Would You Rather? Buy Panda Daytona from Grey or Wait for AD?

[stainlesssteelsteve]

Originally Posted by stevestil

I got a white dial 116500 from my AD in 2022. I no longer have a relationship with that AD unfortunately. sure, I was lucky enough to get it, here is how I got it:

I sent my previous AD A LOT of referrals (over 100k) and I also had a spend of roughly the same amount with them (over 100K). Even then, it took a while to get the Daytona and I had to go through multiple channels within the AD to "get approved"...looking back on the experience now, it was actually awful lol.

if I had to do it all over again, I would definitely buy it on the Grey Market. just saying.

there are people who say "I will never pay above retail", but when you really factor in the cost of most of these watches on the secondary compared to what you need to spend to get one at retail, in many cases, buying the watch once on the secondary is actually cheaper, and believe it or not, you will get better service from a reputable grey dealer than you will at 95% of AD's (and 95% may be generous.....more like 99%). I am getting a bit tired of the AD's making it seem like it is a tremendous privilege that they are "allowing" you to spend tens and thousand of dollars of YOUR hard earned money. As far as authenticity goes, if you buy from a reputable dealer with a lot of skin in the game and someone who has been doing this for a long time, authenticity is not a concern. No Grey market dealer that has a reputation is going to risk selling a fake and all of the reputable dealers are EXTREMELY experienced in being able to tell a fake from a real one, even with all of these great replicas coming out of China.

the icing on the cake for me was when I had a conversation with an AD (Bucherer on 57th and Madison). My sales associate there sold me a date just 36 as a walk in for my wife this past summer. After months and months of waiting for any other watch that I asked him for, and believe me, no watch I asked for was something he couldn't get for me, he basically told me I will never be able to get a watch from them because I spent money at a different Bucherer on Long Island (in Roosevelt Field Mall). Not only do they make you feel like they are doing you a favor by allowing you to spend your money, but now they also tell you WHERE you can spend your money. no thanks.

if you're at 70k with your AD and need to spend another 30 to be eligible and "maybe" get a Daytona.....Id rather spend 36k and be sure im getting it, without buying a bunch of stuff I don't really want in between. A lot of times, when we think of the "end goal", we convince ourselves we want things in between when In reality we don't.

there are plenty of watches that you can wait for, and they will eventually come, assuming you have a good relationship and a consistent spend with your AD. a SS Daytona is not one of those "keep waiting, the call will come!" watches.

It's like you're reading my mind. Your situation sounds a lot like mine. Lots of purchases, lots of referrals, ADs getting upset if they hear you even looked at another AD.

My only potential silver lining is that the precious metal Daytona seems much easier to get and would bring me above that $100K threshold. Plus, I actually want the precious metal Daytona.

The main thought that causes concern is getting to that threshold and still not getting allocated the watch 2, 3, 4, or 5 years down the road.

1st world problems...

[prnceofpersia23]

$100k and then what? Eligible doesn't sound reassuring. No guarantees you'd get it even at that spend threshold.

My rule is this. If you buy the watch to keep, then paying a grey market premium won't make a difference in the long run. I've gone grey but sold within a year or two. That's when the grey premium hurts.

[EEpro]

Go grey (full warranty resale actually) with a white tag

[Calatrava r]

You know when you buy "grey" you are buying a watch someone else got from an AD and flipped for a profit. Why prop up the over-hyped inflated used Daytona watch market. These watches all first come sold from ADs.

[TikTok]

AD. If they cant get me one in a reasonable time then I’ll buy something else.
The ‘something else’ is a more realistic proposition.

[Travis29]

I've bought preowned and through the AD.

The gratification was not there when I went outside the AD. It was meh...

[stainlesssteelsteve]

Originally Posted by Travis29

I've bought preowned and through the AD.

The gratification was not there when I went outside the AD. It was meh...

I do agree with this.

[stainlesssteelsteve]

Originally Posted by EEpro

Go grey (full warranty resale actually) with a white tag

Jealous of this...

[gamingdoctor]

Originally Posted by stainlesssteelsteve

Starting to think it's impossible to get a white dial Daytona from an AD.

Do I....

A) Spend $36K on an unworn watch from a grey dealer, and get the watch this year?

B) Keep buying watches from my AD in hopes that I'll get the watch in 2-3 years?
- I have a $70K spend and they are requesting a $100K spend before being eligible for the white dial Daytona

Honestly should be the end of the thread.

[EEpro]

Originally Posted by stainlesssteelsteve

Jealous of this...

It's great. I've owned the 116500 twice in white and once in black (from AD where I had 200k spend but SA quit). This is my favorite. I got this one off a flipper for $34,500 shipped. It had been sized but was otherwise perfect, less than a week old, and had the full kit with -001 tag. The 4131 movement has been keeping +0.6 seconds per day since December. And even though you can't see it, it is much nicer looking than 4130.

[Majin Buu]

Me?
Always AD, and hope for the best …

J.

[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by stainlesssteelsteve

Starting to think it's impossible to get a white dial Daytona from an AD.

Do I....

A) Spend $36K on an unworn watch from a grey dealer, and get the watch this year?

B) Keep buying watches from my AD in hopes that I'll get the watch in 2-3 years?
- I have a $70K spend and they are requesting a $100K spend before being eligible for the white dial Daytona

That last statement makes me crazy! How dare they tell you that? What’s the point of waiting, then? If you have to spend another $30,000 to even be considered, just take that money and get it now. Go grey!

Kat


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[ikincooper]

OP you’ve spent 70k already and it sounds like you’d be very happy taking that to over 100k by purchasing a PM Daytona. Subject to an honest conversation with your SA, I’d go that route with a view to a SS Daytona likely coming next. If you’ve spend 70k already, an open discussion should not be unrealistic. You’re almost there and you’re not taking about spending 30k plus on jewellery that you don’t want.

For what it’s worth, I had a similar journey to obtaining my SS Daytona here in the UK albeit with significantly lower spend levels being required….I asked seriously for a Daytona in the lead up to my 40th back in early 2022 and was told that I’d need to spend over a set level to be in with a chance (mid £50k’s I recall). I went over that level by purchasing a PM watch for a family member in Nov 2022 (that I’d requested prior to my Daytona ask) and then got my Daytona in mid Jan 2023.


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[MJZRolex]

I’d have no faith that the AD would come through after a $100k spend.

[ArtNouveau]

My 116500 was the third watch from my current AD, previous spend was a BLNR and BLRO for about $17K total. It’s not always about the spend level but the “relationship” is real despite what some people constantly say.
Mine was $12400 at the time, I love the watch but not enough to spend $30K+ on one.

[JRell]

Wait or it’s not worth it. Fall in love with another watch.

[Cambo]

Always AD unless you can’t live without it. But if you have the additional 20K lying around, knock yourself out.

[Kingcobb]

Unless you have another 30k+ worth of Rolex watches you want for the chance to have the opportunity to possibly maybe if you hold your tongue right fork over another 15K for the watch you actually want.....go grey and save yourself a lot of hassle and use the difference on something you actually want.

[APhound]

I’d recommend just buying it and start enjoying it. You can stay on the list and if they ever come through you can of course buy it and sell your old one. You won’t lose much if anything buying grey. They really only go up (speaking specifically about white ss Daytona)
I don’t bother with Rolex ad personally. I buy what I want when I want. If they hit me up, and from time to time they do, I usually buy whatever it is, but I wouldn’t even bother asking for a panda Daytona bc I know those go to the jewelry guys.


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[the dark knight]

My biggest issue with going grey for a steel Daytona (I've considered it often but haven't pulled the trigger) is when I think about what else I can get for that kind of money, and the value proposition gets really difficult to justify. Someone linked a new 126500 from Takuya above, that's $37k. $47k (tax inc) gets you a PM Daytona from the AD. $10k is nothing to sneeze at of course, but we are talking about a lot of money no matter what. Takuya also has an OF Daytona from 2021 for about the same price as that 126500 as well.

And I haven't mentioned other brands yet. I'd much rather have a VCO Chrono than a steel Daytona if they are roughly the same price.

Having said all that, I think the play is obvious for you here. You like PM Daytonas anyway. Just get one from the AD, and hit your 100k. If they were stringing you along, well you still have a Daytona you like and it didn't cost you an insane amount over a grey market steel Daytona. If they weren't stringing you along, well now you will get a steel Daytona allocated. Seems like the obvious thing to do.

[APJourneyFail]

I would say wait for AD but after my AP experience i don't know, lol

[stainlesssteelsteve]

Originally Posted by the dark knight

My biggest issue with going grey for a steel Daytona (I've considered it often but haven't pulled the trigger) is when I think about what else I can get for that kind of money, and the value proposition gets really difficult to justify. Someone linked a new 126500 from Takuya above, that's $37k. $47k (tax inc) gets you a PM Daytona from the AD. $10k is nothing to sneeze at of course, but we are talking about a lot of money no matter what. Takuya also has an OF Daytona from 2021 for about the same price as that 126500 as well.

And I haven't mentioned other brands yet. I'd much rather have a VCO Chrono than a steel Daytona if they are roughly the same price.

Having said all that, I think the play is obvious for you here. You like PM Daytonas anyway. Just get one from the AD, and hit your 100k. If they were stringing you along, well you still have a Daytona you like and it didn't cost you an insane amount over a grey market steel Daytona. If they weren't stringing you along, well now you will get a steel Daytona allocated. Seems like the obvious thing to do.

I am leaning this way

[EEpro]

Originally Posted by APJourneyFail

I would say wait for AD but after my AP experience i don't know, lol

I admire your honesty.

There's no way a journey will ever be cheaper or shorter than just buying what you want.

It is called a journey for a reason. They take you for a walk.

I hope the AP forum apologists go easy on you. In general you're not allowed to have a negative opinion of AP in any way whatsoever. You may even find yourself blamed for your SA's departure.

[Harry-57]

I can only speak for my AD and in the context of my relationship with them to date. It has little or no relevance to your AD or the dynamic of your relationship with them.

Having got the disclaimer out of the way: if my AD told me I was on the list I would wait. If my AD told me I could not be listed I would either ask again at regular intervals, go grey or forget about it. If going grey we will each draw the expenditure line in a place that suits the individual. How much do you want it and how much are you willing to pay if MSRP is nothing more than a concept?

[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by stainlesssteelsteve

I was thinking that I'd buy a precious metal Daytona, which I want anyways and see what happens. But, the issue is just waiting without any guarantee of getting the white dial.

I actually like the white dial in the 126500 better, because it has Zenith Daytona vibes. Plus, I have a black dial 116500.

If you already have a black 116500, isn’t that enough to scratch the SS Daytona itch?

Kat


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[BroncoOne]

Originally Posted by 1William

This is really about money and what you are willing to spend. No guarantees that at 100k you get the watch. I do not like the uncertainty of waiting without them telling me when the watch I want will be available to me. I would go with a Trusted Seller and get the watch I want now without any further games.

Agreed. This particular watch could elude you for years.
Buy what you want grey and if and when the AD does come through, sell the grey watch and try to get your money back. If the AD doesn’t, you have the watch that you want.

Best of both worlds and you get to wear the watch in the interim.

[StellarisCollection]

I would personally buy from your AD.

[DoctorsOrders]

There is something very special about when you get the call. I would wait! The wait makes it all that more special when it finally arrives

[MitchSF]

I wanted a black dial 126500. AD took two years to get the Sub, which was finally delivered a few months ago. My logic is simple - I’m 68. How many years do I have left to wait and possibly never get it, and I refuse to buy things that I don’t really want, to improve my position with the AD. Let’s week I bout one grey, and I couldn’t be happier. No regrets whatsoever.

[RollingInTheDeep]

1. People say they would wait for the AD, or things like "I only buy from AD." These are folks that are likely ok with NEVER getting the subject watch. There is a good possibility you never get the call.
2. I have had ADs explicitly tell me that a client only got an allocation because they spent >$100k on jewelry.
3. I have heard that it has taken over $100k in watch sales to become considered. Your note seems to confirm this.
4. A caveat to #3 is that every AD is different.
5. I would like to see three examples of where a retail buyer was able to purchase a Daytona from an AD with 0-3 watch purchase history.
6. I was part of "never [grey]" (grey is a misnomer, we're talking about BNIB secondary sales with warranty), until realizing how ADs use high demand pieces as rewards to those that contribute to high margin sales, i.e., jewelry. This notion of "AD experience" fizzles once you understand that there are ADs that aren't doing you any favors and instead participate in certain actions that drive certain market dynamics.
7. Once you understand what it ACTUALLY TAKES - not what it might take, not the magical idea that one day the AD is going to call and you're going to sip ice cold Pellegrino while the AD takes the white dial out of it's coffin in front of you just becasue you got lucky - the EVIDENCE OVERWHELMINGLY SUPPORTS the thesis that buying secondary does not only inherently ensure certainty, but for the common retailer, at a LOWER ALL-IN COST, despite it costing 2x retail. Further to Mitch's point, if its a grail, it becomes even more of a "no brainer." Is there a chance the price goes down, absolutely! That doesn't change the fact that most will never get access to the watch via the AD, and still provides for strong possibility that it was a more economically sound purchase than maxing spend at an AD just for a maybe.

I am confident that even if there are credible examples of people walking off the street and buying a Daytona from the AD, there is more to that story, e.g., they are dating the boutique manager or owner, etc.