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Grissom · 14 April 2011, 06:09 AM

It seems to me, browsing the Sale section here on TRF, that proportionally more SS Ceramic Subs (116610) are being "resold" than SS GMTIIcs (116710). Not sure my "unscientific" sampling is indicative of anything, but I thought I would throw this out, and see what folks thought.

Would one see this because folks like their SS Ceramic GMTIIcs so much they never flip them, thus fewer available for the secondary market, or conversely, because folks prefer the SS Ceramic Subs so much, that proportionally more Subs are purchased than GMTIIcs, even though the Ceramic GMTIIc has been out longer than the Ceramic Sub?

I would have thought I would see more SS Ceramic GMTs on the secondary market, versus SS Ceramic Subs, if for no other reason than the GMTs have been out for a few years longer........

Any and all thoughts and observations appreciated, as I continue to attempt to understand the psychology of my being a Rolex addict!

Thanks,

Nathan

(ps....good luck to everyone who is participating in the Explorer II Give-away!)

LightOnAHill · 14 April 2011, 06:16 AM

Quote:

because folks prefer the SS Ceramic Subs so much, that proportionally more Subs are purchased than GMTIIcs, even though the Ceramic GMTIIc has been out longer than the Ceramic Sub

this would be my guess

The GMT Master · 14 April 2011, 06:22 AM

I think it's more to do with the fact that the Sub is still a novelty, and people can flip them for a decent price. The interest in the GMT has died down recently, and prices have been affected accordingly. Wait until the next price rise, and you'll see more GMTs again

Danand · 14 April 2011, 06:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightOnAHill

this would be my guess

Agree and especially since it is the newer model generating lots of interest. The gmt 11 c likely had lots of turnove a few years ago when it was new. Likely in a few years the ratio or resales will settle down to be roughly the same as their sales volumes. (my guess obviously). Cheers!

dannyp · 14 April 2011, 06:23 AM

Perhaps people thought they'd like it more than they actually did? If you were a huge Sub enthusiast, naturally you'd want the latest iteration, but with its new case, bracelet and shiny ceramic bezel, maybe you just could never get into it. You'd have to look at the numbers of GMT IIc watches being flipped when they first came out (and may have been the subject of a similar phenomenon) to really draw a comparison.

cedargrove · 14 April 2011, 06:24 AM

Possibly because the 'curmudgeon movement' has convinced Sub C owners they need a pre-ceramic model instead, so they're selling their ceramics.

Or your first reason - there are more Subs out there, hence more to be sold.

mjm800 · 14 April 2011, 06:24 AM

People want it plain and simple. My AD does not even have them displayed they get them in and call the waiting list, they never even make it to the display case.

uhmeebuh · 14 April 2011, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cedargrove

Possibly because the 'curmudgeon movement' has convinced Sub C owners they need a pre-ceramic model instead, so they're selling their ceramics.

THIS!

It's probably a combo of the availability and interest/novelty. I suspect it'll die down once the new EXP IIs and other new models pop up. Demand seems to drive a lot of it...

SaddleSC · 14 April 2011, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The GMT Master

I think it's more to do with the fact that the Sub is still a novelty, and people can flip them for a decent price. The interest in the GMT has died down recently, and prices have been affected accordingly. Wait until the next price rise, and you'll see more GMTs again

I agree with this explanation.

ersnyder · 14 April 2011, 08:10 AM

More Subs than GMT's is the reason IMO.

dddrees · 14 April 2011, 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The GMT Master

I think it's more to do with the fact that the Sub is still a novelty, and people can flip them for a decent price. The interest in the GMT has died down recently, and prices have been affected accordingly. Wait until the next price rise, and you'll see more GMTs again

Or the Sub is just the latest model and that is the one being purchased most at this point in time.

nauticajoe · 14 April 2011, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the gmt master

i think it's more to do with the fact that the sub is still a novelty, and people can flip them for a decent price. The interest in the gmt has died down recently, and prices have been affected accordingly. Wait until the next price rise, and you'll see more gmts again

x3.

Kineticwash · 14 April 2011, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The GMT Master

I think it's more to do with the fact that the Sub is still a novelty, and people can flip them for a decent price. The interest in the GMT has died down recently, and prices have been affected accordingly. Wait until the next price rise, and you'll see more GMTs again

Any idea when the impending price increase will come?

scl6118 · 14 April 2011, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mjm800

People want it plain and simple. My AD does not even have them displayed they get them in and call the waiting list, they never even make it to the display case.

Not in my area. I went to my AD a week ago and they had a brand new Sub C sitting in the case. I tried it on.......nice!

wokafu · 14 April 2011, 12:33 PM

Interesting 'facts'....maybe those who had sold theirs SubC can tell us what's going on ??

MortgageGuy · 14 April 2011, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nauticajoe

x3.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The GMT Master

I think it's more to do with the fact that the Sub is still a novelty, and people can flip them for a decent price. The interest in the GMT has died down recently, and prices have been affected accordingly. Wait until the next price rise, and you'll see more GMTs again

X4

Quote:

Originally Posted by wokafu

Interesting 'facts'....maybe those who had sold theirs SubC can tell us what's going on ??

Well I flipped my Sub C and kept the GMT C, I dont know why but I am just loving my GMT and the way it wears on my wrist... I for one like the PCL's too even though I appear to be in the minority

Asian Sub · 14 April 2011, 01:37 PM

Had my GMT 2c since july 2009 and bought my Sub C only this year. Just sold it last week. I find the GMT 2c a lot classier and comfortable to wear due to flatter case back. Had a 16610 before my GMT 2c but could not justify the huge price difference between the 16610 and 116610 while they look almost exactly the same.

Grissom · 14 April 2011, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wokafu

Interesting 'facts'....maybe those who had sold theirs SubC can tell us what's going on ??

Excellent suggestion!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by MortgageGuy

Well I flipped my Sub C and kept the GMT C, I dont know why but I am just loving my GMT and the way it wears on my wrist... I for one like the PCL's too even though I appear to be in the minority

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asian Sub

Had my GMT 2c since july 2009 and bought my Sub C only this year. Just sold it last week. I find the GMT 2c a lot classier and comfortable to wear due to flatter case back. Had a 16610 before my GMT 2c but could not justify the huge price difference between the 16610 and 116610 while they look almost exactly the same.

Adam, Ken......thanks for sharing! That's what I like to read.....personal views from the viewpoint of those who have "had and flipped"!

RedwinGV · 15 April 2011, 05:03 AM

I can understand the passion of the sub crowd here, but if more Subs are resold, one has to think that the owner of the sub preferred another watch. Same can be said for GMT as well.
So, are the original sales of the GMT that much lower than the Sub? Perception says otherwise. So I'm thinking more of the GMT crowd is just more satisfied with their watch over a longer period.

Could it be that more GMT owners just like their watch more than the "comparable" Sub owner?
I'm not trying to slam the Sub crowd at all, but this question does get one to think some.

ArcticMoose · 15 April 2011, 05:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The GMT Master

I think it's more to do with the fact that the Sub is still a novelty, and people can flip them for a decent price.

This was my first thought too.

If you check archived for-sale posts from around the time of the GMTIIc release I think you'll see the same trend.

DiamondJack · 15 April 2011, 05:52 AM

Maybe because the ceramic bezel on the GMT II was quite a different look from the previous two colour bezel which I never liked. Whereas the sub was always a black bezel so just a change of material. I personally love my new GMT II and will never trade it.

But also love the sub too but am going vintage as I love the red subs more :-)

14 April 2011, 06:09 AM	#1
Grissom "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Real Name: Nathan Location: US, Latin America Watch: GMT IIc 18K/SS Posts: 3,349	Your Thoughts: Why are more SS Ceramic Subs resold than SS Ceramic GMTIIcs It seems to me, browsing the Sale section here on TRF, that proportionally more SS Ceramic Subs (116610) are being "resold" than SS GMTIIcs (116710). Not sure my "unscientific" sampling is indicative of anything, but I thought I would throw this out, and see what folks thought. Would one see this because folks like their SS Ceramic GMTIIcs so much they never flip them, thus fewer available for the secondary market, or conversely, because folks prefer the SS Ceramic Subs so much, that proportionally more Subs are purchased than GMTIIcs, even though the Ceramic GMTIIc has been out longer than the Ceramic Sub? I would have thought I would see more SS Ceramic GMTs on the secondary market, versus SS Ceramic Subs, if for no other reason than the GMTs have been out for a few years longer........ Any and all thoughts and observations appreciated, as I continue to attempt to understand the psychology of my being a Rolex addict! Thanks, Nathan (ps....good luck to everyone who is participating in the Explorer II Give-away!) __________________ *(Member NAWCC since 1976)* 116713LN GMT-IIc 18k/SS (Z) + 116520 SS Daytona (M) + 16700 GMT Master (A) + 16610LV Submariner (V) + 16600 Sea Dweller (Z) + 116400 Milgauss White Dial (V) + 70330N Tudor Heritage Chronograph Grey w/Black Sub Dials (J) + 5513 Submariner Serif Dial (5.2 Mil) Who else needs an Intervention? (109 297) (137 237) (73 115) (221) (23) (56) (229) P-Club Member #5 RIP JJ Irani - TRF Legend

14 April 2011, 06:24 AM	#7
mjm800 "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: USA Posts: 1,950	People want it plain and simple. My AD does not even have them displayed they get them in and call the waiting list, they never even make it to the display case. __________________

15 April 2011, 05:03 AM	#19
RedwinGV "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Real Name: Joe Location: Northville, MI,US Watch: Smstr 600m BigBlue Posts: 412	I can understand the passion of the sub crowd here, but if more Subs are resold, one has to think that the owner of the sub preferred another watch. Same can be said for GMT as well. So, are the original sales of the GMT that much lower than the Sub? Perception says otherwise. So I'm thinking more of the GMT crowd is just more satisfied with their watch over a longer period. Could it be that more GMT owners just like their watch more than the "comparable" Sub owner? I'm not trying to slam the Sub crowd at all, but this question does get one to think some. __________________ RedwinGV

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14 April 2011, 06:22 AM	#3
The GMT Master "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Real Name: Chris Location: England Posts: 8,150	I think it's more to do with the fact that the Sub is still a novelty, and people can flip them for a decent price. The interest in the GMT has died down recently, and prices have been affected accordingly. Wait until the next price rise, and you'll see more GMTs again

14 April 2011, 06:23 AM	#5
dannyp Banned Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: usa Posts: 6,765	Perhaps people thought they'd like it more than they actually did? If you were a huge Sub enthusiast, naturally you'd want the latest iteration, but with its new case, bracelet and shiny ceramic bezel, maybe you just could never get into it. You'd have to look at the numbers of GMT IIc watches being flipped when they first came out (and may have been the subject of a similar phenomenon) to really draw a comparison.

14 April 2011, 06:24 AM	#6
cedargrove "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Real Name: Rich Location: Canada Watch: Milgauss, GMT IIc Posts: 3,013	Possibly because the 'curmudgeon movement' has convinced Sub C owners they need a pre-ceramic model instead, so they're selling their ceramics. Or your first reason - there are more Subs out there, hence more to be sold.

14 April 2011, 08:10 AM	#10
ersnyder 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Real Name: Eric Location: Long Beach CA USA Watch: Rolex Explorer II Posts: 4,102	More Subs than GMT's is the reason IMO.

14 April 2011, 12:33 PM	#15
wokafu "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Malaysia Watch: SM300+14060M Posts: 2,012	Interesting 'facts'....maybe those who had sold theirs SubC can tell us what's going on ??

14 April 2011, 01:37 PM	#17
Asian Sub "TRF" Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Real Name: Ken Location: Asia Watch: GMT IIc / SUB C Posts: 200	Had my GMT 2c since july 2009 and bought my Sub C only this year. Just sold it last week. I find the GMT 2c a lot classier and comfortable to wear due to flatter case back. Had a 16610 before my GMT 2c but could not justify the huge price difference between the 16610 and 116610 while they look almost exactly the same.

15 April 2011, 05:52 AM	#21
DiamondJack "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: London Watch: Quite a few Posts: 4,315	Maybe because the ceramic bezel on the GMT II was quite a different look from the previous two colour bezel which I never liked. Whereas the sub was always a black bezel so just a change of material. I personally love my new GMT II and will never trade it. But also love the sub too but am going vintage as I love the red subs more :-)

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