Purchasing a Black Bay, is the ETA version a long term risk?

[joshuagull]

With Swatch Group cracking down on ETA parts and support for non-Swatch brands, is the in-house Black Bay a safer long term bet in regards to parts and servicing than the prior ETA-based versions? Will we run into a time 15-20 years from now when an ETA-based Black Bay won't be able to be easily serviced because of the Swatch crackdown?

I'm asking because I'm purchasing a Black Bay Red soon and my reasons for the purchase are sentimental in nature, so this is going to be a watch I'll be keeping for a lifetime. As such, I'm putting a lot of thought into the future serviceability of the timepiece.

Movement aside, there are things I like about the ETA version and things I like about the new in-house version.

Aesthetically they're a flip of the coin to me. Shield vs rose and straight text vs curved text are so close in my eyes with a *slight* preference toward the ETA version. I do prefer the longer power reserve of the new movement but otherwise in-house vs ETA doesn't matter much to me, and I MUCH prefer the black NATO included with the red ETA compared to the red NATO included with the in-house. I also prefer the non-riveted bracelet.

So ultimately the slight edge for me is to the ETA Black Bay. But as I initially mentioned, I do have concerns about future serviceability and if that is a real concern (and not just in my head) then I'd gladly go with the in-house version and perhaps work on acquiring a black Tudor NATO and first gen bracelet instead.

What do you guys think?

[japenney]

I dont think you will ever have trouble servicing an ETA Tudor. Big brother Rolex will make sure of that. One way or another .

[Dan Pierce]

Non issue, no worries.
dP

[~JJ]

I wouldn't worry about having an ETA serviced down the road... In fact you would have more options than with Tudor's in house, since you would most likely only be able to have the in house serviced by TSC.

[WS9D]

Originally Posted by japenney

I dont think you will ever have trouble servicing an ETA Tudor. Big brother Rolex will make sure of that. One way or another .

I agree with this.

[J!m]

Don't worry.

If it concerns you, buy a complete spare movement and lock it in the safe. Max $250 additional and you have every spare part.

[GradyPhilpott]

Swatch is not cutting off Rolex/Tudor. First, Tudor and ETA have a very long-term relationship, second, Tudor is not the kind of company that Swatch is targeting and third, Swatch publicly stated that they planned to keep supplying Tudor with movements.

It would seem that Tudor is setting their own course with in-house movements, but it's not because of pressure from Swatch.

It's just the way of the industry, since Swatch made their announcement.

[Etschell]

No risk at all. That said I prefer the in house for just a few hundred more.

[joshuagull]

Originally Posted by GradyPhilpott

Swatch is not cutting off Rolex/Tudor. First, Tudor and ETA have a very long-term relationship, second, Tudor is not the kind of company that Swatch targeting and third, Swatch publicly stated that they planned to keep supplying Tudor with movements.

It would seem that Tudor is setting their own course with in-house movements, but it's not because of pressure from Swatch.

It's just the way of the industry, since Swatch made their announcement.

This is a strong point. Thanks Grady.

[joshuagull]

Has anyone seen published stats on the added thickness of the watch from crystal to caseback?

I know the movement is almost 2mm thicker but does that whole 2mm translate to the overall thickness or only a portion of it?

[J!m]

If you care about the history, in my opinion the ETA option is the only option.

For me at least. My 9411's are both ETA and running fine some 40-odd years later. I doubt any parts have been replaced.

I get the "allure" of in-house movements, but remember that ETA has been making movements a L O N G time and they are getting pretty good at it by now.

Just my opinion...

[Etschell]

Originally Posted by joshuagull

Has anyone seen published stats on the added thickness of the watch from crystal to caseback?

I know the movement is almost 2mm thicker but does that whole 2mm translate to the overall thickness or only a portion of it?

My understanding is the caseback is now bubble a bit instead of flat.

[capote]

Originally Posted by J!m

If you care about the history, in my opinion the ETA option is the only option.

For me at least. My 9411's are both ETA and running fine some 40-odd years later. I doubt any parts have been replaced.

I get the "allure" of in-house movements, but remember that ETA has been making movements a L O N G time and they are getting pretty good at it by now.

Just my opinion...

I agree. The inhouse selling point is new and often it lacks merit. From an historical point of view the watch houses has not made everything inhouse, for example the Stern company made Comex Seadweller raildials, the horror, the horror! I found a quote by Karl Marx (!) quoted by tick-talk over at The Hour Lounge:

"Formerly the individual work of a Nuremberg artificer, the watch has been transformed into the social product of an immense number of detail laborers, such as mainspring makers, dial makers, spiral spring makers, jewelled hole makers, ruby lever makers, hand makers, case makers, screw makers, gilders, with numerous sub-division, such as wheel makers (brass and steel separate), pin makers, movement makers, acheveur de pignon (fixes the wheels on the axles, polishes the facets, etc.), pivot makers, planteur de finissage (puts the wheels and springs in the works), finisseur de barillets (cuts teeth in the wheels, makes the holes of the right size, etc.), escapement makers, cylinder makers for cylinder escapements, escapement wheel makers, balance wheel makers, raquette makers (apparatus for regulating the watch), the planteur d’échappement (escapement maker proper); then the repasseur de barillet (finishes the box for the spring, etc.), steel polishers, wheel polishers, screw polishers, figure painters, dial enamellers (melt the enamel on the copper), fabricant de pendants (makes the ring by which the case is hung), finisseur de charnière (puts the brass hing in the cover, etc.), faiseur de secret (puts in the springs that open the case), graveur, ciseleur, polisseur de boite, etc., etc., and last of all the repasseur, who fits together the whole watch and hands it over in a going state."

[J!m]

Maybe an extreme example (the Marx quote) but it is no secret that the Swiss watch industry became so "good" because they embraced specialization long before it was a cool buzz word.

If you specialize in making movements, you tend to be pretty good at making movements.

[bdex75]

If nothing else there is such a huge supply of ETA parts in the market that it would be years before any issues would arise, if ever.


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[jolimont]

i prefer the aesthetics of the ETA versions better than in house



will be hard to service in house Tudors at your local watchmaker in the future due to parts supply?

[T. Ferguson]

Whether Tudor stops using ETA and goes completely in-house or not I doubt there will be a long term problem servicing the movement unless ETA goes out of business. And I doubt that too.