Certified Pre-Owned With Swapped Dial?

[CarlOver]

Sounds like dial is not correct based on the info provided. The Z blue sells for a premium over the other dials? So you likely paid considerably more for that dial color in that watch. Have a discussion with the dealer. Keep us posted.

[chro.nic]

Was the dial was changed during the CPO inspection? Could it have been changed earlier and the CPO check didn't see it as an issue?

.nic

[RestfulJambs]

Update (TLDR is Below) So, I spoke with the AD. They acknowledged the error on the phone and apologized for not telling me this detail up front (which at first was my main gripe). Then I did more digging and saw that pre-2010 116400GVs with an original black dial sell for less than what I paid, and that my price was consistent with what Z-Blue models were selling for at other CPOs. But all of those watches were period accurate (i.e., 2014 or newer). So, I came away feeling a bit peeved. Here’s an older watch that would typically sell for less that someone swapped with a hotter, more popular dial and then it was priced as if it was a “true” Z-Blue, which is a newer watch by definition. Even if the swap was done by an RSC with an OEM dial, that felt like BS. I started texting with the AD and sent some links to ‘08 and ‘09 Milgausses that were selling at a lower price and told them I couldn’t find a single CPO Milgauss in Z-Blue pre-dating 2014. They came back offering to credit me $500, and also sent a link to a 2008 with a black dial that Tourneau was selling for the same price as my watch. I countered that Tourneau’s watch came with all the original paperwork, was in any case inexplicably priced the same as their two 2016 models that had a black dial, AND was inconsistent with the overall market based on the links I had previously sent. Finally, this morning they agreed to knock $800 off the price (final offer) or do a return. They also promised to ensure they disclose information like this in the future for other watches. I accepted the offer.

Anticipating some questions, I will not be naming this AD. I have no hard feelings towards them whatsoever. They are family-owned and have been in business for nearly 100 years. I have bought an engagement ring from them in the past and know that they are all really nice people. Rolex CPO is a new program for them. So, I understand that things can slip through the cracks when you’re starting to deal in pre-owned watches instead of just new ones. All in all, I am happy with how it turned out and even happier with this watch. Thank you all for your extremely helpful advice and input.

TLDR: Had some back-and-forth with the AD. They apologized and credited me $800. I accepted and am happy.

[fskywalker]

Originally Posted by SearChart

That dial is allowed in that reference and it was done by an official Rolex service center and thus updated the configuration in the Rolex system.

Those calling it 'franken' are delusional.

Agree with Bas, don’t understand the whole
Franken notion here !


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[RestfulJambs]

For those who asked, here she is.

[Rolexken]

If I was buying CPO I would want to see the Rolex service report to see what parts have been changed and then decide with full disclosure.

[subtona]

Originally Posted by RestfulJambs

Update (TLDR is Below) So, I spoke with the AD. They acknowledged the error on the phone and apologized for not telling me this detail up front (which at first was my main gripe). Then I did more digging and saw that pre-2010 116400GVs with an original black dial sell for less than what I paid, and that my price was consistent with what Z-Blue models were selling for at other CPOs. But all of those watches were period accurate (i.e., 2014 or newer). So, I came away feeling a bit peeved. Here’s an older watch that would typically sell for less that someone swapped with a hotter, more popular dial and then it was priced as if it was a “true” Z-Blue, which is a newer watch by definition. Even if the swap was done by an RSC with an OEM dial, that felt like BS. I started texting with the AD and sent some links to ‘08 and ‘09 Milgausses that were selling at a lower price and told them I couldn’t find a single CPO Milgauss in Z-Blue pre-dating 2014. They came back offering to credit me $500, and also sent a link to a 2008 with a black dial that Tourneau was selling for the same price as my watch. I countered that Tourneau’s watch came with all the original paperwork, was in any case inexplicably priced the same as their two 2016 models that had a black dial, AND was inconsistent with the overall market based on the links I had previously sent. Finally, this morning they agreed to knock $800 off the price (final offer) or do a return. They also promised to ensure they disclose information like this in the future for other watches. I accepted the offer.

Anticipating some questions, I will not be naming this AD. I have no hard feelings towards them whatsoever. They are family-owned and have been in business for nearly 100 years. I have bought an engagement ring from them in the past and know that they are all really nice people. Rolex CPO is a new program for them. So, I understand that things can slip through the cracks when you’re starting to deal in pre-owned watches instead of just new ones. All in all, I am happy with how it turned out and even happier with this watch. Thank you all for your extremely helpful advice and input.

TLDR: Had some back-and-forth with the AD. They apologized and credited me $800. I accepted and am happy.

Sounds like your watch does not include original paperwork and was priced accordingly in the end?
As long as the model has an authentic dial option and the cpo program is behind it= zero concerns.

Enjoy.

[1William]

Quiet the journey. Thanks for the update and as long as you are happy with the watch that is what matters. Enjoy.

[KatGirl]

Thanks for the update, and well done, you!

Kat


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[alphadweller]

The only way I would have accepted the watch is with its original dial in a bag, on top of the non-period correct dial - albeit Rolex approved - in the watch. I don't like the little game of swapping a dial to make more money, when that dial wasn't available from factory at the time of manufacture. Personally, I would have asked for a return. OP is happy with a $800 cash back, good for him.

[Kevin of Larchmont]

Originally Posted by SearChart

That dial is allowed in that reference and it was done by an official Rolex service center and thus updated the configuration in the Rolex system.

Those calling it 'franken' are delusional.

While there is no technical definition of “Franken” in colloquial usage here it seems to mean “cobbled together out of mismatched or counterfeit pieces.” Since it’s an authentic Rolex dial and the work was performed at an RSC and its configuration was updated in the Rolex permanent record that seems to be the antithesis of a Frankenwatch. As long as there is provenance for these changes I wouldn’t worry a bit. Having said that I also wouldn’t pass up the opportunity to leverage the AD for a price adjustment based on the poor communication.

[Scholar]

Originally Posted by SearChart

That dial is allowed in that reference and it was done by an official Rolex service center and thus updated the configuration in the Rolex system.

Those calling it 'franken' are delusional.

Reading those comments, I wonder what those people made of dials that were officially switched out on Datejusts and the like.

[KatGirl]

I was under the impression that Rolex will do dial swaps, when asked, but only if the watch is out of warranty, and only if the model was available with the requested new dial at the time it was manufactured. So I considered it a franken, because the watch in question could not have originally had that dial.

Kat