The Official Formula One Thread!

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by SDGT3

I don't know.... I still think Alonso, with his attitude, killer mentality, intelligence and skill could still win the WDC if in the Mercedes or Red Bull. Even at 40 yo, he's more fit and hungry than he's ever been and if anything, he's a better overall driver now.

100% agree :thumbs-up:

Alonso may not be young, yet the boys got great skills and talent as a development driver. I'm kinda surprised he's not doing Le Mans and NASCAR for the triple.

[texasmade]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

100% agree :thumbs-up:

Alonso may not be young, yet the boys got great skills and talent as a development driver. I'm kinda surprised he's not doing Le Mans and NASCAR for the triple.

He's already did the Le Mans and I'm pretty sure he doesn't want to do Nascar or a full season of Indy when he can still drive around in F1. Given the choice I know what I wouldn't choose those other series over F1.

[SDGT3]

22 or 23 races on the F1 schedule is pretty taxing. He's won overall LeMans and only needs the Indy 500 win for the triple crown. After F1 is done, perhaps he gives that another go if given a competitive car/team.

I admire the fact he tried different series during his hiatus (Indy, LeMans, Dakar etc) and was extremely competitive in each... a pure racer that will get in anything and go fast, but appreciates he is able to be back in F1.

[Speedbird-1]

F1, bans 'airshows' at races, to uphold it's sustainability and environmental ideals.

[enjoythemusic]

Can we bring back flag girls?

Can my outwardly flamboyant LBGTQ+ friends attend ALL races?

[SDGT3]

Originally Posted by Speedbird-1

F1, bans 'airshows' at races, to uphold it's sustainability and environmental ideals.

Farcical virtue signaling with no significant impact on either sustainability or environment compared to their circus. F1 thinks we're all dumb.

[SDGT3]

In 2 pieces of news coming out of F1 and the FIA today, Honda has changed their minds and will supply engines to RBR and sister team until at lease 2025. Smart move being so close to the constructor's title and given how far they came from a "GP2 engine".

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/h...7FNhGyrUNake2Q

Also, Mercedes doing what they do best and that's to lobby politically behind the scenes for advantages or a pound of flesh in this instance, even if it's after the fact and highly improbable of happening again. For the first time, the FIA says that Michael Masi could be replaced:

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f...DMZ-MoDGDEes7E

[77T]

Originally Posted by SDGT3

Also, Mercedes doing what they do best and that's to lobby politically behind the scenes for advantages or a pound of flesh in this instance, even if it's after the fact and highly improbable of happening again. For the first time, the FIA says that Michael Masi could be replaced:

The link gave me a 404…so sharing a link to the story again in hops it works better.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f...hreat/7682019/

BTW, it is not unusual for review of assignment each year. We go into training mode in Jan-Feb and people express their interest - Moving up. (Or out) so this is sort of Offical’s silly season.

Of course the contro continues…

My take? Masi asks for a private 1on1 with HAM to make amends. I’d skip the political layer and the business layer at FIA/MB. I expect HAM would want Masi back if HAM is going to race this year.


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[snowgoat]

Masi has lost credibility, and consensus support. One more mistake and the pressure would be intolerable and the sport would suffer. I doubt he will survive in that role though he might by the skin of the teeth if the structure for decision making on the fly is changed with people between him and the team principles and/or team principles gagged.

Verstappen was a worthy champion - flawed but aren’t they all. But he was also gifted that win and there is no way you could love the sport and not feel Hamilton was robbed.

[OmegaJJH]

Originally Posted by snowgoat

Masi has lost credibility, and consensus support. One more mistake and the pressure would be intolerable and the sport would suffer. I doubt he will survive in that role though he might by the skin of the teeth if the structure for decision making on the fly is changed with people between him and the team principles and/or team principles gagged.

Verstappen was a worthy champion - flawed but aren’t they all. But he was also gifted that win and there is no way you could love the sport and not feel Hamilton was robbed.

Great post !


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[Speedbird-1]

[QUOTE I expect HAM would want Masi back if HAM is going to race this year.


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Yes, he owes him one!

[Rashid.bk]

Originally Posted by snowgoat

Masi has lost credibility, and consensus support. One more mistake and the pressure would be intolerable and the sport would suffer. I doubt he will survive in that role though he might by the skin of the teeth if the structure for decision making on the fly is changed with people between him and the team principles and/or team principles gagged.

Verstappen was a worthy champion - flawed but aren’t they all. But he was also gifted that win and there is no way you could love the sport and not feel Hamilton was robbed.

Excellent post!!!

[Speedbird-1]

Just watched a few laps of Formula E.

Not impressed. The cars look quite attractive, but the squealing and whining (of the cars and tyres), didn't appeal.

The irony of an 'E' car race, under lights.

[77T]

Yes Formula E is hard to watch. The sound like an appointment with the dentist.

The street circuits are uninspiring (except for Monaco).

You should see the requirements for power that the FIA demands when they come to Brooklyn’s circuit.


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[enjoythemusic]

FE sound is easy to fix. Adds major excitement too!

[Speedbird-1]

Originally Posted by 77T

Yes Formula E is hard to watch. The sound like an appointment with the dentist.

The street circuits are uninspiring (except for Monaco).

You should see the requirements for power that the FIA demands when they come to Brooklyn’s circuit.


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Electric 24hr Le Mans, should be interesting.

[SDGT3]

F1 just came out about having 11 different race winners in the turbo hybrid era......... it appeared they were celebrating it, but not sure why.

That's just 11 race winners in 8 years and 160 races.... that's it.

And if we remove the lone wins by Ocon and Gasley, under unusual circumstances and Checo (1 win under unusual circumstances in a Force India and 1 in a RB, again under unusual circumstances when Max had the blow out in Bacu and lewis pushed the magic button on the restart and went off himself), you have just 8 other drivers who have won in this entire era!!!

In this era, Mercedes has an 82% win percentage - the most dominant car in F1 history by a country mile.... (please don't tell me it's not the car).

Statistically the most boring F1 era ever saved by the 2021 thriller.

Many things can be debated, but these are the facts folks. The numbers don't lie.

[Goin2drt]

Originally Posted by SDGT3

F1 just came out about having 11 different race winners in the turbo hybrid era......... it appeared they were celebrating it, but not sure why.

That's just 11 race winners in 8 years and 160 races.... that's it.

And if we remove the lone wins by Ocon and Gasley, under unusual circumstances and Checo (1 win under unusual circumstances in a Force India and 1 in a RB, again under unusual circumstances when Max had the blow out in Bacu and lewis pushed the magic button on the restart and went off himself), you have just 8 other drivers who have won in this entire era!!!

In this era, Mercedes has an 82% win percentage - the most dominant car in F1 history by a country mile.... (please don't tell me it's not the car).

Statistically the most boring F1 era ever FIXED by the 2021 thriller.

Many things can be debated, but these are the facts folks. The numbers don't lie.

Edited it for you. Correct numbers don't lie.

[77T]

Lest we forget, the MB team has yet to achieve the same dominance as another team that I’d like to see rise again.

In 1988, McLaren (and Honda) won 15 of 16 races that season. Senna & Prost got a lot of cred - but was it the car?

Let’s face it, in F1 it IS the car my friends


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[SDGT3]

Originally Posted by Goin2drt

Edited it for you. Correct numbers don't lie.

the whole season was fixed? Okay...

BTW, for purposes of being more exact, the work "fixed" wouldn't be the word used to describe the actions of Masi.

Fixed: predetermined and not subject to or able to be changed.

Many here only have that last race in mind, but Masi screwed different people including Max as well as others throughout the 2021 season. One could argue inconsistent or consistently inconsistent, but to say the fix was in is just not true.

[1st amg]

Originally Posted by Goin2drt

Edited it for you. Correct numbers don't lie.

Yeah....right.......sheesh.

[77T]

Originally Posted by SDGT3

Many here only have that last race in mind, but Masi screwed different people including Max as well as others throughout the 2021 season. One could argue inconsistent or consistently inconsistent, but to say the fix was in is just not true.

I agree that the season has more than the last race to consider.

As for season-long consistency issues, we must separate the RD’s role from the SOM. Often an F1 decision comes from the Stewards of the Meet, not the race director.

If you look at all the 2021 decision documents (including many that commenters here decried), the vast majority were decided by the Stewards rather than Masi. At each race, a unique panel of Stewards make the decision you see on the TV screen. Very few fans even know their names. But the one name that most know is the RD…so Masi gets painted with a broad brush that isn’t all his doing.

IMHO, the current controversy would not have developed without the last few laps of the final race. So I respect the broad criticism (except for “fixed”) being levied. This sport lives and breathes due to global interest by fans and the fans were sorely disappointed.

It doesn’t help that the review of the Race Director role is still underway - we won’t see anything official until 14FEB.

That’s when the review team’s reco will be presented to the teams at a meeting of the F1 Commission. If they agree with it, then several changes will come to the decision making during a race.

As a “mind experiment” (and worth the effort for fans) What if?

In other words, even if MB had gone to the top step of FIA’s Court of Appeals, VER would have won. That’s because the Court (if it agreed with MB) could only vacate the final race as unjust. Ergo, VER still wins WDC due to tied points and tie-breaker is # of wins.


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[SDGT3]

Originally Posted by 77T

I agree that the season has more than the last race to consider.

As for season-long consistency issues, we must separate the RD’s role from the SOM. Often an F1 decision comes from the Stewards of the Meet, not the race director.

If you look at all the 2021 decision documents (including many that commenters here decried), the vast majority were decided by the Stewards rather than Masi. At each race, a unique panel of Stewards make the decision you see on the TV screen. Very few fans even know their names. But the one name that most know is the RD…so Masi gets painted with a broad brush that isn’t all his doing.

IMHO, the current controversy would not have developed without the last few laps of the final race. So I respect the broad criticism (except for “fixed”) being levied. This sport lives and breathes due to global interest by fans and the fans were sorely disappointed.

It doesn’t help that the review of the Race Director role is still underway - we won’t see anything official until 14FEB.

That’s when the review team’s reco will be presented to the teams at a meeting of the F1 Commission. If they agree with it, then several changes will come to the decision making during a race.

As a “mind experiment” (and worth the effort for fans) What if?

In other words, even if MB had gone to the top step of FIA’s Court of Appeals, VER would have won. That’s because the Court (if it agreed with MB) could only vacate the final race as unjust. Ergo, VER still wins WDC due to tied points and tie-breaker is # of wins.


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Many valid points Paul. It wasn't all Masi and the Race Stewards had a lot to say about what went on all season and how things were or were not punished. Some have been calling for permanent stewards rather than swapping them each race. It's unknown if that would remedy the inconsistent calls but it's never been tried before to the best of my knowledge in F1.

Your point at the end about vacating the last race was something I just read about last week. The end result would have still been Max winning the WDC so I suspect it's a significant reason Mercedes did not pursue it rather than for magnanimous reasons.

[77T]

Originally Posted by SDGT3

Many valid points Paul. It wasn't all Masi and the Race Stewards had a lot to say about what went on all season and how things were or were not punished. Some have been calling for permanent stewards rather than swapping them each race. It's unknown if that would remedy the inconsistent calls but it's never been tried before to the best of my knowledge in F1.

Your point at the end about vacating the last race was something I just read about last week. The end result would have still been Max winning the WDC so I suspect it's a significant reason Mercedes did not pursue it rather than for magnanimous reasons.

I agree with some continuity of Stewards - but the FIA has a requirement that a National Steward be assigned from the host Country. So at least one will vary by event.

Many don’t know Stewards are all volunteers. So the commitment for a permanent panel would be hard. But if we assigned a permanent Chair appointed by FIA then s/he could guide consistency. We need some rotation to build experience - we don’t want to have a sudden change mid-season due to health, etc.

A funny thing happened at last year’s training (done via Zoom) - we had a Race Director & Driver panel across the various World Championships. Drivers were able to express their interests in fair officiating. When Masi asked for a show of hands among drivers to volunteer to work at a visiting Steward, some raised hands. Then DiGrassi asked about the compensation level - was told $0 - and all were shocked Stewards were unpaid.


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[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by 77T

Then DiGrassi asked about the compensation level - was told $0 - and all were shocked Stewards were unpaid.

How much are the flagstaff paid?

[77T]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

How much are the flagstaff paid?

They’re volunteers also. Some expense reimbursement but not a paid job.


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[texasmade]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

How much are the flagstaff paid?

Flagstaff and track stewards are usually all volunteers each race. I remember seeing an email for CoTA asking for track volunteers. Unpaid and you're responsible for your own lodging and logistics to and from the track but they will provide food if you volunteer.

[77T]

Originally Posted by texasmade

I remember seeing an email for CoTA asking for track volunteers.

Interestingly, the F1 MiamiGP request sent to volunteers has 1500+ responses.


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[jatco]

Originally Posted by 77T

Interestingly, the F1 MiamiGP request sent to volunteers has 1500+ responses.


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Something I've always thought would be great and wanted to do but never materialized...

[texasmade]

Originally Posted by 77T

Interestingly, the F1 MiamiGP request sent to volunteers has 1500+ responses.


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I guess people that couldn't afford tickets still wanted to go to the race. Volunteering gets you really close to the action for free!