Diamond Advice Please

[Fredd]

Hi,

I could do with a bit of advice in regards to buying a diamond ring.

The cut, clarity, colour and carat aspect of it I understand.

In terms of cut I've decided that has to be the top rating no matter what, so 0 or excellent depending on who's scale it is.

The question is though, am I best buying a larger very good diamond, or smaller amazing one?

For example these two are pretty much the same price:

Carat 0.46
Cut Excellent
Colour D
Clarity Flawless

Carat 0.57
Cut Excellent
Colour F
Clarity VS1

Which would you get?

To 99.9% of people in the street would the bigger, lesser quality diamond be the better looking?

Which would hold its value better in future?


Many thanks for any tips and help on this in advance.

[JasoninDenver]

VS1 to VVS1-2 is just fine for most jewelery.

Women want a good (not flawless) BIG diamond. As long as there are no visible flaws or color issues - go bigger.

[jjnd08]

The C's are obviously important, but whatever you do, ALWAYS buy GIA certified. If you get into a situation you need to resell without the cert, you may end up taking a bath due to not buying what you thought you were.

[Fredd]

Thanks for the replies.

The certified part is good to know about.

One website (Vashi) it turns out grade their own!! What use is that!?!?!

I'm now looking at one that gives the full GIA report, so will stick to them for whatever I go for.

[Swearengen]

I am no expert, however I would expect D flawless stones to be more scarce and possibly do better on the used market. Shape also comes into it, round cut and princess cut will probably do better than other shapes. Just IMHO.

[69mach351]

Personally, unless there is truly no noticeable difference (you have to be honest with yourself) then I will go with quality over quantity all day long. The same goes for nearly all aspects of life.

[Buttercup]

IMHO, I see no benefit in buying a D, E, or F color; the difference in how those look vs a G is so so minimal, yet the price difference is quite large. A jeweler friend told me that - in his opinion - a G or H, and VS1 or 2 is the best bang for the buck. Always make sure it's an excellent or very good symmetry cut to ensure the most sparkle!

[Bisquitlips]

IMO. And I have never been sorry.

Target an EFG in color. D is a misnomer at the purchasing stage.

A VVS1 is the least I would consider.

And try to attain 1.45 carats and above in the above mentioned specs.

I wish I had all the $$$ back that I have spent on inferior diamonds over the last 38 years. Do it right and you will be very thankful.

[Tools]

It makes no sense to buy investment grade diamonds if you intend to wear it as jewelry..

Jewelry diamonds get banged around, chipped, and scratched.. Get what you can afford within reason for that..

Go for the larger, very good, diamond for your jewelry and save the "amazing" stuff for your portfolio..

[dlee3679]

I would purchase the VS1 Diamond. I've yet to see anyone carry around a loop to check and see the clarity of people's diamonds. With the naked eye, VS1 and FL will look almost identical if color are the same.

[lavaman]

As someone who was dating / living with with a diamond importer for several years (they handled several celebrity weddings), I learned a few things about diamonds

Two words:

Blue Nile


Otherwise, whatever fits your budget. I personally would never buy anything less than D and VVS1. But then, I only plan to buy one diamond in my life :-)

Buy the best you can afford, and add 20%. Go for quality, NOT SIZE.

And in my experience, about 99% of what they sell at the brick and mortar stores in USA is CRAP. Overpriced, marked up (yes it's a HIGHLY inflated and artificial market enough as is) crap. Especially the stores that claim to have their own "rating system" that exceeds GIA (or the Euro equivalent) rating system.

Rubbish.

I really like blue nile because of their very easy to use website. The people I knew in the jewelry busn used their site a lot for their own purchases.

I also love Cartier, but that's about it. You are paying obscene amounts for the red (or the blue) box. And I do agree with the prior remarks from Tools and others that if you are just buying something that looks pretty and you are not concerned about quality of the grade, then buy whatever flips your skirt. But I don't think that is what you are going for....?

And someone made a VERY important point: cut is very often overlooked. I can take a gorgeous stone, and if I don't make the facets and so forth catch that light, it's going to be garbage. I have seen some beautiful stones ruined by inferior work.

[s14roller]

My take given your size criteria:

Bump it to 1ct, use halo setting, G/H color, GIA/AGS very good cut, SI1 eye clean...

There is no reason to go above VS2...I have seen eye clean SI1s, and very clean (even under loupe) VS2s. VVS grade stones you are paying for rareness/bragging rights bc you will never know the diff.

OP, focus your money on things the eye can see, size and sparkle. Color, H+ you'll be fine...the eye cant see a color difference until around 3 grades apart...clarity, best bang for your buck would be to find some eye clean SI1s...otherwise, VS2 you will have no worries, but there will be a bump in price.

If you can, go cut first, and go GIA triple Excellent...it'll be worth it...My wife's ring is Triple ex to start, and then i honed in on the correct crown/pavilion angles, table/depth, etc...afterall, light return is just math...

It's worth it to do it right the first time. GL.

[s14roller]

Oh yeah, value, don't bother putting that in your decision, bc financially, this is a horrible purchase...it's an emotional purchase.

[vitalsignsrn]

Both GIA and AGS are highly reputable grading labs. G is certainly very white and is great value for the money. I would buy the best cut I can, most of my stones I have are ideal or excellent cut…I have an Si-1 that is absolutely eye clean and no risk what so ever to the integrity of the diamond…next..colour.as I said..I have a G..I also have lower colour stones that look still pretty white in white metals. ;-) Higher colour for a ring, lower colour for earing and pendants. ;-) If you want to save some money. My 2.5ct makes me smile. :-) You don't have to have a D, VVS-1 unless you have it in your mind or have been convinced you need it, you can look for a bigger stone. Unless of course a smaller one is one you prefer. ;-) I would look further than Blue Nile..there are better places to buy. However they do have their stones in stock and they do ship quickly…I have bought several stones from them. But then, I know what Im looking for or rather what Im not. LOL I have sent you a PM…knowledge is what you need. Happy Shopping..:-)

[Reu]

Hi mate,

The advice you've been given here is not right. My opinion obviously, and whether that causes offence/upset I say it how I see it.

The four C's and the grading i.e. GIA etc are the obvious and easy part of picking a diamond. There are other factors which will make a huge difference to the appearance of the gem.

The fact that people here have been able to comment without knowing or asking immediately what SHAPE of diamond you're going for demonstrates the lack of knowledge. Also it seems that everyone seems to be pointing out the SIZE of the diamond. You won't ever negotiate on a diamond by it's size. Carat actually refers to WEIGHT, which in part obviously affects size.

Depending on what shape the gem is and how it's cut you can find a .40 carat which will look bigger than half a carat.

The point in having a real understanding of the characteristic of a diamond means being able to select a gem that sparkles and/or omits amazing colours. That's what you are looking for - that's what diamonds are all about.

You need to know about the dimensions, the depth, the table of the diamond, the girdle. These are important as they determine how light will transmit through the stone itself.

You can have a diamond that has a high rating on all C's and has been certified, yet it will remain flat and lack sparkle when looking at it because you've not identified the other important factors.

Leave this forum to people who know more about watches. You can't come on here and ask the odd question about how to pick a diamond and expect anyone here to advise you in any proper depth. Everyone is an expert on diamonds suddenly too... !!!

You need to go to a reputable diamond broker who will sit you down and educate you. You can then make a more informed decision.

Work out a budget you want to spend and then with the education you've been given you can work out what elements are worth reducing in the diamond i.e. colour/clarity and what's worth increasing, weight etc.

I can see you are in the UK and I can recommend someone who will look after you if you want the right knowledge.

[s14roller]

Reu - I agree, with most of your comments, but take another look at the suggestions I gave

Although I agree - there is way too much more into it than what's explained on a few sentences on a forum. I spent close to 4 months researching the ins and outs and taking notes.

As for shape, I think it was assumed he was going with a round brilliant, which we all know generate the most light return.

You would never want a .40ct to look larger than a .50ct stone all else equal...this tells me it's top heavy and too shallow...

The diamond I ended up with shows massive light return as all the CA/PA/Table/Depth and so on so forth were all honed in correctly...under any of the scopes, it would show mostly red across the entire stone (I know this because I also have one at home )

[lavaman]

He asked for comments, we have our qualified opinions. Stop being a sacrasm troll, esp if it appears you want to advance your friends businesses. I don't think most of us have a financial interest.....

[Reu]

Originally Posted by s14roller

Reu - I agree, with most of your comments, but take another look at the suggestions I gave

Although I agree - there is way too much more into it than what's explained on a few sentences on a forum. I spent close to 4 months researching the ins and outs and taking notes.

As for shape, I think it was assumed he was going with a round brilliant, which we all know generate the most light return.

You would never want a .40ct to look larger than a .50ct stone all else equal...this tells me it's top heavy and too shallow...

The diamond I ended up with shows massive light return as all the CA/PA/Table/Depth and so on so forth were all honed in correctly...under any of the scopes, it would show mostly red across the entire stone (I know this because I also have one at home )

No, fair point in regards to .40 looking bigger than a .50 but my point was purely to express there is such a large amount of variants.

Originally Posted by lavaman

He asked for comments, we have our qualified opinions. Stop being a sacrasm troll, esp if it appears you want to advance your friends businesses. I don't think most of us have a financial interest.....

ha ha I could think of two words for you and it isn't Blue Nile. Speaking of which I do believe that's an endorsement right there!! (hypocrite) That's merely all I was doing - endorsing a broker I have dealt with who can give him free advice, although for clarity, it's not a 'friend' whatsoever.

He'll be able to get that advice anywhere using any broker. Whether he buys or not is up to the OP so nothing to do with me.

I do also believe that I suggested not asking for advice on watch forums as realistically it's a bigger exercise than that.

[Starbuck_413]

Blue Nile is actually a good resource just to get a feeling for the pricing of diamonds. They work relatively close on their stones......and then make a killing on their settings haha.

My best advice would be to shop around, educate yourself on rapaport pricing if possible. Know, if possible, when you go to buy a diamond what percentage they're selling over rap. The lab created diamonds have absolutely killed the market prices on diamonds under 1.50CT, so you're in luck!

Those who have said so are absolutely correct that the difference between a (GIA) D-G isn't discernible to the public eye. I would actually recommend going with a stone that's like .98CT You get close to a carat without paying for it

[Reu]

Originally Posted by Starbuck_413

Those who have said so are absolutely correct that the difference between a (GIA) D-G isn't discernible to the public eye. I would actually recommend going with a stone that's like .98CT You get close to a carat without paying for it

Spot on.

[lavaman]

I have zero stake in Blue Nile. Wow. Good thing we aren't talking about hats....

10-8-1.

[69mach351]

Those of you that invest in diamonds, how do you liquidate them if the need arises?

Edit - I have not invested in them, but am curious. I like to have a few physical investments but liquidation is always a concern.

[Starbuck_413]

Originally Posted by Fredd

Carat 0.46
Cut Excellent
Colour D
Clarity Flawless

Carat 0.57
Cut Excellent
Colour F
Clarity VS1

Which would you get?

With regard to these two stones, I would go with the one that's over .50. There's a big price difference/demand once you go over a threshold like .50, 1.0, 1.25, 1.5 etc.

People are snobby, they like to say that their stone is "over a carat" or whatever which is why you see dramatic difference in price between .98 to like 1.0.

I would never suggest getting a stone that's right on the dot (.50, 1.0, etc.) because like others have said, it is possible to chip a stone. When that happens and it needs to be recut (talking about "resale" here), then it's good to have some wiggle room. If a 1.03CT stone needs to be recut, it's still possible to retain a 1.0CT stone, but if it's right on the nose at 1.0, it's going to go under once it's recut.

As far as liquidating diamonds...This industry (same with watches) is very middle-man driven, so it's always best to get as close to the "end" sale back to a retail type of transaction as possible. Probably best to try and market it to sell to an individual in my opinion.

Just my "2 cents"

[TswaneNguni]

My wife's ..that tennis bracelet is a thing of beauty

[vitalsignsrn]

Chris..that tennis bracelet is absolutely stunning. :-) Heck..so is the watch. ;-)

S14Roller…you have the info right. Good to see you did your homework. Although Idealscopes, BrilliantScopes, H&A viewer, Sarin results etc is part of the equation. ;-) You not only want to look at the numbers to evaluate what could POTENTIALLY be a gorgeous stone, you have to see it with your eyes. ;-) Seems like you have found PS.

[vitalsignsrn]

Sweet..


This is my stone. :-D Told you it made me smile. ;-)

[Andad]

Have you been down the mine again Neef?

[Andad]

Very very nice.

[vitalsignsrn]

My set..is a 2.5ct stone on a size 5 3/4 finger. Each stone is 5 pt.s in both e-ring and wedding band. Setting was made by Topper Jewelers (Custom) and was based off their "Sammy" custom made setting. I worked very closely with Bill. :-) Not a gratuitous plug for Topper. They were the ones who made the setting. I, however belong to a diamond forum and have utilized many of the sponsors there. ;-)

Sorry..I don't have better pics. The stone is NOT a D..or an E or an F or a G or an H… ;-) Shop smart and wisely. NO diamond has a glaring label on it like a watch does to identify it being 1000 feet or a Rolex…there is no name on it. If its inscribed on the girdle with a certificate #, it is only visible with a loupe and you really need to have that loupe in the right angle to find the inscription. So..realistically, you don't have to say its an I if you want to say its an E…who will stop you? No one… ;-)

If anyone wants a helping hand in the right direction, PM me.. I don't sell. I will only point you to an educational sight. :-) I helped another member here in NY get a great price for a great quality tennis bracelet. :-) I love this stuff. If I could do something productive with my love of diamonds I would. LOL I truly would leave the illustrious world of nursing behind. LOL

Judy

[vitalsignsrn]

Stone has low colour and high clarity. Only 2.5 ct available at the time. What I wanted was a 2.5, SI-1…none around…people are getting smart about value. So here is the clarity grading on my stone. Which if that little tiny speck wasn't there…would have been flawless…at a lower colour. My Stone is WHITE… :-) Sidestones are G colour and all looks seamless. Ok..I'll shut up now. LOL I can go on and on about this. Diamonds are my passion.. :-D