I feel bad...I keep going to the AD

[Chadridv]

Originally Posted by Fleetlord

What's the difference between the Tesla playbook and a factory run Panerai, Omega, Breitling, IWC, AP, Brequet, Hublot, Chopard, Piaget and others boutique?

Tesla abandon commission based sales people in their business model. You can schedule a test drive, meet or speak with consultants for free, guilt free "knowledge" and you can literally order your car online. The price is the price, no games, no shtick, and no need to price hunt.

[SemperFi]

Originally Posted by Chadridv

Not sure why some of the comments in this thread rub me the wrong way, but this one is a clear example. Let's break this down.

Of course it's not a museum, in fact in a museum you can't touch anything where as in an AD you are heavily encouraged to try on watches and handle as many watches as your heart desires. You could wear a shirt into an AD that says "no intention of buying" and if they're smart they would still encourage you to try watches on. Obviously it's a business and not a museum but the connection makes no sense.

It's not a waste of their time, unless they're dealing with a disrespectful and deceitful patron who's out to somehow take advantage of others, which is clearly not the case with the OP or most members on TRF.

Ask Rolex corporate if an enthusiast should stop visiting ADs simply because They have no intention of buying and I can 100% guarantee you their answer will be to please please continue visiting ADs.

There's more to sales and marketing than 1 person who goes to an AD to see models, try on watches and ultimately purchase elsewhere. A positive experience in that AD can lead to countless future sales in this day and age. I have friends who would never buy online or take the trusted seller route. When they come to me and ask where to go to purchase, I will tell them which ADs I've had great experiences at.

Lastly, and overall as long as you're not taking advantage of a sales person, being deceitful or pulling a fast one, there should never be a problem with window shopping. It actually plays a huge factor in driving the market for most major industries.

Last anecdote. I don't work in sales, but a few times a year I help my parents with their business which is the sales of museum quality antique and jewelry. I have customers who make the announcement on arrival that they WILL NOT BE PURCHASING ANYTHING, but they love everything and Would love to see a few things. I say of course and that I'd be happy to show them anything. Sometimes I'll work with them for 30-60+ minutes with no sale in sight, they leave and I never see them again. Other times and quite frequently actually, they show back up with a friend who is not looking to buy but not closed off to it. I make a sale, and I'm sure that 99% of that sale is attributed to the first "non buying" customer.

Point is, as a sales person you have to treat everyone the same and work with people as if meeting your number or closing percentage is not the most important thing on earth. To me that's how a great business functions, and actually yes the opposite of a museum which to me was a silly comparison to begin with.

Very well said Chad.

[Chadridv]

Originally Posted by charger

He said he would never buy.

So what's your point? I've said a lot of things in this thread. Some are directly regarding the OP, some are generally speaking about the topic. You asked me if I read the OP, I did, do you have a question for me or comment regarding something I said? If so make your point.

[LuminousMaximus]

http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=354919

Take a look at that and tell me who's calling the Kettle Black...


Fleetlord
"TRF" Member

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Join Date: May 2013
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Posts: 524
David sw the best!!!
Did a F2F Trade with David last weekend and it was PERFECT..

Use without hesitation!!!

Funny all this emotion from a guy who only posted 9 times since he joined...

[997.2]

Originally Posted by LuminousMaximus

http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=354919



Take a look at that and tell me who's calling the Kettle Black...





Fleetlord

"TRF" Member



Fleetlord's Avatar



Join Date: May 2013

Location: Vain

Posts: 524

David sw the best!!!

Did a F2F Trade with David last weekend and it was PERFECT..



Use without hesitation!!!



Funny all this emotion from a guy who only posted 9 times since he joined...

Hahahahaha on the irony.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Fleetlord]

Originally Posted by LuminousMaximus

http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=354919

Take a look at that and tell me who's calling the Kettle Black...


Fleetlord
"TRF" Member

Fleetlord's Avatar

Join Date: May 2013
Location: Vain
Posts: 524
David sw the best!!!
Did a F2F Trade with David last weekend and it was PERFECT..

Use without hesitation!!!

Funny all this emotion from a guy who only posted 9 times since he joined...

Lol...I traded watches I bought from an AD with a TRF and praised him for a good deal..so what? I never said you shouldn't deal with a TRF..just don't usr the AD like you admitted to doing.

Got to admit bro, that's a little weird to stalk me and try to dig up something. Creepy...

Remember you asked if you should wear out another dealer and all I said was no and why.

Hard to believe you're 50yrs old.

[Fleetlord]

Originally Posted by 997.2

Hahahahaha on the irony.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not really. Never said to not buy or deal from TRF. You said you read all of my comments but you clearly didn't comprehend them. That's wasting time if I ever saw it.

[Chadridv]

Originally Posted by Fleetlord

Lol...I traded watches I bought from an AD with a TRF and praised him for a good deal..so what? I never said you shouldn't deal with a TRF..just don't usr the AD like you admitted to doing.

Got to admit bro, that's a little weird to stalk me and try to dig up something. Creepy...

Remember you asked if you should wear out another dealer and all I said was no and why.

Hard to believe you're 50yrs old.

I've not really agreed with Fleetlord this entire thread except for now. It is ironic, yes, but still doesn't really mean that much that he bought outside of an AD.

As far as I can remember reading he never spoke against buying from a trusted seller, he spoke passionately against chronically visiting an AD with zero intention of purchasing. I don't totally agree with where his ethical guidelines cross boundaries but I don't judge him based on the rap sheet above!

Which is a little weird to bring into the conversation too.

[DJ TT 2002]

Wow, this thread took an unexpected turn!!!!
Let me add fuel to the fire.
I have never once felt bad about browsing at an AD. And I never will!!
As stated earlier, I gave them every chance to thrill me with the perfect deal. If it were to be offered, that's why you carry plastic cards that are accepted at retailers
If I didn't get my desire, no harm done.

"That's why it's called Show Business, not Show Friends "

[reno1910]

Originally Posted by superdog

Personally, as a guy that owns a business, dependant in making sales I love when people call just to do some tire kicking.

It gives me the opportunity to make a sale. The more shots on goal I get, the more sales we make.

While I still think the OP should buy one there to make himself feel better, I laugh at the idea that he is wasting their time.

If the sales guy is any good, he will convert the tire kicker into a customer.

If you caught a fish every time, it would be called catching. Instead it's called fishing.

I pay a lot of money in advertising simply to get as many opportunities as possible.

Agreed!

I kicked the tires for a month and bought a used 36mm Explorer. Though I didn't buy the 39mm Explorer from the AD, she sold me a $5K diamond bracelet.

She's building relationships and has a person in mind (or two) for every new and used Rolex that comes into the store.

[LuminousMaximus]

Originally Posted by Fleetlord

Hard to believe you're 50yrs old.

You got me there...I am a Kid at heart...

[Desibaba]

I wonder how it works though with these guys who work at places like Mayors but supply the "Gray" market with watches. They cant offer the same discounts to their walk in customers but will give to the gray market guys. I wonder how they get away with that without getting fired. Or only people in the management/owner level are supplies the gray market. Lol maybe I should leave Lexus and become a watch salesman at Mayors

[T. Ferguson]

Originally Posted by Fleetlord

This is EXACTLY what is happening in most AD's.

When you walk into an AD, you become an "UP". The salesperson is essentially assigned to you until you either buy something or leave...

That's not exactly how it works at my local AD. It is more relationship driven. I "belong" to one particular salesperson so to speak. If I walk in and she is there it doesn't matter who is up, I'm hers. She knows my situation and respects it. She is always happy to see me even though I might be there only to get a peek at this year's release and not in buying mode. She also knows I'm a savvy customer but I will give her a shot at any purchase I intend to make.

One other point. While she may figure her chance at competing for my business is low, she knows I WILL be buying another Rolex at some point. Probably not something you can say about most of the customers that walk into a Rolex shop, who I'd venture never do purchase a Rolex.

Frankly, while I understand the business model you are talking about, it probably works better in a high traffic situation. IMHO it is a crappy way to run a Rolex AD. These things are expensive and probably only a few walk in cold and leave with a watch on the first visit. Playing the "up" game that you speak of tends to result in poor customer service for the customers who take more than one visit before buying.

Too bad GMT Master hasn't been around much lately. I'd love to hear his take on this. Maybe I'll do some searching. He's probably talked about this at some point on here.

[LuminousMaximus]

Originally Posted by Fleetlord

Hard to believe you're 50yrs old.

That sounds like a personal attack... I refrained from doing that...

And, I even tried to make it a fun thing...Ever hear of fun??

[Wcdhtwn]

Originally Posted by Desibaba

I wonder how it works though with these guys who work at places like Mayors but supply the "Gray" market with watches. They cant offer the same discounts to their walk in customers but will give to the gray market guys. I wonder how they get away with that without getting fired. Or only people in the management/owner level are supplies the gray market. Lol maybe I should leave Lexus and become a watch salesman at Mayors

Especially since Lexus is going to sell cars like Saturn. No haggle.

Though I'd guess there's negotiation on any trade in....

[Desibaba]

Originally Posted by Wcdhtwn

Especially since Lexus is going to sell cars like Saturn. No haggle.

Though I'd guess there's negotiation on any trade in....

That model has never worked very well for new cars. Toyota tries to do it with Scion but a good Toyota dealer sells 400 Toyotas a month but they are lucky if they sell 15-20 Scions (before Lexus I was a Toyota salesman). The one fixed price approach works well with used car dealers like CarMax but I doubt it will work for the luxury car buyer. Maybe I should just go and start working for Mercedes or Bmw.....

[Fleetlord]

Originally Posted by LuminousMaximus

That sounds like a personal attack... I refrained from doing that...

And, I even tried to make it a fun thing...Ever hear of fun??

Ok...I apologize if that offended you.

Good luck with the SD4000

[RolexAuthority]

Did the OP also have a diet coke ?

[Joranwb]

Well, don't feel sorry for them. They're making a killing! You can trust me on that one! Just enjoy we you pay them a visit. As long as their products are being appreciated they will sell anyway

[BuddaLun]

Originally Posted by Fleetlord

Why shouldn't there be?

In essence you are saying: "ONLY enter an AD if you are going to spend money." This is ridiculous.

Originally Posted by SeaAndSky

Am I missing something? Why should I have a negative attitude towards ADs? I'm glad I bought my watch at a family owned business. As I get closer to buying my second Rolex I'm fairly certain King's Jewelers will get my business again. I gladly pay more to support local brick and mortar stores.

You shouldn't have a negative attitude, that's my point.

[jonnyz1245]

Originally Posted by Fleetlord

This is EXACTLY what is happening in most AD's.

When you walk into an AD, you become an "UP". The salesperson is essentially assigned to you until you either buy something or leave.

The salesperson has to wait another rotation to have an opportunity to sell again.

It might not happen again the entire day....so being a tire kicker with no intention of buying is a COMPLETE waste of someone's time.

If you want to buy from a TRF, buy it.



If you don't like it after you buy it..sell it yourself. That's the "cost" of the lower price....the hassle.

Stop playing games with peoples time.

Not if the AD only has one or two salespeople. Maybe one is the owner. Maybe you are the only person in the store for an hour? Yes, it happens.

I have gone into AD's before and said to the first person who walked up to me that on that day i am just browsing and have no intention of buying a watch. They still show me as many pieces as I want.If you are transparent, there is absolutely nothing wrong with browsing or trying on a watch or two. If you like one, let them earn your business. If you can't agree on a sales price, well, that's life. It happens every day.

I see this as a situational thing for which there are a good many variables. You apparently don't. They are selling a high margin item and if AD A can't match AD' B's price, that's the cost of doing business.

I do agree that going in with no intention of ever buying is not cool and should be stated up front.

[antbkny]

If it doesn't feel right in your gut, stop doing it.

[MCO1]

This has been an interesting thread to read, many perspectives. I freely admit I tend to window shop more than I should, probably why I know every AD within reasonable driving distance that way I don't hit any of them too often. Though the one in my town I hit more than I should especially when the fever is running rampant. That being said, I am passionate about watches and Rolex's in particular as most of us here are so when I need a fix I need a fix.

[Fleetlord]

Originally Posted by jonnyz1245

Not if the AD only has one or two salespeople. Maybe one is the owner. Maybe you are the only person in the store for an hour? Yes, it happens.

I have gone into AD's before and said to the first person who walked up to me that on that day i am just browsing and have no intention of buying a watch. They still show me as many pieces as I want.If you are transparent, there is absolutely nothing wrong with browsing or trying on a watch or two. If you like one, let them earn your business. If you can't agree on a sales price, well, that's life. It happens every day.

I see this as a situational thing for which there are a good many variables. You apparently don't. They are selling a high margin item and if AD A can't match AD' B's price, that's the cost of doing business.

I do agree that going in with no intention of ever buying is not cool and should be stated up front.

All dealers I go to are bigger and the owner is a corporate entity so they won't be there.

I agree it would be cooler if you stated your intentions up front.

[jonnyz1245]

Originally Posted by Fleetlord

What's the difference between the Tesla playbook and a factory run Panerai, Omega, Breitling, IWC, AP, Brequet, Hublot, Chopard, Piaget and others boutique?

Simple, the company owned boutiques will negotiate on price. Tesla will not to my knowledge. The price is the price.

I was in Vegas at the company owned IWC boutique 3 weeks after they opened, and the lady offered "we are a Richmont owned store they would not discount a nickel" I wasn't buying a watch and she knew that but they offered that info. Next time I went in which was 6 months later, they offered me 15% off a Portuguese.. Both times I was in there I was completely upfront that I was browsing and not in the market. I had my Big Pilot on. The salesperson was awesome and told me I could try on as many watches as i wanted, gave me his card, and said when I was ready to purchase down the road, to give him a call. That's how sales works.

I travel alot and stop into watch stores when i can all over the world and the US. I am always up front about whether just looking or in the market. I have had a PAM boutique, IWC boutique, JLC Boutique, Omega etc etc ALL offer discounts on watches.

The Breitling boutiques will give you 20- 30% off when you set foot in the door of most of them....

High margin items have always been negotiable. If you're paying list, well, that's your problem, not mine. Granted , not every dealer will discount. But every one that will not, there are 25 that will. Why would I pay 12K for something when i can pay 9K for it? If all of them charged 12K for it, I would pay 12K. Obviously that isn't the case.

Supply and demand.

[jonnyz1245]

Originally Posted by Fleetlord

All dealers I go to are bigger and the owner is a corporate entity so they won't be there.

I agree it would be cooler if you stated your intentions up front.

Agreed. The OP didn't state and is having a guilty mind because of it, and that is wrong IMO. We should all be upfront with our intentions. I am in sales and tell people that. I let them make the choice to spend their time with me or not. I am never offended if they can't, I would rather them help a customer that is going to buy something than me.

[Fleetlord]

Originally Posted by jonnyz1245

Agreed. The OP didn't state and is having a guilty mind because of it, and that is wrong IMO. We should all be upfront with our intentions. I am in sales and tell people that. I let them make the choice to spend their time with me or not. I am never offended if they can't, I would rather them help a customer that is going to buy something than me.

I think that is a very fair approach. It shows respect for the staff and allows them to help other customers who may be in a buying position.

[porschedude]

Originally Posted by zama

If they give you good service then maybe you should try buying from them.

This

[Desibaba]

Originally Posted by Fleetlord

I think that is a very fair approach. It shows respect for the staff and allows them to help other customers who may be in a buying position.

In every sales job I have ever done you cant STOP helping or dump a customer until they either leave or buy. So even if you say "I'm not buying today" they are stuck with you until you leave. You cant "Double Dip" so to speak. It was the same when I sold TVs at Circuit City and its the same now in the car business. I wonder if there are any ADs that simply pay their sales associates hourly like Best Buy and Apple do. That way you never feel guilty about taking up their time. I don't understand why Rolex has this no haggle price rule. All it does is it fuels the gray market which they know exists. Mercedes or BMW don't restrict their dealers from offering discounts and last I checked they aren't going out of business...

[Fleetlord]

Originally Posted by Desibaba

In every sales job I have ever done you cant STOP helping or dump a customer until they either leave or buy. So even if you say "I'm not buying today" they are stuck with you until you leave. You cant "Double Dip" so to speak. It was the same when I sold TVs at Circuit City and its the same now in the car business. I wonder if there are any ADs that simply pay their sales associates hourly like Best Buy and Apple do. That way you never feel guilty about taking up their time. I don't understand why Rolex has this no haggle price rule. All it does is it fuels the gray market which they know exists. Mercedes or BMW don't restrict their dealers from offering discounts and last I checked they aren't going out of business...

That does suck....and that's why I have strong opinions regarding this topic. But I'm supposedly some kind of a douche, so take that for what's it worth...:)