Would you trade a 5712 for FPJ Chronometre Bleu?

[rolexpatek363]

Originally Posted by crod

I have the 5711 and the CB and love them both, from what I understand from your post you dont like what has happened with the Nautilus line in terms of awareness, flexing etc. I feel the same way and although i still love my 5711 I tend to wear it far less than what i did 4 years ago. The CB is NOT noticeable you have to be into watches to really know what it is.
Last week for example I was travelling in Shanghai and went into the ALS boutique to try the Lange 1. i was wearing the FP QP (perpetual calendar). The Sales Associate asked me which brand was the watch and when I told him he said he had heard of it but never actually saw one.

I think the CB will give you what you are looking for better than the 5712.

Yes, that's exactly how I feel.

[DGB]

The CB is a much more interesting watch, gold movement, beautiful dial, and goes below the radar.
I would go for it.


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[ChetBaker]

In all fairness though and having thought about it. The CB is a 30k watch that goes for 80k. If I had 80 to spend I would opt for something that has exceptional finishing and can be had at or close to retail.

[rolexpatek363]

Originally Posted by ChetBaker

I would but with chunk of cash your way

It's the other way around. The offer I have is 5712 + £33,000 = Chrono Bleu

So this is clearly not happening.

[magicman]

Originally Posted by rolexpatek363

It's the other way around. The offer I have is 5712 + £33,000 = Chrono Bleu

So this is clearly not happening.

That’s crazy. Someone is trying to cheat you or they don’t understanding the pricing for these watches. CB has come down significantly in the past few years.

[psv]

Not even close, keep the Nautilus

[rolexpatek363]

Originally Posted by magicman

That’s crazy. Someone is trying to cheat you or they don’t understanding the pricing for these watches. CB has come down significantly in the past few years.

I knew the guy was going to try to lowball me. He was saying things like "the Nautilus market's very fragile at the moment" when I mentioned that I might sell him my 5712. When he actually offered me £52k over the phone I laughed out loud.

Fragile market for PP, but apparently not fragile for FPJ. Chrono 24 pricing is reliable for the FPJ, but not reliable tor PP.

I think he deals with a lot of professional footballers who presumably don't care too much about these trifling amounts of money.

[APhound]

I don’t know how anyone can make heads or tails of the fpj market. It’s very hard, at least for me, to figure out.


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[rolexpatek363]

It's very strange, although there are some parallels with the Nautilus market..

AIUI, about 10-15% of FPJ output is the CB, so that's 100-150 per year. But demand is sky-high, and so is speculation because the UK RRP is about £31,000, and you can sell it the next day for about £80,000. FPJ wants to discourage speculation and sell his watches to enthusiasts, which is fair enough.

In order to be considered trustworthy, you have to demonstrate commitment to the brand, meaning that you can't get onto a waiting list for a nice "cheap" CB until you've bought & retained a number of their other watches, most of which are considerably more expensive...

A minnow like me has no hope of getting a new one at RRP.

[ChetBaker]

Originally Posted by rolexpatek363

It's the other way around. The offer I have is 5712 + £33,000 = Chrono Bleu

So this is clearly not happening.

Steer clear! I had this happen to me recently as well. Dealers lowballing on their offer but wanting asking price for their watch that isn’t selling. Not happening.

[rolexpatek363]

The dealer came over as a slimeball right from the off. He doesn't even have a CB in stock, it's apparently a friend of his can source it from somewhere in the EU. If he wants to do business, the least he could do is make a serious offer and be sensible.

I'll "slum it" with the Nautilus for now, and see if I can find a serious person to take it off my hands next year. I'm nothing if not patient and dogged.

[ts3]

Originally Posted by rolexpatek363

Haha! If only. It's a 300E 3L straight six auto, pre-facelift. It just purrs along and doesn't upset anyone. I love it. Thanks for all the additional comments, and of course more input is always welcome.

If I do decide to change, I'll post a picture of the CB.

My 1994 E320 Coupe says hello.

Trading a 5712 into a CB would have been a no for me even if the valuation had made sense. I thought about adding a CB years ago when they were around 40k secondary but it didn't happen. Love the case, interesting enough movement, but less sure about some of the lighter blue tones (depending on the light) and the Journe hands and numerals. I am also enjoying my good old 5711 all the time no matter the recent hype. The watch itself is as nice and comfortable as it always was and where I move about it hardly gets recognized.

[yessir69]

Get the Journe and if you regret it get a 3712 instead.

[rolexpatek363]

Originally Posted by ts3

My 1994 E320 Coupe says hello.

Trading a 5712 into a CB would have been a no for me even if the valuation had made sense. I thought about adding a CB years ago when they were around 40k secondary but it didn't happen. Love the case, interesting enough movement, but less sure about some of the lighter blue tones (depending on the light) and the Journe hands and numerals. I am also enjoying my good old 5711 all the time no matter the recent hype. The watch itself is as nice and comfortable as it always was and where I move about it hardly gets recognized.

Such great cars, just lovely to waft around in, totally stress-free.

The other contender for the CB I can think of is the blue Credor Eichi II. which is absolutely stunning in person, and has better finishing on the movement. Cheaper as well, and none of the personality cult.

https://www.seikoboutique.co.uk/prod...platinum-ruri/

[GB-man]

That offer is completely insane. I have a CB I would trade 1:1 with a 5712 unfortunately I’m not in Europe. Keep looking for a better deal.

[rolexpatek363]

"unfortunately I’m not in Europe"

That's a shame.

I will cast the net wider. Fortunately I am not in any great hurry.

[Jay (Eire)]

I had come to the same conclusion about my 5711, it was unwearable and as much as I liked it (still do) my brain was telling me do something. It was a combination of it being unwearable and the crazy secondary market prices that led me to dump it. No regrets.

All that said, for me your thought of trading for a CB, while an upgrade in my opinion in some ways, is not something I’d do. At the prices of both of these watches there are a lot more interesting watches to buy. I say that as a long time Journe owner, multiple watches including a CB I’ve owned and loved for more than a decade.

The other thing I would add, despite the peaks the CB hit in the secondary market it never crossed my mind to sell it.

[rolexpatek363]

The CB is THE watch I've desired for many years. Having said that, the Credor is an absolutely stunning watch as well, and arguably has a better dial and movement.

Very often the hunt is where most of the pleasure is.

[Starwalker]

I would get the CB - it is literally a work of art and in far fewer numbers - with an even greater waiting lists. It’s a very tough question to answer but the 5712 in spite of being one of my favourite watches from PP - it can’t come close to the handicraft produced by FJP