Tariff imposed and Watch Prices in the USA

[SoylentGreenChi]

Originally Posted by mongrelnomoad

Mate, I do wonder if you’ve ever travelled.

A Ford F150 would simply not fit in a parking space in London, or through a street in Rome or Tokyo. Its gas mileage would cripple anyone trying to drive it in country where petrol is taxed. People don’t buy your cars because what works for you doesn’t work for us - that’s why American companies like Ford and GM have different (and successful) offerings in the rest of the world vs the US.

Perhaps Americans buy foreign cars because while your cars don’t work with us, ours do work with you, and Americans actually like what they offer?

Not everything is some great conspiracy.

Yup, proud American from Chicago here, and I love my BMW coupe. If we’re talking partisanship with car manufacturing, for me that means BMW over Mercedes, Munich over Stuttgart, and Bavaria over Baden-Wurttemberg. Can’t wait for the trade war nonsense to be over so I can get back to my rants about BMW over Mercedes, which may be irrational but is, compared to the current conversations on tariffs, a model for enlightened discourse.

[SS Oyster]

BET


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[SS Oyster]

Originally Posted by mongrelnomoad

Mate, I do wonder if you’ve ever travelled.

A Ford F150 would simply not fit in a parking space in London, or through a street in Rome or Tokyo. Its gas mileage would cripple anyone trying to drive it in country where petrol is taxed. People don’t buy your cars because what works for you doesn’t work for us - that’s why American companies like Ford and GM have different (and successful) offerings in the rest of the world vs the US.

Perhaps Americans buy foreign cars because while your cars don’t work with us, ours do work with you, and Americans actually like what they offer?

Not everything is some great conspiracy.

You do know Ford makes smaller pickups than the F150. We are tired of getting ripped off!


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[alphadweller]

Meh, money for Rolex, money for US tariff. One can hope the US government will spend it wisely.

[alphadweller]

A non-issue in the luxury market.

[mongrelnomoad]

Originally Posted by SS Oyster

You do know Ford makes smaller pickups than the F150. We are tired of getting ripped off!


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That’s true, but the pickups and many entire US sectors are simply not competitive, relevant or appealing to global consumers.

Just FYI, an American car - the Tesla 3/Y twins - have topped sales charts across Europe.

Another American car - the Ford Fiesta - engineered in Germany for the European market - topped the European sales charts for decades.

The problem with the stuff you buy in America vis-a-vis global sales is the product, not some imagined conspiracy. The companies themselves understand this.

I still don’t understand how you’re “getting ripped off.”

[DtownRRS]

Originally Posted by mongrelnomoad

That’s true, but the pickups and many entire US sectors are simply not competitive, relevant or appealing to global consumers.

Just FYI, an American car - the Tesla 3/Y twins - have topped sales charts across Europe.

Another American car - the Ford Fiesta - engineered in Germany for the European market - topped the European sales charts for decades.

The problem with the stuff you buy in America vis-a-vis global sales is the product, not some imagined conspiracy. The companies themselves understand this.

I still don’t understand how you’re “getting ripped off.”

Totally understand what you are saying but does anyone in London or Rome have the option to buy any Ford pickup as easy as a Fiat or BMW etc?.... I Think that lack of the option is the point.

[DoricSpiker]

Originally Posted by codecow

Quebec City is awesome.

Looking forward to it.


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[Watchman001]

Originally Posted by DtownRRS

Totally understand what you are saying but does anyone in London or Rome have the option to buy any Ford pickup as easy as a Fiat or BMW etc?.... I Think that lack of the option is the point.

How many Vespas or Vespa dealers do you see in the US? Not many, because they are not compatible with our practices, roadways, climate, etc.

US car models not sold in the US are made for other markets and sold in other countries. US car models not compatible with other countries’ infrastructures, driving habits, etc. (F150) are not because…they are like Vespas here.

Again, not some big conspiracy.

[mongrelnomoad]

Originally Posted by DtownRRS

Totally understand what you are saying but does anyone in London or Rome have the option to buy any Ford pickup as easy as a Fiat or BMW etc?.... I Think that lack of the option is the point.

Why would they bother type certifying, emissions testing, advertising, shipping etc if it’s not going to sell? FYI, when oil prices shot through the roof in the 2010s, all the small fuel efficient cars sold by US manufacturers in the US were European models. When oil prices dropped again and there stopped being demand, they simply stopped importing them.

For the record, anyone can personally import (nearly) any US-market car to anywhere in Europe, but nobody does. If your argument is that we should all buy what Americans buy and to hell with our preferences (completely ignoring that we have our own industries companies, histories, infrastructure etc) that’s a bit impertinent, no? Hardly “freedom”.

[DtownRRS]

Originally Posted by mongrelnomoad

Why would they bother type certifying, emissions testing, advertising, shipping etc if it’s not going to sell?

If your argument is that we should all buy what Americans buy and to hell with our preferences (completely ignoring that we have our own industries companies, histories, infrastructure etc) that’s a bit impertinent, no? Hardly “freedom”.

I am not saying they would do it, in the US we have every European option and every US made option. But if they wanted to do it for whatever reason they don't have the option.

[Watchman001]

Originally Posted by DtownRRS

I am not saying they would do it, in the US we have every European option and every US made option. But if they wanted to do it for whatever reason they don't have the option.

There are many cars sold outside the US we do not have an option to buy. Saying we have every European option is just not true.

[Harry-57]

Originally Posted by DtownRRS

Totally understand what you are saying but does anyone in London or Rome have the option to buy any Ford pickup as easy as a Fiat or BMW etc?.... I Think that lack of the option is the point.

Rangers yes. There are F150s on UK roads but Ford UK won't sell us one. We can't buy Lancias or Opels, to name but two either. The barrier is viability. If available in RHD would enough people buy them? Ford and Stellantis obviously think not. Cadillac have bombed twice in the UK in my life time, Chrysler didn't do much better. The upside is that you can buy Crossfires, PT Cruisers and 300Cs for loose change. They didn't cost big money when new so prohibitive tariffs wouldn't have factored in.

[Harry-57]

Originally Posted by Watchman001

There are many cars sold outside the US we do not have an option to buy. Saying we have every European option is just not true.

You're right. We get a fraction of the cars on offer on Europe.

[mongrelnomoad]

Originally Posted by DtownRRS

I am not saying they would do it, in the US we have every European option and every US made option. But if they wanted to do it for whatever reason they don't have the option.

Yeah… there are Renault and Dacia dealerships in every strip mall, and you’re shopping at Walmart in your Seat Ibizas, Skoda Octavias, Citroen Amis and Opel Corsas.

You have every European option that is sold in America.

Same is true of Japan. Not sure I’ve seen many Toyota Alphards, Nissan Serenas or Honda s660s when I’ve been in the States.

[vandave]

I wonder if the Swiss will push more watches into Canada and Mexico, knowing that a lot of Americans will wear them across the border to save taxes.

In the short run, I doubt they'll raise retail prices pending what ultimately happens with trade deals. Rather, they'll let supply run low or out.

[Maleg]

Originally Posted by alphadweller

Meh, money for Rolex, money for US tariff. One can hope the US government will spend it wisely.

There is zero hope the US government can spend money wisely. One doesn't get $46 trillion in debt by spending wisely.

[HiBoost]

Originally Posted by SS Oyster

You do know Ford makes smaller pickups than the F150. We are tired of getting ripped off!


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I would love to hear an honest explanation about how Lesotho is ripping us off. I can't imagine any rational person thinking an African nation of 2M poor people should be able to purchase as much from us as our rich nation of 340M purchases from them. And what are we purchasing from them? Diamonds. Do we expect diamond mines to open up here in response to the 50% tariff on them? This is clearly not a defensible policy.

[Gebbeth]

I'm doubting myself why I'm even responding, as tariffs are so wrapped up in politics that every opinion will inevitably lead to heated responses.

This is just my opinion on the whole thing.

To me, the way these tariffs were created and decreed was to be punitive in nature instead of a call for equality in trade relations. They seemed to have been based on some equation related to trade deficits instead of current tariff rates, and to me, that doesn't make sense because trade deficits and tariff rates are not always correlated, at least not in the way the administration thinks they are correlated.

Being punitive in nature, what that invites is not cooperation or negotiation, but retaliation. No one wants to be forced to negotiate with a gun pointed at their heads. If another country doesn't have a gun to point back with, then I guess it's academic. But a lot of other countries do, and so they are pointing the gun back.

This kind of situation is just not good for anyone....US or otherwise.

With respect to the 31% tariffs on Swiss goods, I'm not really sure what we are trying to get the Swiss to buy from us which are subject to "unfair" tariffs by the Swiss. Cars?
Milk? Wheat? Rice? I don't know, but I'm sure we do buy a lot of watches from Switzerland...and we are a much larger market for their watches than Switzerland is for our cars, wheat, rice, etc.

In other words, we're not getting much out of Switzerland to begin with, and it's like trying to get blood from a proverbial turnip. In the meantime, consumers who were buying these watches may get priced out of the watches altogether. This means less sales to Swiss watchmakers, but also less sales by US based distributors, ADs, sales people, managers, businesses, etc.

Is this just a game of chicken then? With the world? The only ones who will pay are the consumers around the world, the ones not rich enough or powerful enough to make policy that affects themselves. Most of the people who are rich and powerful enough to do so are the ones who probably don't really care because they can ride out any storm.

Ultimately, this is what is going to happen if this goes on.

[GB-man]

[gamingdoctor]

Originally Posted by DtownRRS

I am not saying they would do it, in the US we have every European option and every US made option. But if they wanted to do it for whatever reason they don't have the option.

This isn't true at all.

Signed,
Sad US audi driver

[DtownRRS]

Originally Posted by gamingdoctor

This isn't true at all.

Signed,
Sad US audi driver

Ha! You sound as bummed as my brother who can't get the normal A8 anymore just the A8L.

[Cambo]

Originally Posted by Maleg

Since you are the 51st state there wouldn't be a tariff.

As you say, the CAD is weak against the USD. I would buy Canadian all day long. Perhaps someone who knows can tell us how the tariffs work on the private sale of personal property.

These are interesting times…if Carney (non elected “Prime Minister”), and the Liberals get back in power, western Canada will be looking at options. We can only take so much.

[SS Oyster]

Originally Posted by mongrelnomoad

That’s true, but the pickups and many entire US sectors are simply not competitive, relevant or appealing to global consumers.

Just FYI, an American car - the Tesla 3/Y twins - have topped sales charts across Europe.

Another American car - the Ford Fiesta - engineered in Germany for the European market - topped the European sales charts for decades.

The problem with the stuff you buy in America vis-a-vis global sales is the product, not some imagined conspiracy. The companies themselves understand this.

I still don’t understand how you’re “getting ripped off.”

Not appealing can also be because the price is falsely high due to tariffs, VAT and other.

How is it a level playing field when the US only charges 2.5% to import a Porsche, but German charges 10% plus 19% VAT to import a Corvette?


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[Phrank]

Originally Posted by Ichiran

I'm based in Singapore who believes in free market and we do not impose tariffs on cars from any country. Here, there are many German cars, Japanese cars, Korean cars and now BYD has become the best seller. Tesla js one of the best sellers in recent years due to the rise of EV. Overall, there were 43,022 new car registrations in 2024 and Tesla only represents 5.5% (there are hardly other American makes other than Tesla).

There was discussion of BYD opening a manufacturing plant in Ontario IIRC, there is also a big EV battery plant newly built there as well.

This was taken off the table per a request from Pres. Biden - now talks of this are starting to surface again.

Would be a great option to see these cars available on the Canadian market.

[KenRose]

Originally Posted by Dave O

Let's not kid ourselves. It's to protect your market. Very similar to how there are very few American cars in many areas of the world but in the US there is a major foreign car market. Why? Because those countries don't want US cars in their market.

I have to speak up on this. US cars do not fit will on roads in Europe. There may be other issues that you're correct on but there won't be a lot of F150's being sold in Europe at a 0% tariff rate. Not to mention the price of fuel there.

[Phrank]

Originally Posted by KenRose

I have to speak up on this. US cars do not fit will on roads in Europe. There may be other issues that you're correct on but there won't be a lot of F150's being sold in Europe at a 0% tariff rate. Not to mention the price of fuel there.

Really, Ford 150's don't even fit on *our* roads....

[kieselguhr]

Originally Posted by GB-man

Could you pass that over back here please?

[mongrelnomoad]

Originally Posted by SS Oyster

Not appealing can also be because the price is falsely high due to tariffs, VAT and other.

How is it a level playing field when the US only charges 2.5% to import a Porsche, but German charges 10% plus 19% VAT to import a Corvette?


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For the love of god man, VAT is just A SALES TAX, one applied to EVERY SINGLE CAR SOLD. Just like the sales tax you have on cars, and Rolexes! Who is whispering Iago-like into your ear and turning something so pedestrian into something evil?

And yes there is a slight asymmetry in tariffs in this case (though there are countless in the other direction too - don’t kid yourself that America, the home of lobbying and vested interests, is some utopian free-trade idyll), but I was listening to a German politician on this subject yesterday, and he was lamenting - and as this trade war snowballs, you will surely come to realise - that tariffs and distortions, once enacted, are very sticky.

Anyway, I’m done. Have a good night.

[SS Oyster]

Originally Posted by Gebbeth

The only ones who will pay are the consumers around the world, the ones not rich enough or powerful enough to make policy that affects themselves.

Most of us on this forum live in countries where we are free to VOTE. Americans voted for tariffs as it was a pillar of President Trump’s platform.

It’s a risky move, so President Trump will either be a hero when it all works out, or he’ll suffer the consequences if it does not. At least he’s will to do SOMETHING. All others who have occupied the Oval Office have been willing to just print money, hand much of it out in trade deficits (and other waste) and give away our national treasure to the tune of $36.2T (~124% on GDP), which is the equivalent of saddling every American citizen with $106,000 of debt.

We can’t just stick our head in the sand. Doing nothing leads to a collapse in world economy and a complete devaluation of the US dollar.

Suffering some short term pain to save our country is worth the risk. Doing nothing is a certain and horrific outcome.


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