AP BT allocation of hot model

[maruchan22]

Can someone mind to share how it works? From what I understand, the local BT would need to submit a request to the HQ, and then the HQ would either:

- approve
- disapprove
- approve with condition (eg, buying three 1159 before getting the jumbo)

Does it work like that?

Many thanks!

[AshAP]

Originally Posted by maruchan22

Can someone mind to share how it works? From what I understand, the local BT would need to submit a request to the HQ, and then the HQ would either:

- approve
- disapprove
- approve with condition (eg, buying three 1159 before getting the jumbo)

Does it work like that?

Many thanks!

No that’s nonsense.


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[MrJKLFoams]

Same as patek and rolex build trust by showing how enthusiast you are and also by purchasing other pieces that is not hot but then that is still a maybe. Better not to expect after you establish relationship with them and also drop by from time to time not everyday to check out hows things unless you wanna go greymonsters then you have to play this game.

[GS93108]

I'm pretty sure the allocation model isn't based on any sort of formula in the way you describe.

I'd go and visit your local AP Boutique and be honest and genuine with them as to your aspirations and in return they'll hopefully be equally as candid with you.

[maruchan22]

Originally Posted by MrJKLFoams

Same as patek and rolex build trust by showing how enthusiast you are and also by purchasing other pieces that is not hot but then that is still a maybe. Better not to expect after you establish relationship with them and also drop by from time to time not everyday to check out hows things unless you wanna go greymonsters then you have to play this game.

Why would an average joe buy pieces that he/she does not really want just to have "chance" to be allocated a hot model? Might as well buy from Grey as least it is transparent

[GS93108]

There are two type of 'hot' model, those that are limited edition of x units and then there are those that are limited production where the number of units to be produced is unknown.

If you want a limited edition piece then why would AP allocated one to an unknown entity, when they have more than enough known clients to satisfy the supply?

If you want a limited production piece, an example being the ceramic open worked perpetual calendar or the 15407 open worked, where there are just a few trickled into the market each year, then again AP have more than enough known clients to satisfy the projected production for several years.

For AP to allocate either of such pieces to 'new' walk in clients wouldn't be too endearing to their existing client base.

Thus, if you want something 'hot' then you have to earn that status. How you do that is open to interpretation, and those interpretations vary depending on the region and to whom you are talking to at the time.

There's no magic formula. It starts with your relationship with your local AP Boutique, from there you can explore what avenues there are available to you for the specific piece you are interested in. Maybe you can go to the top of your local list by dumping several zeros in a single or other purchases to show you are serious, or maybe you can be recommended by an already serious AP client, and so on...

Pick your poison, but there's no correct and perfect methodology else we'd all know about it and all the brands would be doing it.

[macrowatch]

I think HK has some 'special' rules and plays by a different game. Just look at the Glassdoor reviews of the HK office.

[maruchan22]

Originally Posted by GS93108

There are two type of 'hot' model, those that are limited edition of x units and then there are those that are limited production where the number of units to be produced is unknown.

If you want a limited edition piece then why would AP allocated one to an unknown entity, when they have more than enough known clients to satisfy the supply?

If you want a limited production piece, an example being the ceramic open worked perpetual calendar or the 15407 open worked, where there are just a few trickled into the market each year, then again AP have more than enough known clients to satisfy the projected production for several years.

For AP to allocate either of such pieces to 'new' walk in clients wouldn't be too endearing to their existing client base.

Thus, if you want something 'hot' then you have to earn that status. How you do that is open to interpretation, and those interpretations vary depending on the region and to whom you are talking to at the time.

There's no magic formula. It starts with your relationship with your local AP Boutique, from there you can explore what avenues there are available to you for the specific piece you are interested in. Maybe you can go to the top of your local list by dumping several zeros in a single or other purchases to show you are serious, or maybe you can be recommended by an already serious AP client, and so on...

Pick your poison, but there's no correct and perfect methodology else we'd all know about it and all the brands would be doing it.

Yes, i fully understand from their perspective. It makes perfect sense. From an average joe perspective or someone who just want a watch, it makes perfect sense to go to grey market as well.

[maruchan22]

Like i dun mind buying non hot model to get a hot model, it makes sense. Just tell me what I need to buy to get that jumbo or whatever.

[GS93108]

Originally Posted by maruchan22

Yes, i fully understand from their perspective. It makes perfect sense. From an average joe perspective or someone who just want a watch, it makes perfect sense to go to grey market as well.

I totally agree.

I was literally just talking to AP about an item that is long gone from being available directly from AP and thus the only route is via grey.

[HKBC]

Originally Posted by GS93108

I'm pretty sure the allocation model isn't based on any sort of formula in the way you describe.

I'd go and visit your local AP Boutique and be honest and genuine with them as to your aspirations and in return they'll hopefully be equally as candid with you.

I am pretty sure you will not get a hot model e.g. 15202 unless you have enough purchased record.

[Vivalas]

Originally Posted by GS93108

There are two type of 'hot' model, those that are limited edition of x units and then there are those that are limited production where the number of units to be produced is unknown.

If you want a limited edition piece then why would AP allocated one to an unknown entity, when they have more than enough known clients to satisfy the supply?

If you want a limited production piece, an example being the ceramic open worked perpetual calendar or the 15407 open worked, where there are just a few trickled into the market each year, then again AP have more than enough known clients to satisfy the projected production for several years.

For AP to allocate either of such pieces to 'new' walk in clients wouldn't be too endearing to their existing client base.

Thus, if you want something 'hot' then you have to earn that status. How you do that is open to interpretation, and those interpretations vary depending on the region and to whom you are talking to at the time.

There's no magic formula. It starts with your relationship with your local AP Boutique, from there you can explore what avenues there are available to you for the specific piece you are interested in. Maybe you can go to the top of your local list by dumping several zeros in a single or other purchases to show you are serious, or maybe you can be recommended by an already serious AP client, and so on...

Pick your poison, but there's no correct and perfect methodology else we'd all know about it and all the brands would be doing it.

This makes complete sense.

[Collector2019]

Limited production & edition pieces normally has to go through dual approval process (boutique to approve then raise request to HQ)


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[GS93108]

Originally Posted by Collector2019

Limited production & edition pieces normally has to go through dual approval process (boutique to approve then raise request to HQ)


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In the UK that doesn't happen, or at least it hasn't happened to me or the UK AP owners that I know. Perhaps it is a regional issue, or perhaps just an AD and not an AP Boutique issue. If it does actually happen then someone is AP Switzerland wields a lot of power and is worth getting to know :)

[maruchan22]

Thanks for all the replies. I guess that's why so many grey dealers exist in HK.

[john_peter33]

Does anyone know how new unworn pieces make it to the grey market?

[AshAP]

Originally Posted by john_peter33

Does anyone know how new unworn pieces make it to the grey market?

It’s not rocket science.


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[john_peter33]

I know there are flippers but do ADs, boutiques, Rolex, PP, AP directly supply the grey market?

[AshAP]

From memory there was a very controversial thread on the Patek forum 2-3 years ago that developed in a very entertaining way which alleged that at least 1 very well established US dealer did just that along with a few other questionable things.


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[macrowatch]

Originally Posted by AshAP

It’s not rocket science.


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But even non-rocket science science is hard!!!!

[chiscott_29]

Originally Posted by john_peter33

I know there are flippers but do ADs, boutiques, Rolex, PP, AP directly supply the grey market?

Some AD's...absolutely they do. Boutiques and the manufacturers, I'd say absolutely not. Then again, given the money some of these watches command on the secondary market, I wouldn't be surprised by anything.

[john_peter33]

In my humble opinion, there seems to be more inventory on the grey market of new, unworn pieces than there are flippers. Which begs the question how unless siphoned off by boutiques and ADs. I’m not talking about used pieces. Am I missing something?

[GS93108]

Originally Posted by john_peter33

In my humble opinion, there seems to be more inventory on the grey market of new, unworn pieces than there are flippers. Which begs the question how unless siphoned off by boutiques and ADs. I’m not talking about used pieces. Am I missing something?

My only litmus test of the grey market is chrono24, I don't look anywhere else. I'm highly doubtful that even half of those items exist and I'm even more doubtful that those 'unworn' items are all unworn.

As to AD's supplying the greys, then that's their prerogative, subject to the terms of their agency agreements, but that is also the reasoning behind manufacturers bringing control back in house.

I very much doubt that they'll be ANY back door, unauthorised grey market supply from AP AD's in the next few years as there are unlikely to be any independents left, AP will have a joint venture or wholly owned stake in them all, and with that comes transparency of stock allocation.

[AshAP]

Gary take your summer edition as an example, that was sold by the dealer on chrono 24 as unworn but you’d owned it for a year or more and worn it a handful of times. I think there’s a tendency to say something is unworn if it still looks new due to a careful owner.


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[chiscott_29]

Originally Posted by AshAP

I think there’s a tendency to say something is unworn if it still looks new due to a careful owner.

I am in agreement with this. I've also conversed with dealers on C24 that describe the watch as "Unworn" and when I ask has it been polished, I have received answers of "Yes" and "I don't know".

I would never take "Unworn" to be the same as "New". In my experience, I take it to mean excellent/pristine condition.

[john_peter33]

Ok, I’ll limit my question to AP boutique only watches. There seems to be a lot of these hot models new for sale in the grey market.

[GS93108]

Originally Posted by AshAP

Gary take your summer edition as an example, that was sold by the dealer on chrono 24 as unworn but you’d owned it for a year or more and worn it a handful of times. I think there’s a tendency to say something is unworn if it still looks new due to a careful owner.


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Exactly. The dealers even have the same blue plastic wraps to apply to the bracelets and buckles. It's all very disconcerting.

I don't have a problem with anything other than the description of 'new/unworn', often the condition is just as good as 'new'.

[GS93108]

Originally Posted by john_peter33

Ok, I’ll limit my question to AP boutique only watches. There seems to be a lot of these hot models new for sale in the grey market.

I bet there aren't. I bet that for every one real watch there are several ghosts of the same watch all being touted by the different traders who are all hoping to catch the customer and then source the watch.

Here's an example.

There are 11 Ceramic Openworked PC's on chrono24 right now. AP only launched that model a year ago and they had plans to supply maybe 50 worldwide in the last 12 months, so that didn't happen.

Of those 11 that are listed I'd be shocked if there are 2 real ones, more likely just 1 and I bet that it/they aren't 'new/unworn' either. This model is the absolute hot model and ONLY AP super vips have them, and those guys are KNOWN to AP right down to their first born's blood type. These guys haven't moved them on yet, maybe next year, but not yet.

So, I call BS on chrono24 listings, not the site's fault at all, but BS nevertheless.

p.s.

I bought a ROO Summer Edition from grey because AP had sold out, I used chrono24 and call after call resulted in 'sorry, sold it, but I can get you one'.

[7sins]

Originally Posted by GS93108

I used chrono24 and call after call resulted in 'sorry, sold it, but I can get you one'.

Everytime I see a watch on C24 and the dealer is in NYC, I almost always get this exact response. So many of these dealers list watches they don't have but will go and find the watch for you, then "magically" the one they find is at a higher price. Very frustrating.

[dauster]

Originally Posted by john_peter33

Does anyone know how new unworn pieces make it to the grey market?

the illuminati - final allocation are done either at the bohemian grove or the bilderberg group:)