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daveathall · 21 March 2023, 02:28 AM

The problem with the rules is that they have got people with a lot of intelligence involved and have made it complicated and open to interpretation. It is quite an easy rule to apply.

"Once the car is fully stopped, no person can touch the car, no machinery or tools can touch or be placed under the car until it has completed a 5 second penalty."

The other thing that could be addressed is that FIA should give their ruling to the team but don't make it public until they have had chance to appeal.

I am glad that good sense has been applied and that Alonso has his place back.

77T · 21 March 2023, 05:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDGT3

Paul, anything in the sporting regs that prohibits the car in question from serving the time penalty after the car was serviced?

For example, if I was a team principal and my driver(s) had to serve a time penalty, I'd order my mechanics to service the car immediately and once off the jack stands, hold the car for the 5 seconds, keep the pit lane light RED and then release the car after the time penalty was served. The advantages are multiple.... A. All the mechanics (that are extremely anxious) service the car without restrictions instead of hoping all 15 or so don't touch the car. B. It gives the mechanics time to clear the spent tires and wheel guns from pit lane. C. It gives the driver 5 seconds to gather himself, get ready to exit his box and look for traffic in his side mirror.

Yes F1 Sporting Regs 54.4c)

“Whilst a car is stationary in the pit lane as a result of incurring a penalty in accordance with Articles 54.3a) or 54.3b) above, it may not be worked on until the car has been stationary for the duration of the penalty.”

Those articles are 5-sec or 10-sec, respectively.

As to the idea of flipping the sequence, the servicing is faster when done last. It allows the team X seconds to adjust to any positional anomaly after the driver comes to a stop. Also, the driver is always ready to go when the jacks are dropped.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

enjoythemusic · 21 March 2023, 06:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 77T

All I got is this…
I’m H•A•P•P•Y …wait for it at the end.

Cool one Paul

PS: Much cooler than a Pharrell music video.

dba · 21 March 2023, 10:24 AM

In reading the news today regarding this, I think, publicly at least, that both Alonso and Russell were incredibly gracious. Alonso by saying Russell was robbed of being on the podium to celebrate, and Russell by saying he thought the penalties were excessive.

First class guys, both.

NYG1121 · 21 March 2023, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dba

In reading the news today regarding this, I think, publicly at least, that both Alonso and Russell were incredibly gracious. Alonso by saying Russell was robbed of being on the podium to celebrate, and Russell by saying he thought the penalties were excessive.

First class guys, both.

Opposite of Verstappen

joeychitwood · 21 March 2023, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYG1121

Opposite of Verstappen

He seems incapable of humility or graciousness. He’s very talented, but I can’t bring myself to be a fan.

jatco · 21 March 2023, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeychitwood

He seems incapable of humility or graciousness. He’s very talented, but I can’t bring myself to be a fan.

x2.. and he could hardly care.. Seems to be a 'me' kinda guy. Whatever..

denmanproject · 21 March 2023, 11:54 AM

I know it’s early but McLaren is in for a tough season it looks like

The RB car is something else, the way it passed the Merc like it was standing still

jatco · 21 March 2023, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by denmanproject

I know it’s early but McLaren is in for a tough season it looks like

The RB car is something else, the way it passed the Merc like it was standing still

Reminds me of when the Merc was unbeatable...and when Ferrari was unbeatable...etc etc.. The tide has changed once again.

dba · 21 March 2023, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYG1121

Opposite of Verstappen

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeychitwood

He seems incapable of humility or graciousness. He’s very talented, but I can’t bring myself to be a fan.

He gets it from his old man. While watching the post race, as Checo was getting his congratulations from his team, you could see the contempt on Jos Verstappen's face. He could barely allow himself to even acknowledge Checo. Just an incredible display of poor sportsmanship.

INC · 21 March 2023, 04:36 PM

I understand if you don't like Verstappen, but I don't think he should have said a single word about this incident! It wasn't about him and it wasn't even about his team. In addition, as you can see, the decision was changed later, so he remained much smarter than those who were smart before the game was over - like me, for example. It wasn't his cup of tea. Honestly I don't know why and what role he should have been taken in this issue.

In my opinion he simply aspired to do what comes from his character, to lead the F1 driver's championship. In my opinion, he was not happy just because he was not able to catch the leader. It was NOT about Perez, but it was about to finish at the 2nd place. And now, please take a closer look at Checco's face WHEN he realized that he was NOT leading the championship "but is only second", because Max took the fastest lap from him at the last moment. That's what clearly shows, who don't know his place in between the best pilots. That was what maked me absolutely sure, that in the last year in Monaco that was NOT an unwanted incident but a deliberate action from Perez. Let me remind that Alonso was able to overtake him and could hold him back as long as there was no DRS. Now imagine the same with Max and laugh out loud Checco's "dreams" about that he can have a chance to win the F1 drivers championship as a teammate of any other men from the best pilots.

Speedbird-1 · 21 March 2023, 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jatco

x2.. and he could hardly care.. Seems to be a 'me' kinda guy. Whatever..

He's Dutch, isn't he?
I find it difficult to think well of him, after walking away from Lewis, potentially trapped under the RB (Monza 2021).
Arrogance personified!

Ask Vettel.

https://youtu.be/lkAoSghdD6Y

tifosi · 22 March 2023, 12:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dba

In reading the news today regarding this, I think, publicly at least, that both Alonso and Russell were incredibly gracious. Alonso by saying Russell was robbed of being on the podium to celebrate, and Russell by saying he thought the penalties were excessive.

First class guys, both.

I really liked hearing both those guys discussing that situation. Like you said...pure class.

What I thought was not class was Hamilton in the media pen afterwards...
Media: "you must be happy that George got on the podium?"
Ham: "That's got nothing to do with me"

Poor Hamilton...can't win or beat his teammate and now he doesn't want to play anymore. Bitter.

SDGT3 · 22 March 2023, 01:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dba

He gets it from his old man. While watching the post race, as Checo was getting his congratulations from his team, you could see the contempt on Jos Verstappen's face. He could barely allow himself to even acknowledge Checo. Just an incredible display of poor sportsmanship.

I think you're right... Jos was not the best human being when he was a driver. Max is infinitely more talented than his old man and with that comes a certain level of responsibility as the camera is always on you. Hopefully he can change as he is still young. Max needs to spend more time with Ricciardo to see and act like being young, rich, and talented is a blessing and to enjoy life.

Conversely, Alonso and Russell showed incredible class in the way they handled the confusing situation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tifosi

I really liked hearing both those guys discussing that situation. Like you said...pure class.

What I thought was not class was Hamilton in the media pen afterwards...
Media: "you must be happy that George got on the podium?"
Ham: "That's got nothing to do with me"

Poor Hamilton...can't win or beat his teammate and now he doesn't want to play anymore. Bitter.

I'm afraid Hamilton is what he's always been and will never change.

tifosi · 22 March 2023, 01:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dba

He gets it from his old man. While watching the post race, as Checo was getting his congratulations from his team, you could see the contempt on Jos Verstappen's face. He could barely allow himself to even acknowledge Checo. Just an incredible display of poor sportsmanship.

Speaking of Checo....poor Checo....even the media barely wants to acknowledge him. After quali it was Max this and Max that...driveshaft this and driveshaft that...

It took until basically after an interview with Horner after quali for the commentator to say "Oh yea...let's not forget Checo's pole". LOL

enjoythemusic · 22 March 2023, 02:11 AM

You guys remind me of those who discuss WWE personalities. For every Hulk Hogan there's an Andre The Giant and Ric Flair.

SDGT3 · 22 March 2023, 02:29 AM

Who?

enjoythemusic · 22 March 2023, 03:05 AM

Yous guise.

Just joking-ish in a very friendly way. Hamilton is struggling again this year.

Speedbird-1 · 22 March 2023, 04:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDGT3

Who?

joli160 · 22 March 2023, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speedbird-1

He's Dutch, isn't he?
I find it difficult to think well of him, after walking away from Lewis, potentially trapped under the RB (Monza 2021).
Arrogance personified!

Ask Vettel.

https://youtu.be/lkAoSghdD6Y

What has being Dutch to do with it ?

Monza was an unfortunate minor accident which happened whilst driving very slow rounding the corner and he saw that Hamilton was OK as he clearly stated in interviews.

Forgotten about Silverstone in the same season ?

Hard to imagine nowadays but Vettel as well was once the most hated driver in F1 (2013) He matured a lot since than.

Perhaps there is still hope for Verstappen, with age comes wisdom

77T · 22 March 2023, 11:44 AM

Looking ahead…
FIA will clarify the touching/working definitions.

“The subsequent decision of the stewards to hear and grant the Right of Review by the Competitor was the result of new evidence regarding the definition of ‘working on the car’, for which there were conflicting precedents, and this has been exposed by this specific circumstance.

This topic will therefore be addressed at the next Sporting Advisory Committee taking place on Thursday, 23 March, and a clarification will be issued ahead of the 2023 FIA Formula 1 Australian Grand Prix.”

That clarification would apply to time penalties to be served in pit lane no matter what caused the penalty.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

INC · 22 March 2023, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 77T

Looking ahead…
FIA will clarify the touching/working definitions.

I hope they will find the best solution for themselves and the sport

This case, we will get what we want: The race... on the track

tifosi · 22 March 2023, 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by INC

I hope they will find the best solution for themselves and the sport

This case, we will get what we want: The race... on the track

All the racing is kind of pointless when you don't know the results until 3 days later. Takes the fun out of it.

JoeJoeBobo · 23 March 2023, 12:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 77T

Looking ahead…
FIA will clarify the touching/working definitions.

“The subsequent decision of the stewards to hear and grant the Right of Review by the Competitor was the result of new evidence regarding the definition of ‘working on the car’, for which there were conflicting precedents, and this has been exposed by this specific circumstance.

This topic will therefore be addressed at the next Sporting Advisory Committee taking place on Thursday, 23 March, and a clarification will be issued ahead of the 2023 FIA Formula 1 Australian Grand Prix.”

That clarification would apply to time penalties to be served in pit lane no matter what caused the penalty.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

A jack under the car and not touching is no different to wheel gun in hand not in use. This is why ruling was overturned but should have been enforced in first place IMO.

77T · 23 March 2023, 01:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeJoeBobo

A jack under the car and not touching is no different to wheel gun in hand not in use. This is why ruling was overturned but should have been enforced in first place IMO.

I agree if the Jack didn’t touch the car - but the rear jack definitely touched the car. The logic behind overturning the 10-sec penalty was for a different reason. See the post shared Sunday.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tifosi

All the racing is kind of pointless when you don't know the results until 3 days later. Takes the fun out of it.

I would agree if that was the case here. But the Stewards worked until 1 am Saudi TZ to issue final results at the track.

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77T · 23 March 2023, 01:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by INC

I hope they will find the best solution for themselves and the sport

This case, we will get what we want: The race... on the track

Me too - the SAC had differing notes for this particular situation.

Hope they make it clear - and simple.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

SDGT3 · 23 March 2023, 07:10 AM

This guy gets better and better with his impressions...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlSQUMHEchs

Jackie Daytona · 23 March 2023, 08:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDGT3

This guy gets better and better with his impressions...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlSQUMHEchs

saw that when he posted it as well. Love that guys videos.

enjoythemusic · 23 March 2023, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDGT3

This guy gets better and better with his impressions...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlSQUMHEchs

Love his videos

77T · 23 March 2023, 08:59 AM

Very creative - and not far from the truth methinks

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

21 March 2023, 02:28 AM	#4951
daveathall "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Real Name: Dave Location: England. Watch: Various Posts: 7,304	The problem with the rules is that they have got people with a lot of intelligence involved and have made it complicated and open to interpretation. It is quite an easy rule to apply. "Once the car is fully stopped, no person can touch the car, no machinery or tools can touch or be placed under the car until it has completed a 5 second penalty." The other thing that could be addressed is that FIA should give their ruling to the team but don't make it public until they have had chance to appeal. I am glad that good sense has been applied and that Alonso has his place back. __________________ KINDEST REGARDS DAVE

21 March 2023, 10:24 AM	#4954
dba 2025 Pledge Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Real Name: David Location: Gardnerville, NV Watch: 16710 Posts: 2,728	In reading the news today regarding this, I think, publicly at least, that both Alonso and Russell were incredibly gracious. Alonso by saying Russell was robbed of being on the podium to celebrate, and Russell by saying he thought the penalties were excessive. First class guys, both. __________________ Current: 16710 Previous: 16760 Fat Lady, 16613 Bluesy, 16800, 14060, 16710 Pepsi, 216570 Polar, 116710LN, 16610, 216570 Polar (again), 16713, 216570 Polar (yet again), 16710 Black w/ Pepsi Insert Hope is not a strategy.

22 March 2023, 02:11 AM	#4966
enjoythemusic 2025 Pledge Member Join Date: Nov 2012 Real Name: Steven Location: Glocal Posts: 21,648	You guys remind me of those who discuss WWE personalities. For every Hulk Hogan there's an Andre The Giant and Ric Flair. __________________ __________________ Love timepieces and want to become a Watchmaker? Rolex has a sensational school. www.RolexWatchmakingTrainingCenter.com/ Sent from my Etch A Sketch using String Theory.

22 March 2023, 03:05 AM	#4968
enjoythemusic 2025 Pledge Member Join Date: Nov 2012 Real Name: Steven Location: Glocal Posts: 21,648	Yous guise. Just joking-ish in a very friendly way. Hamilton is struggling again this year. __________________ __________________ Love timepieces and want to become a Watchmaker? Rolex has a sensational school. www.RolexWatchmakingTrainingCenter.com/ Sent from my Etch A Sketch using String Theory.

22 March 2023, 11:44 AM	#4971
77T 2025 Pledge Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Real Name: PaulG Location: Georgia Posts: 42,388	Looking ahead… FIA will clarify the touching/working definitions. “The subsequent decision of the stewards to hear and grant the Right of Review by the Competitor was the result of new evidence regarding the definition of ‘working on the car’, for which there were conflicting precedents, and this has been exposed by this specific circumstance. This topic will therefore be addressed at the next Sporting Advisory Committee taking place on Thursday, 23 March, and a clarification will be issued ahead of the 2023 FIA Formula 1 Australian Grand Prix.” That clarification would apply to time penalties to be served in pit lane no matter what caused the penalty. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro __________________ Does anyone really know what time it is?

21 March 2023, 11:54 AM	#4958
denmanproject "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2015 Real Name: Wayne Location: Canada Posts: 4,407	I know it’s early but McLaren is in for a tough season it looks like The RB car is something else, the way it passed the Merc like it was standing still

21 March 2023, 04:36 PM	#4961
INC "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2022 Location: Budapest, HU Watch: 17000B, B+W Posts: 2,505	I understand if you don't like Verstappen, but I don't think he should have said a single word about this incident! It wasn't about him and it wasn't even about his team. In addition, as you can see, the decision was changed later, so he remained much smarter than those who were smart before the game was over - like me, for example. It wasn't his cup of tea. Honestly I don't know why and what role he should have been taken in this issue. In my opinion he simply aspired to do what comes from his character, to lead the F1 driver's championship. In my opinion, he was not happy just because he was not able to catch the leader. It was NOT about Perez, but it was about to finish at the 2nd place. And now, please take a closer look at Checco's face WHEN he realized that he was NOT leading the championship "but is only second", because Max took the fastest lap from him at the last moment. That's what clearly shows, who don't know his place in between the best pilots. That was what maked me absolutely sure, that in the last year in Monaco that was NOT an unwanted incident but a deliberate action from Perez. Let me remind that Alonso was able to overtake him and could hold him back as long as there was no DRS. Now imagine the same with Max and laugh out loud Checco's "dreams" about that he can have a chance to win the F1 drivers championship as a teammate of any other men from the best pilots.

22 March 2023, 02:29 AM	#4967
SDGT3 "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2019 Real Name: Phillip Location: Right here Watch: SD43 Daytona Blusy Posts: 2,174	Who?

23 March 2023, 07:10 AM	#4977
SDGT3 "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2019 Real Name: Phillip Location: Right here Watch: SD43 Daytona Blusy Posts: 2,174	This guy gets better and better with his impressions... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlSQUMHEchs

23 March 2023, 08:59 AM	#4980
77T 2025 Pledge Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Real Name: PaulG Location: Georgia Posts: 42,388	Very creative - and not far from the truth methinks Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro __________________ Does anyone really know what time it is?

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