32xx movement problem poll and data thread

[saxo3]

Some thread statistics until now

Duration: 23/01 – 21/04/2021 (88 days)
Posts: 991
Views: 47057
Different contributors: 132

Poll: Does your 32xx movement seem to be 100% ok?
Voters: 512
Yes: 69,1 %
No: 30,9 %

[Michael N Q8]

Originally Posted by CharlesN

(Ps. Have you ordered your Timegrapher yet ? )

Not yet...still contemplating.

[Michael N Q8]

Originally Posted by saxo3

The spike in amplitude towards the end of the PR is real and not an error.
I have no explanation what causes the effect in the 3235 (and will also not speculate) but can give a representative measurement example below.

Approaching an amplitude of 120 degrees only, the 3235 movement enters a very unstable regime. 120 degrees is still well above my timegrapher limit of min. 80 degrees in amplitude.

This is really puzzling and counter intuitive, the energy is getting less as the spring unwinds, but suddenly near the end it gets a "second wind" and then collapses

[CharlesN]

Originally Posted by Michael N Q8

Not yet...still contemplating.

I’m only teasing you !


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[CharlesN]

Originally Posted by Michael N Q8

This is really puzzling and counter intuitive, the energy is getting less as the spring unwinds, but suddenly near the end it gets a "second wind" and then collapses

Michael,
That sounds exactly like me.
I get my second wind and then after a while also just collapse

I know I love watches and horology in general and I know I have that awful horological disease ... WISitis ... I know I had a heart operation a few months ago but I had no idea I was now clockwork driven.
I will explain all this to my wife ...... Then she will understand me (perhaps).


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[Michael N Q8]

Originally Posted by CharlesN

Michael,
That sounds exactly like me.

Similar to me too, with one exception, as my spring is winding down, my amplitude is not getting its second wind, getting old isnt working out for me...

[CharlesN]

Just a little update
I have my Sub-Date with 3235 movement on my timegrapher now
It has been running for 61 Hours so I expect another 6 hours to go

I have slightly changed my monitoring method by adding one more piece of equipment ...... A camera. Don’t worry, the watch was not touched during this addition so readings are still accurate and undisturbed.

Apart from the hourly recordings I do literally going and looking at the timegrapher I can now also log into my home security camera system and see my timer etc

This is my current setup including the camera (White ‘Blob’).




This is what I see through the camera..




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[PekWatchGuy]

Quite high number in my opinion. Thank you for this poll.

Originally Posted by saxo3

Some thread statistics until now

Duration: 23/01 – 21/04/2021 (88 days)
Posts: 991
Views: 47057
Different contributors: 132

Poll: Does your 32xx movement seem to be 100% ok?
Voters: 512
Yes: 69,1 %
No: 30,9 %

[CharlesN]

I for one am very happy that this thread exists. Unfortunately i joined a little late but have managed to get "Upto Speed" on the topic.
It is interesting and very good to be able to compare my watch which I thought "Might" have a fault but when compared with several others it seems that it is behaving pretty normally.
It is important to remember that the tests here are not "real World" tests as the watch is not touched or moved and in real life it is worn and therefore wound and therfore stays in the very good timekeeping area of checking.
I have not finsihed doing all the tests, just a few more days to go on this 3235 movement, then the comparison between this and the older series has to be drawn.
I do want to thank all the contributors in this thread ... It has been far more technical than normal posts and I have found it fascinating.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by Michael N Q8

This is really puzzling and counter intuitive, the energy is getting less as the spring unwinds, but suddenly near the end it gets a "second wind" and then collapses

It only seems to be against fundamental physics principles (law of conservation of energy) and there is no perpeptuum mobile ... in the 'real world'

Hence, there must be something else.

I will compare with other calibers.

Anyhow, the end-of-PR amplitude has no relevant effect for any user.

[SearChart]

What exactly is the point in measuring accuracy and amplitude when the watch is at the end of the power reserve?

Rate and amplitude tolerance stops after 24hrs. Only a power reserve check is then needed to see if it reaches the 70hrs

[CharlesN]

There is no added value to measuring the PW to the very end other than gaining knowledge.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by SearChart

What exactly is the point in measuring accuracy and amplitude when the watch is best the end of the power reserve?

Rate and amplitude tolerance stops after 24hrs. Only a power reserve check is then needed to see if it reaches the 70hrs

Have to agree Bas but boys with their toys.

[CharlesN]

Originally Posted by padi56

Have to agree Bas but boys with their toys.

Have to disagree Peter

Boys with measuring devices who like to learn and discover otherwise knows as gain knowledge has to be a good thing.

[Andad]

Originally Posted by padi56

Have to agree Bas but boys with their toys.

I hear the one who dies with the most toys wins Peter.

Even if it is of no interest to some I find my TG gives me useful information.

I’m not sure I understand why Rolex has a movement that runs for 73 hours if rate and amplitude tolerance is of no importance after 24 hours?

I expected to take my 41 off on Friday at 4:30 pm after work and wear it again on 7:30am Monday without having to adjust it but this is not the case.

[SearChart]

Originally Posted by padi56

Have to agree Bas but boys with their toys.

I'm not against timegraphers, I just don't see the added value of measuring something that Rolex themselves don't even do.

[SearChart]

Originally Posted by Andad

I hear the one who dies with the most toys wins Peter.

Even if it is of no interest to some I find my TG gives me useful information.

I’m not sure I understand why Rolex has a movement that runs for 73 hours if rate and amplitude tolerance is of no importance after 24 hours?

I expected to take my 41 off on Friday at 4:30 pm after work and wear it again on 7:30am Monday without having to adjust it but this is not the case.

You cannot expect it to run -2/+2 for the full 70 hours.

[CharlesN]

Originally Posted by SearChart

You cannot expect it to run -2/+2 for the full 70 hours.

I can and do.

Rolex have made a BIG noise with publicity showing how the new movements are 70 hours.

They kept quiet about the watch running for that long but loosing the accuracy which is truly remarkable for the first 36 hours.

I am not worried about the loosing of time accuracy in the latter hours of the PR, But It has been abd still is interesting to research this.

The research is in no way finished yet. A lot more can be learnt.

[CharlesN]

Originally Posted by SearChart

I'm not against timegraphers, I just don't see the added value of measuring something that Rolex themselves don't even do.

Then Rolex should not use misleading publicity.

[SearChart]

Originally Posted by CharlesN

Then Rolex should not use misleading publicity.

Nowhere did they state that it would be running at that spec at the end of the power reserve. No watch does.

But please continue collecting useless data. I'm outta here.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by SearChart

Nowhere did they state that it would be running at that spec at the end of the power reserve. No watch does.

But please continue collecting useless data. I'm outta here.

Have to agree Bas but collecting data for data sake is bordering on obsession for obsession data sake.

[CharlesN]

Originally Posted by padi56

Have to agree Bas but collecting data for data sake is bordering on obsession for obsession data sake.

Peter,

I am NOT COLLECTING data.

I am PRODUCING data that can be analysed.

This data goes off to an expert in data analysis.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by CharlesN

Peter,

I am NOT COLLECTING data.

I am PRODUCING data that can be analysed.

This data goes off to an expert in data analysis.

Sorry I would trust Bas a true Rolex watchmaker over any of your so called data analysis whoever they are.

[Fred48]

Just curious, are these readings similar when in other positions, e.g., dial or case up, or just crown up ?

[CharlesN]

Originally Posted by padi56

Sorry I would trust Bas a true Rolex watchmaker over any of your so called data analysis whoever they are.

Peter,

Bas is a watchmaker and of course i trust him as well. He knows his stuff well.

But, You are missing my point.

On Rolex's website as well as published material they state that the newer movements run for 70 hours.
I agree they do indeed which is excellent. I presume we are all in agreement with that.
They also state the +2 /-2 timekeeping comment.
I have found and proved with the data i have produced that this is also true.
Again I think we are all in agreement on that.

What i have found from the data I have produced is that the two statements (70 hours and +/-2) should never appear together as they do.
It looks like the timekeeping of a new movement watch (32xx) is fabulous for the first approximately 36 hours. After that it goes"Off" a bit until the PR stops.

Therfore I think it was just a little misleading.

Trust me , I am NOT slamming Rolex, On the contrary, their level of timekeeping whilst the watch is worn and therefore fully wound is astoundingly good. In my case almost perfect.

I am however interested in the rest of the running hours of a 32xx movement.
the part of leaving your watch over the weekend whilst being at home and only putting it back on when it's Monday work time just seems to be a bit of a cheat somehow. the time can easily be significantly wrong,

[CharlesN]

Originally Posted by Fred48

Just curious, are these readings similar when in other positions, e.g., dial or case up, or just crown up ?

Fred,

Give me a little time and I will post up a graph to show the differences. (It'll probably be after 9Pm UK time.)
I dont know how much you have followed this thread .. I am doing full test no 4 out of 5 (Just finishing 3Up and next is Dial Down).
Each of these tests takes 3 days or 71 hours, Thats from a full wind to Stopped.

[CharlesN]

Finally
Here is the latest sheet of results from the 3Up plane.

Again over 70 hours or PR.




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[CharlesN]

Originally Posted by Fred48

Just curious, are these readings similar when in other positions, e.g., dial or case up, or just crown up ?

Hi again
You question is now on the forum so you can see the remarkable similarities


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[saxo3]

Originally Posted by Andad

I’m not sure I understand why Rolex has a movement that runs for 73 hours if rate and amplitude tolerance is of no importance after 24 hours?
I expected to take my 41 off on Friday at 4:30 pm after work and wear it again on 7:30am Monday without having to adjust it but this is not the case.

Right!

For better understanding, here the data display for Charles' rather new (09/2020) Submariner, tested so far in 4 positions.





As everybody can see this 3235 runs with stunning accuracy until 36 hours and quite well until 48 hours, but beyond 48 hours it starts going off to significant negative rates.

The data graphs also show that excellent timekeeping is found for amplitudes down to 180-200 degrees.

Timekeeping, when picking up a 32xx after a weekend of about 60 hours, will strongly depend (for this specific Submariner) on watch position at rest.

The final power reserve test for DD (dial down) will complete the picture for this new Submariner.

[Andad]

Originally Posted by SearChart

You cannot expect it to run -2/+2 for the full 70 hours.

Hi Bas,

When I take it off on Friday I make sure it is fully wound. It only usually requires a top up.

On Monday morning it would only have been running for about 63 hours.

Should I expect -2/+2 after 63 hours?



Eddie.