but I wasn't prepared and didn't find the sales associates very helpful. I think a trip to Dallas (the nearest AD) is in order. At this point I'm all over the map. One day I want a Radiomir, the next a Luminor, then a Submersible.

I tend to find the research and hunt to be half the fun. On a related topic what are your thoughts on buying a used Panerai?

Thanks,

Mike

[jarecki]

I have a few Panerais (my favorite brand). I agree that if you get into Panerai, you generally end up wanting the big ones (47mm). I understand that the size may be intimidating at first (depending on how big you are and how big your wrist is).

For reference, I’m a big guy (6’1, 185 lbs), but with relatively slim wrists (7.25”). I have the 389 submersible, among others, and love it.

For a first submersible Pam (and all Panerais are divers by definition), if you’re intimidated by the 47s, I would not overlook the 1024. It’s a great looking 44mm, in steel, and a great value. Doesn’t get much love for some reason, but it’s a great looking watch... You give up on in-house movement with 1024, but who really cares?

At 42mm 682 is just too small for a Pam, for me.

[fullcourt]

very good buddy of mine has the 682, amazing piece no doubt. good luck in your quest

[eonflux]

Recently picked up a 682.
It's a great watch, and fits me a bit better than the 275 I had previously.

I have both the LN and Sub, and they're quite similar, though not to the extent that having both would be completely redundant.
But I like wearing my D-Blue much more.
For a diver, given that you have the LN, I'd recommend a SD43 or DSSD.

A Panerai and the LN would make a nice pair. Very different experiences on the wrist.
You can always add a Sub later. There will be an updated Sub at some point with the 3235 movement, so it may be prudent to wait.

[Saoirse32]

Originally Posted by Ravager135

I own a couple Submariners and while I don't have experience with the PAM 682 in particular, I do own several Panerai and am very familiar with the brand. The Submariner is the Submariner and I would agree it is very similar aesthetically to the GMT-Master II LN.

I think a Panerai Submersible (regardless of model) would be a great pairing. From what I understand the PAM 682 is very wearable despite its 42mm diameter. It is very clearly a robust, masculine diver and will stand apart from your more refined GMT-Master II more significantly.

What I have seen when it comes to Panerai and this model in particular is that once you get into the brand, people tend to go up in size. They regret smaller models despite initially wanting one. The smaller models are just not as emblematic to the brand. That said, the 682 has been getting nothing but positive reviews from most watch organizations. I am interested in a Panerai Submersible, but in the 1950 case there really isn't anything currently being made between the 42mm and 47mm case. There have been releases in the past and the classic PAM 1024 is always an option at 44mm.

If you like the way the 682 looks, I say go ahead and get it. It's equal to the task of the Submariner and is far more sporty looking. It will contrast well with your GMT-Master II. Just be aware, once you get one PAM, you tend to want another. You also tend to want larger pieces.

This^^^. Well said, and spot on. I looked at the 682 but ended up with the beautiful 1305 for many of the reasons articulated above!

[Andad]

Originally Posted by J!m

Just for further confusion, I’m going to throw the Omega Planet Ocean in the mix. But, with a caveat- avoid colors. I love my 45.5 first gen but would be equally happy with a 42 first gen.

For a diver, ithits all the marks- durable, stylish, sea dweller depth rating, DOMED sapphire with ar coating, so legibility in all conditions (even without my glasses) is outstanding, Chernobyl grade lume, chronometer rated, solid build and very cheap (in Rolex terms) second hand. I’d also suggest avoiding the display back gimmick but that’s not a big deal other than making the case thicker a bit.

Except for the bezel graduations, they don't comply with ISO 'diver' requirements.

Nice Pam though.

[Ravager135]

Originally Posted by chloebear

Hey Evan,

Thanks for the feedback. I think I need to take my time, do some research, then get to an AD and spend some time. I stopped and looked at them when I was in Vegas but I wasn't prepared and didn't find the sales associates very helpful. I think a trip to Dallas (the nearest AD) is in order. At this point I'm all over the map. One day I want a Radiomir, the next a Luminor, then a Submersible.

I tend to find the research and hunt to be half the fun. On a related topic what are your thoughts on buying a used Panerai?

Thanks,

Mike

I think buying a used Panerai or grey dealer Panerai is the only way to go when it comes to regular production models. Most brand new Limited Editions need to be obtained through boutiques, but regular production pieces can be had in extremely good condition or brand new from trusted sellers at a significant discount. Once again, that discount varies significantly model to model.

[blacke90]

Totally agree with the comments below. Can’t get everything in a Panerai like Ravager stated. Do spend time at the AD trying out different models. With other watches, I make my decision fast on the spot at the AD, but with Panerai I really have to take my time because they are so unique and different than all the other watches out there. Some Panerai just look totally different when you wear it compare to looking at when they are in the case. If I had my way I would own about 4 different Panerai, I ended up with a 233 because it had all the elements and features I wanted (44mm, sandwich dial, domed crystal, second hand, gmt, and etc.) Good luck!

Originally Posted by Ravager135

...Part of the “problem” with Panerai is that they never give you everything in one model.

I only say all this because each Panerai reference is different from the next and once you have one model, you tend to start to miss the things that your model doesn't have that others do. The 682 and 1305 are basically the same watch. The former is 42mm and the latter is 47mm. The 1305 is a big watch. I am not suggesting you jump right to a 47mm piece. I am also in no way saying that the 42mm 682 is a bad choice. What I am saying is that if I were to guide someone into the Panerai brand, I would recommend a 44mm base Luminor model first. In lieu of that, I'd strongly recommend spending a considerable amount of time at an AD trying on as many Panerai as you can (even models you don't like) just to get an idea of size, strap options, clasp, crown, look, etc.

I myself am looking for a 1950s case model and literally change my mind every day regarding whether I want the 1305, 233, or 372 and each model is radically different.

[blacke90]

Don’t afraid to go bigger. I’m 5’9” about 150 lbs with ~6.75-7” wrists. Feel perfectly normal when I wear my 44mm PAM. I normally wear 36mm watch. I tried on the 45mm Luminor Due and it feels smaller than my 44mm. Give that a try also.

With Dallas Panerai Boutique, Kendal is pleasant to chat with. I’m Sure they’ll throw some goodies if you buy it from there.

Originally Posted by chloebear

Hey Evan,

Thanks for the feedback. I think I need to take my time, do some research, then get to an AD and spend some time. I stopped and looked at them when I was in Vegas but I wasn't prepared and didn't find the sales associates very helpful. I think a trip to Dallas (the nearest AD) is in order. At this point I'm all over the map. One day I want a Radiomir, the next a Luminor, then a Submersible.

I tend to find the research and hunt to be half the fun. On a related topic what are your thoughts on buying a used Panerai?

Thanks,

Mike

[chloebear]

I'm not sure why but it feels like the Panerai sub-community on TRF gives way better, more specific advice then on the Rolex side. Thank you all for the excellent guidance. Buying a Panerai definitely requires some research because there are a surprising number of options.

I made the "mistake" of looking at the PAM654 last night. One of the most stunning watches I've ever seen. I'm borderline obsessed with it. Two days ago I was looking at Base Logo's, then stepped up to Submersibles and now Flybacks.

With respect to size I think I've already upped my size preference from 42 to 44mm per the advice gleaned on this post. If I go Radiomir I'll go 45. I think just hearing the number 47 seems crazy, but Panerai's are supposed to be big, so I'm even warming to them.

Honestly as much as I'm enjoying the brand I could see having 2 or more pretty easily. I'm 6'0" and 185 pounds, but pretty small wrists (6 3/4), however my Explorer II has been my daily for the last two years so I definitely like larger watches.

[Mystro]

No brand consistently does dial legibility better than Panerai. In any light, the design of the Pam dial is a icon.

[chloebear]

Originally Posted by eonflux

Recently picked up a 682.
It's a great watch, and fits me a bit better than the 275 I had previously.

I have both the LN and Sub, and they're quite similar, though not to the extent that having both would be completely redundant.
But I like wearing my D-Blue much more.
For a diver, given that you have the LN, I'd recommend a SD43 or DSSD.

A Panerai and the LN would make a nice pair. Very different experiences on the wrist.
You can always add a Sub later. There will be an updated Sub at some point with the 3235 movement, so it may be prudent to wait.

Thanks for the excellent photos! It really helps to see a relative size of watches I already own (or are at least familiar with) compared to the Panerai's I'm looking at. Great collection too! I think if I were to get a Rolex diver it would be the SD43 or DSSD. I had dibs on a Hulk the other day at my local AD, but didn't love it as much as I thought I would. It's really cool, but I think 40's are even looking a little small to me.

I've had an Explorer three times and flipped it three times because it seemed so small to me. So for now the Milgauss and GMT will occupy the smaller/dressier part of my lineup. Explorer II and Panerai will be the daily wearers.

[Ravager135]

Originally Posted by blacke90

Don’t afraid to go bigger. I’m 5’9” about 150 lbs with ~6.75-7” wrists. Feel perfectly normal when I wear my 44mm PAM. I normally wear 36mm watch. I tried on the 45mm Luminor Due and it feels smaller than my 44mm. Give that a try also.

With Dallas Panerai Boutique, Kendal is pleasant to chat with. I’m Sure they’ll throw some goodies if you buy it from there.

Funny you mentioned Kendal. She helped me via phone obtain a now discontinued OEM Panerai strap. She was very knowledgeable.

[blacke90]

Small world, and I was only visiting Dallas.

Originally Posted by Ravager135

Funny you mentioned Kendal. She helped me via phone obtain a now discontinued OEM Panerai strap. She was very knowledgeable.