PAM 111 COSC paper certificate. How important ?

[nice2cu2]

Guys,

I have been chasing this model for a bit and now finally found a descent offer.

It came to my attention that COSC certificate is missing however everything else is in order.

I will definitely sell this watch somewhere down the line to "upgrade" as or to buy a new "favourite".

How important is this piece of paper ?

Looking forward to your replies.

Thank you.

[Kevin of Larchmont]

Not important to me at all. I bought a 111 without box or papers and it wears just the same. Should I sell it, and I won’t, I can get what I paid for it. And if I’m wrong and I take a few hundred dollar hit on the sale price who cares, that’s cheap “rent” to have paid to own a nice watch for a period of time. It’s a watch not a retirement account, enjoy it for what it is and don’t stress about what it isn’t.

[nice2cu2]

Originally Posted by Kevin of Larchmont

Not important to me at all. I bought a 111 without box or papers and it wears just the same. Should I sell it, and I won’t, I can get what I paid for it. And if I’m wrong and I take a few hundred dollar hit on the sale price who cares, that’s cheap “rent” to have paid to own a nice watch for a period of time. It’s a watch not a retirement account, enjoy it for what it is and don’t stress about what it isn’t.

Thank you for your opinion. Appreciated.

[nice2cu2]

Anyone else would like to share their opinion on this ?

[rootbeer7]

If it is because my sold by a trusted source then it wouldn’t bother me at all.

[nice2cu2]

I have been offered PAM510 by the same dealer for 200 EUR more with full box and papers. What do you think about 510 in comparison to 111 ?

[Kevin of Larchmont]

I own both and enjoy them equally. Some people dislike the 8 Days additional line of text on the dial, I think it balances the dial. I’ve read here that the case of the 510 is a little thicker than the 111 because of the in-house movement but I can’t tell the difference on the wrist. I do particularly like the eight day movement and while no less accurate over the course of a full wind it does run fast in the first 24 hours and then settles down. Is the 510 a sandwich dial? They made both I believe. Many people prefer sandwich but the visibility is vastly better with the painted dial. My 111 with the ETA movement I had serviced locally after I bought it and wore it on my honeymoon as my water watch, my 510 (sandwich dial) I haven’t had serviced yet because it runs very well and I don’t need to take it in the water. Given your two options and since provenance seems critical to you I’d get the 510.

[rootbeer7]

Originally Posted by rootbeer7

If it is because my sold by a trusted source then it wouldn’t bother me at all.

apologies, autocorrect seems to be misbehaving! I tried to say if it is being sold by a trusted source then it wouldn't bother me at all.
As to your next post, 111 every time

[TunaTuna]

Just use this missing paper as a reason to get a couple hundred bucks off. They are happy to sell to you

[Onequik135i]

Originally Posted by rootbeer7

apologies, autocorrect seems to be misbehaving! I tried to say if it is being sold by a trusted source then it wouldn't bother me at all.
As to your next post, 111 every time

This.

[Kevin of Larchmont]

In a vacuum, absolutely the 111 every time however in a particular scenario with a particular guy to whom documentation is important I vote that for this enthusiast the documentation of the 510 offsets the subtle differences between the two watches and the lack of documentation of the 111. I bought a 111 without documentation so it doesn’t matter to me but the OP seems to seek the crepuscular reassurance that documentation can bring.

Respectfully submitted.

[Joearch]

111 over the 510 since the 111 is more olde school. One thing about the COSC paper is it has the movement number on it and ties the movement to the watch. Maybe another level of authentication.

[nice2cu2]

Guys, thank you for all of your comments.

I thought about it and came to a conclusion that I am not really willing to buy PAM111 without COSC at a price offered ( they are not willing to go down in price at all ). I watched some review of 510 and had a thought that I don't really like the "8 days" on a dial. Just feels out of place, well, at least for me.

I have been offered a very pristine condition 112 from 2014 full box and papers. Never polished and looks great.

I kind of like the clean look of it however need to decide if I will get bored not having the seconds hand to actually see that the watch is alive so to speak.

First world problems

[mg18]

Originally Posted by nice2cu2

Guys, thank you for all of your comments.

I thought about it and came to a conclusion that I am not really willing to buy PAM111 without COSC at a price offered ( they are not willing to go down in price at all ). I watched some review of 510 and had a thought that I don't really like the "8 days" on a dial. Just feels out of place, well, at least for me.

I have been offered a very pristine condition 112 from 2014 full box and papers. Never polished and looks great.

I kind of like the clean look of it however need to decide if I will get bored not having the seconds hand to actually see that the watch is alive so to speak.

First world problems

I would personally hold out for a nice example of a 111. They aren't very difficult to come by, and it builds anticipation. The 112 is also very nice, but I was partial to the seconds hand for my first pam.

Goodluck!

[rootbeer7]

I have an early decorated movement 112 and truly love the base dial. It feels like a proper tool watch. I chose 112 over 111, but make sure you buy what you really like.

[Kevin of Larchmont]

I need a seconds hand. Also I would prioritize the watch I truly wanted over my second choice with box and papers. Box and papers are preferred but not required in my collection. But it sounds like you are weighing these characteristics against price which is prudent. Still, don’t let logic run amok prevent you from buying the watch you really want. I mean after all, fundamentally box and papers are an exit strategy. If you buy the watch you love you don’t need an exit strategy.

[nice2cu2]

Originally Posted by Kevin of Larchmont

I need a seconds hand. Also I would prioritize the watch I truly wanted over my second choice with box and papers. Box and papers are preferred but not required in my collection. But it sounds like you are weighing these characteristics against price which is prudent. Still, don’t let logic run amok prevent you from buying the watch you really want. I mean after all, fundamentally box and papers are an exit strategy. If you buy the watch you love you don’t need an exit strategy.

Well, my problem here will be when I decide to sell it. I wear watches 2 years on average and then sell it and buy some other watches. I sold so many watches and I know that it is much much easier to sell full box and papers + if something is missing I would like a discount. They are not willing to compromise.

[nice2cu2]

I never thought it will be so hard to get a descent PAM111 in Europe.

[Kevin of Larchmont]

Originally Posted by nice2cu2

Well, my problem here will be when I decide to sell it. I wear watches 2 years on average and then sell it and buy some other watches. I sold so many watches and I know that it is much much easier to sell full box and papers + if something is missing I would like a discount. They are not willing to compromise.

Then you have answered your own question.

[rootbeer7]

Originally Posted by nice2cu2

I never thought it will be so hard to get a descent PAM111 in Europe.

The classic models have a strong following

[stockae92]

Its only important in the sense of complete package. Otherwise, the COSC cert doesn't serve much purpose.

[Jim P]

Love my 111

[dieselophile]

I seem to have all the bits including the COSC except for the warranty card......that would have expired by now anyway...on my J series 111...

[TLeung1]

You can get a replacement COSC paper from Panerai but it involves sending the watch in for service and waiting several months for them to inspect and reissue the certificate.

[dieselophile]

What is perceived to be of greater value or importance, the COSC paper or the warranty card?
Ive always thought the COSC, as the warranty expires for an older watch and then what would be the value of having such a card.

[Aventura]

Originally Posted by nice2cu2

Guys,

I have been chasing this model for a bit and now finally found a descent offer.

It came to my attention that COSC certificate is missing however everything else is in order.

I will definitely sell this watch somewhere down the line to "upgrade" as or to buy a new "favourite".

How important is this piece of paper ?

Looking forward to your replies.

Thank you.

COSC is a neutral and impartial Swiss non-profit organization of which a large number of manufacturers send their watches in order to have them certified.

If a watch passes the tests of COSC, it will receive an official certificate. Many watch brands include the chronometer certificate in the set when you buy a watch, , but the certificate has of course been designed by the brand themselves to follow the design of the brand, but it will still include all the COSC certification numbers and details.

You ask for an opinion and I will give you mine. It is almost or perhaps impossible to detect whether a Panerai watch is a fake or not. The only way I would buy a watch of this brand or any other used is if the owner has the ticket of the dealer official who bought it. Everything else can be faked. Also I do not understand why someone who buys a watch did not keep the papers. And there are a lot of watches without papers. It's strange. There will be many opinions so I guess I have the right to express my own.
Good luck.

[Kevin of Larchmont]

My 111 runs just as well without the COSC certificate as it would if I had it.

[TswaneNguni]

111 complete set ,not difficult to find

[htc8p]

i found it hard to find the OG base models.

I had to settle for the 510. got it for a good price no box and papers but authentic and good condition.

you can find the base models with the plain caseback and sandwich dial if you widen you search base