5976/1G - First auction, nice Premium

[texex91]

Originally Posted by KarlS

Both gentlemen and yes I think it helps them having a face to a. SME when they look at the allocation lists.

Thankfully we don't need that in the US, our AD's have year old 'allocation' pieces sitting around in their safes...no list needed, or so it seems

[KarlS]

Originally Posted by texex91

Thankfully we don't need that in the US, our AD's have year old 'allocation' pieces sitting around in their safes...no list needed, or so it seems

No I was thinking the same thing.... Not only is it Tysons Corner bulging out the safe but now it seems also in Philly!!! Definately more efficient.... It means the AD allocates to clients / potential clients / friends / grey dealers / friends who can sell at auction and take a cut .....capitalism at its finest!!

[Racerdj]

What a great experience!!

Originally Posted by JBP99p

If you ever get a chance to meet Mark Hearn or Adrian Lurshay (Sales director) for that matter then grab it with both hands!, they are very nice people and great to speak too. I was fortunate to have been allocated a private meeting (45mins) in the company of both of them in viewing the 2017 releases at the PP stand, Baselworld. Yes I had to pinch myself as I was led to a second floor meeting room, handle the new watches and consume champagne! Personally I adore this brand, when they do things they do it well! Showing this passion I believe has help in the allocations I have received

[martinr]

Originally Posted by KarlS

No I was thinking the same thing.... Not only is it Tysons Corner bulging out the safe but now it seems also in Philly!!! Definately more efficient.... It means the AD allocates to clients / potential clients / friends / grey dealers / friends who can sell at auction and take a cut .....capitalism at its finest!!

No different than cultivating a friendship with the head guys from Rhone is it?

[KarlS]

Originally Posted by JBP99p

I'd heard similar though also that they were reserved for AD's only in discussing stock for the upcoming year. All I can say is that I have met Mark and Adrian several times at events so why my friend and I were accommodated, I can only think it was because they know we are PP mad!...we are certainly not big collectors just humble ones I can assure you of that!

Get them to organize you a trip to Geneva. They do it well!

[KarlS]

Originally Posted by martinr

No different than cultivating a friendship with the head guys from Rhone is it?

Not sure...met them once...but in reflection....certainly can't hurt!

[Russell996]

Originally Posted by martinr

No different than cultivating a friendship with the head guys from Rhone is it?

Oh I think it is completely different.

[codecow]

This is a great result. The chrono was by far the easier of the two pieces to get; although had I had the money and ordered it I'd be a bit sad to have a few months later the Advanced Research Aquanaut come out; I think of the two I'd rather have the AR.

[Socal to az]

Isn't this the same piece that was too large? that Patek was making pieces too big? The ugly diamonds? The gaudy inscription? This piece that no one wanted is being sold well above list? Yeah- Patek is going in the wrong direction for sure. lol

Love the size and heft of this piece and I wish I had the opportunity to get one. :)

[martinr]

Originally Posted by Russell996

Oh I think it is completely different.

How is it completely different? I don't see any difference between a friendship/relationship with Rhone or a USA AD. The people doing the deciding give the watches to whoever they want, you said your not a big buyer but just passionate and that's why you got your 5131. It's not like the US AD's are corrupt and Rhone has some higher standard.

[goog53]

Originally Posted by martinr

How is it completely different? I don't see any difference between a friendship/relationship with Rhone or a USA AD. The people doing the deciding give the watches to whoever they want, you said your not a big buyer but just passionate and that's why you got your 5131. It's not like the US AD's are corrupt and Rhone has some higher standard.

I am not saying All US ADs are bad and All UK ADs are great but do you honestly think in the US any AD would give a guy a 5131 because he "patiently waited" for 8 years and in those 8 years didn't buy one regular production model from the brand. I'm not here to crush Russell. I think it is great he has a 5131 but the only piece he owns from Patek is that and later bought his wife a piece after he got his grail and a trip to Geneva. I don't know the guys purchase history with other brands from this AD and it isn't any of my business and he doesn't have to defend himself but I don't think this would ever happen in the US. Just my 2cents.

[Russell996]

Originally Posted by martinr

How is it completely different? I don't see any difference between a friendship/relationship with Rhone or a USA AD. The people doing the deciding give the watches to whoever they want, you said your not a big buyer but just passionate and that's why you got your 5131. It's not like the US AD's are corrupt and Rhone has some higher standard.

I wouldn't dream of suggesting any US or UK AD is corrupt but they all have internal sales pressures and existing customers to satisfy.

Very good clients can get upset if they are passed over by an AD for a rare or application piece and take their future business elsewhere - Rhone are one step removed from the sale, because of this they are able to take a different view of a client that is not based solely on the AD's past experience. They have wider policies to try to control the grey market, to sell to local customers where possible and to try to widen the Patek ownership base at all levels of watch. One factor they clearly consider is the passion not just the existing collection.

If US AD's are able to work in the same way then I stand corrected.

[Russell996]

Originally Posted by goog53

I am not saying All US ADs are bad and All UK ADs are great but do you honestly think in the US any AD would give a guy a 5131 because he "patiently waited" for 8 years and in those 8 years didn't buy one regular production model from the brand. I'm not here to crush Russell. I think it is great he has a 5131 but the only piece he owns from Patek is that and later bought his wife a piece after he got his grail and a trip to Geneva. I don't know the guys purchase history with other brands from this AD and it isn't any of my business and he doesn't have to defend himself but I don't think this would ever happen in the US. Just my 2cents.

No previous purchase history from the AD. Just passion and patience.

[KarlS]

Originally Posted by martinr

How is it completely different? I don't see any difference between a friendship/relationship with Rhone or a USA AD. The people doing the deciding give the watches to whoever they want, you said your not a big buyer but just passionate and that's why you got your 5131. It's not like the US AD's are corrupt and Rhone has some higher standard.

As a start with Rhone allocating they aren't getting to the grey market...they certainly are in the USA...so that's either from AD's making a bit more or it's them giving it to customers that are flipping. If they know their customers so well having built this wonderful relationship they should know the flippers....the huge presumption being that they actually cared!!

[texex91]

Originally Posted by KarlS

As a start with Rhone allocating they aren't getting to the grey market...they certainly are in the USA...so that's either from AD's making a bit more or it's them giving it to customers that are flipping. If they know their customers so well having built this wonderful relationship they should know the flippers....the huge presumption being that they actually cared!!

Oh, I think (while not 5131) there are those buying in EMEA and end up selling to US gray market.

Rhone has no control where watches end up eventually.

Say selling a blue 5711

[goog53]

Originally Posted by Russell996

No previous purchase history from the AD. Just passion and patience.

Now I really hate You!
I was lucky to get my Rare Salmon piece in the U.K.
I would've been laughed at in the US if I inquired about a limited piece like that. Been trying to get a 5650G in the US and honestly have a better chance of winning the lottery and I don't buy tickets

[thomaspp]

Originally Posted by goog53

Now I really hate You!
I was lucky to get my Rare Salmon piece in the U.K.
I would've been laughed at in the US if I inquired about a limited piece like that. Been trying to get a 5650G in the US and honestly have a better chance of winning the lottery and I don't buy tickets

[KarlS]

Originally Posted by texex91

Oh, I think (while not 5131) there are those buying in EMEA and end up selling to US gray market.

Rhone has no control where watches end up eventually.

Say selling a blue 5711

I am as amazed as you. With all those 5711 lying around and all these discounts that everyone gets from their favourite dealer couldn't believe there would be any interest in a pre owned 5711 at above market. In fact a 5146 might be flitting across depending on the incomings this year.

Of course they have no control where the watches end up and they don't worry about the bulk of the watches. But they do about LE and certain models. So would I even think of selling my 5711P under 2 years? No ways. Another member wanted a watch I could probably get and would have liked to have gotten for him. Is there a chance that I would take getting the watch in my name and giving to him at even no premium? No ways! So in a way they are controlling what's going into the flipping market.

[martinr]

I wonder which AD the 5976P that sold at auction came from? Mike, I think Russell's case is so unique it can't be counted as to how people get allocation pieces but I agree with you, no US AD would get someone a 5131 with no past purchase history, unless Patek is a small part of their business and they don't care and want to help a friend or relative, or make some extra money by selling it to a grey.

[goog53]

For the LE pieces I am seriously all for keeping the papers for a year or two. It eliminates a lot of the BS and quick flips on the real sought after stuff.

[JBP99p]

Originally Posted by KarlS

Get them to organize you a trip to Geneva. They do it well!

My AD did and that's how I got the ball rolling on my 5131r and where I first met Mark Hearn...and yes it was an incredible trip taking in the museum as well, the memories which I will cherish for ever!

[codecow]

Originally Posted by JBP99p

My AD did and that's how I got the ball rolling on my 5131r and where I first met Mark Hearn...and yes it was an incredible trip taking in the museum as well, the memories which I will cherish for ever!

Nobody can forget the Auberge d'Onex!!

[lapince]

Originally Posted by jon_jon

I once heard an interesting story/anecdote. A person wanted a 5131 really bad that he wrote a very personal touching story to Philippe Stern as to why it would mean so much for him to receive this piece. They were so touched by his story that they granted him his wish and presented him with a 5131.

A few months later, the new owner was invited to Geneva for a personal tour of the Salon, Museum, etc. During the visit, the owner was asked if he enjoyed wearing the watch and asked why he wasn't wearing it to the Geneva visit. He replied that he kept it in the safe and only wore it on special occasions. Then they brought in a box with the 5131 that the owner received a few months ago. Apparently Patek bid and won the watch at a recent auction. This person was banned from ever purchasing a special or LE Patek watch from an AD again.

I don't know if there is any truth to the story. But it made me wonder how closely Patek monitors auctions of LE and application pieces like MRs, Tourbilons, etc.

True or not it's a good story, but if true I can imagine the face of the guy when they showed him his ex watch

[willski]

I'm curious as to who and what type the buyer is.

5976 is a LE but at 1,300 pieces it isn't super exclusive in the grand scheme of things. I would imagine that most serious PP collectors who really really wanted one could get one allocated to him/her through their local AD/Salon, which leaves me wondering who is willing to pay almost +50% premium for this reference?

Don't get me wrong I think it's a nice watch just genuinely curious.




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[willski]

Originally Posted by lapince

True or not it's a good story, but if true I can imagine the face of the guy when they showed him his ex watch

Kind of like when you tell your wife you were on a quiet golf weekend with the boys, not knowing she had already found the receipts from Vegas :P


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[jon_jon]

Originally Posted by willski

I'm curious as to who and what type the buyer is.

5976 is a LE but at 1,300 pieces it isn't super exclusive in the grand scheme of things. I would imagine that most serious PP collectors who really really wanted one could get one allocated to him/her through their local AD/Salon, which leaves me wondering who is willing to pay almost +50% premium for this reference?

Don't get me wrong I think it's a nice watch just genuinely curious.




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The large ADs and the 3 Salons have client lists so deep that even if you purchased several regular release Patek watches from them, you would not be in the running for any of the LE pieces. Places like Tiffany NYC and Geary Beverly Hills are a couple of places that come to mind.

If your AD is located in a mid-sized city, without the long list of VIP clients, you probably have a better chance at getting a LE piece. There are also those who mainly purchase pre-owned watches and have not developed a relationship with an AD.

[willski]

Originally Posted by jon_jon

The large ADs and the 3 Salons have client lists so deep that even if you purchased several regular release Patek watches from them, you would not be in the running for any of the LE pieces. Places like Tiffany NYC and Geary Beverly Hills are a couple of places that come to mind.

If your AD is located in a mid-sized city, without the long list of VIP clients, you probably have a better chance at getting a LE piece. There are also those who mainly purchase pre-owned watches and have not developed a relationship with an AD.

You're right, but it's still surprising that even with a run of 1,300 ~$100k pieces, the demand is strong enough for a ~$150k sale. Ultimately, it's a testament to the strength of the brand and all credit to PP.


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[KarlS]

Of course the prices will soften as rhis the first. People can now buy from trusted sellers at pretty much lower levels as they don't have to pay the buyers premium. Putting that aside the 5131G at close to $200k????

[Sam Philip]

A gray dealer in the UK was asking £150000 for the 5976