Do you think the daytonas' had it's day???

[Veritas07]

Originally Posted by improviz

I'm sorry, but this is nothing more than pure conjecture. You can't possibly know the motivations of "many" of the people who purchased this watch. I bought mine because I think that it's the nicest looking sports watch they make, and judging by the enthusiasm of owners on here, so did "most' of us.



You keep tossing this "widely available" and "at discount" stuff out there as though it's an established fact, and again, I beg to differ. DavidSW et al will throw a BNIB one on the FS forum, and normally it's snapped up within days, at list price or a few hundred dollars below it--a far cry from the $1000 plus discounts they give on the other SS models they sell, a discount which constitutes a much higher percentage of the lower-priced models in question.

So, riddle me this: if the watch has suddenly become "commonplace" and "easy to get at a discount", then why are they being snapped up here at a 2% discount, when for example in the FS forum the typical selling price for a BNIB SS Sub is more like 20% plus off?

Why are swissluxury.com and alanfurman.com still selling them for $1000 over MSRP if they're so easy to get, when they sell SS Subs at 17.5% off MSRP, and the SS GMT IIc at 12% off?

Why is it that none of the ADs in my area have any SS Daytonas in stock?

Further, even in the middle of the biggest economic downturn in well over 50 years, which in case you haven't noticed has had a detrimental effect upon the sale of *all* things luxury, used they are selling at 85-90+% of current MSRP, and this includes older models which sold at the lower MSRP, i.e. they're being sold at a profit. This cannot be said of ANY other recently-made SS (or TT, or 18K) model Rolex. Sub dates, listing out at $6000, sell used in the low to mid $4K range, nearly 30% off of MSRP, yet I've seen *one* SS Daytona selling for this level of discount, and that was lacking box/papers and was snapped up within hours.

Reports of the death of the Daytona are *greatly* exaggerated. If you don't like the watch, that's fine, but it's kind of getting tiresome to see you peeing on our collective birthday cakes every chance you get.

Nicely done! I could not agree more.
Daytona is still in demand but there are less people who can afford one for obvious reasons.
I just sold one (black dial) to the GRAY DEALER for the same price I'm selling them here-go figure... Do you thing 10k is to much for SS Daytona? How about 25k for SS Patek?
It is all irrelevant.
I know that lots of people are "whining" about price increase and all that but please keep in mind Rolex is not for everyone.... Even thought anybody with credit card can get one.
Just remember: Crown for every achievement…



Bob

[improviz]

Thanks, Bob!

Shoot, I just saw a new-style VC Overseas Chrono in SS, which lists for something like $17K, go for $6K the other day at a pre-owned dealer(!!!), who also had three SS Daytons listed, all used, all selling for $9800. As I said, reports of the death of the Daytona are greatly exaggerated!

[criggs19]

improviz,

don't get so worked up about it, it's just a watch. And I agree, they are easy to find right now. Heck, there are 4-6 in the sale forums right now and I can send an e-mail and have a brand new one with my name on the warranty at my door tomorrow if I wanted one. There over 600 up for auction on eBay and many have sold lately for prices like $6600, $9000, $8750, etc... They just ain't that special anymore.

Chris

[mb hawaii]

Originally Posted by criggs19

There over 600 up for auction on eBay and many have sold lately for prices like $6600, $9000, $8750, etc... They just ain't that special anymore.

Chris

Hmmm.....just did a search and found only 173 up for auction on eBay and over half of the 173 up for auction is for a TT. The cheapest used SS Daytona listed is $8300 for a 2005 "D" serial. Not bad for a 4 year old watch.

I do have to agree when you say that they ain't so special anymore as in there are slightly less demand. In that case a lot of other Rolex models seems to be less "special" these days (among thousands of other luxury items). However to answer the OP's question I think that's hardly means the Daytona "had its" day.

Just IMHO.

[criggs19]

Well then you are searching a different eBay than I. I come up with 609.

[mb hawaii]

Originally Posted by criggs19

Well then you are searching a different eBay than I. I come up with 609.

Yes, your right if searching for all Daytona's including hats, end links, brochures, dials, etc, etc. After reading all posts I believe everyone is referring to the SS's premium.


Regardless, it seems anyone who owns one or wants one thinks the Daytona is still great and anyone who don't own one and never planned to own one seems to think it's over rated. Gee that's a suprise

[improviz]

Originally Posted by mb hawaii

Hmmm.....just did a search and found only 173 up for auction on eBay and over half of the 173 up for auction is for a TT. The cheapest used SS Daytona listed is $8300 for a 2005 "D" serial. Not bad for a 4 year old watch.

Yes, particularly when you consider that its MSRP was, at that time, $6975. So, the poor soul who purchased that watch can "only" sell it for a 20% profit after wearing it for five years.

As to what's for sale in our forum:
Here's a Z serial (2006-ish) used for $8495, which had a brand-new MSRP of $7900:
http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=89520

Here's an F serial, original MSRP of $6500-ish, selling for $8900, a 50% profit:
http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=91921

Here's a BNIB one selling at MSRP:
http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=90247

Here's one DavidSW sold, BNIB, for $9750 (current MSRP = $9925):
http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=90980

And so forth...if the bottom had totally fallen out of the SS Daytona market, I'm at a loss to see how they're selling at MSRP when other SS Rolex sport models can be had at substantial discounts BNIB, like this brand new Sub for example:
http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=88666

As to grey market: here's Paul F Duggan's page, with three used SS Daytonas selling for the *current* MSRP:
http://www.pduggan.com/cart/fine_watches.php

Note that they list as SOLD a Vacheron Constantin SS Overseas Chrono, which has an MSRP of almost double the SS Daytona's ($17K or so), for $6000...

This place has a used one selling at current MSRP of $9800:
http://www.preownedrolex.com/images/...orts_rolex.htm

..and on and on, already provided links in my previous post to both Swissluxury and Alan Furman, showing that they're still selling at above MSRP ($1000 above, specifically).

So, basically you either have to accept that these dealers know their market and what prices that market will bear, or else argue that they're all stark raving mad and are pricing this particular watch, whose "time has passed", at ridiculous levels, kind of doubtful given that in present market conditions, overpriced items tend to get marked down if they're not selling.

Originally Posted by mb hawaii

I do have to agree when you say that they ain't so special anymore as in there are slightly less demand. In that case a lot of other Rolex models seems to be less "special" these days (among thousands of other luxury items). However to answer the OP's question I think that's hardly means the Daytona "had its" day.

Just IMHO.

Exactly. Locally, just a few years ago, none of the BMW dealers would come down from MSRP one penny. Now, that has changed. Why would anyone expect watches to be any different? Point is that, while demand for the watch has clearly dropped off somewhat, it is still very much an in-demand watch given the price levels it will command vs. what other SS Rolexes are selling for, new or used.

[improviz]

Originally Posted by criggs19

Well then you are searching a different eBay than I. I come up with 609.

How much are Omega Planet Oceans selling for on Ebay?

[Veritas07]

Guys,

I read the entire tread and I will leave you with this:

Once you own ONE, you will understand.....



Bob

[WatchSnob]

No way! The Daytona is still a great piece, the economy and market is just horrid right now. It is hard to sell anything. I never wanted a Daytona before as it did not have a date, now having the PAM 236 I realize it is very hard to pull of a date on a chrono without the date getting lost in the dial. The only Chrono I really crave that has a date and is a higher end piece would be the AP ROO for certain.

[train-time]

There are 638 Rolex Daytona related items listed on eBay right now, 102 are SS Daytonas including Zeniths. New ones are generally listed consideralby over MSRP. I believe we are talking about the SS Daytona in this thread. If you want to pay $1000 or $2000 over list, go to eBay!

[mb hawaii]

Originally Posted by train-time

There are 638 Rolex Daytona related items listed on eBay right now, 102 are SS Daytonas including Zeniths. New ones are generally listed consideralby over MSRP. I believe we are talking about the SS Daytona in this thread. If you want to pay $1000 or $2000 over list, go to eBay!

Lol, you took the time to count each SS listing. I was too lazy to do that

[criggs19]

Originally Posted by improviz

How much are Omega Planet Oceans selling for on Ebay?

For a lot less and it's a much nicer looking watch.

[Watchdog]

Originally Posted by improviz

I'm sorry, but this is nothing more than pure conjecture. You can't possibly know the motivations of "many" of the people who purchased this watch. I bought mine because I think that it's the nicest looking sports watch they make, and judging by the enthusiasm of owners on here, so did "most' of us.



You keep tossing this "widely available" and "at discount" stuff out there as though it's an established fact, and again, I beg to differ. DavidSW et al will throw a BNIB one on the FS forum, and normally it's snapped up within days, at list price or a few hundred dollars below it--a far cry from the $1000 plus discounts they give on the other SS models they sell, a discount which constitutes a much higher percentage of the lower-priced models in question.

So, riddle me this: if the watch has suddenly become "commonplace" and "easy to get at a discount", then why are they being snapped up here at a 2% discount, when for example in the FS forum the typical selling price for a BNIB SS Sub is more like 20% plus off?

Why are swissluxury.com and alanfurman.com still selling them for $1000 over MSRP if they're so easy to get, when they sell SS Subs at 17.5% off MSRP, and the SS GMT IIc at 12% off?

Why is it that none of the ADs in my area have any SS Daytonas in stock?

Further, even in the middle of the biggest economic downturn in well over 50 years, which in case you haven't noticed has had a detrimental effect upon the sale of *all* things luxury, used they are selling at 85-90+% of current MSRP, and this includes older models which sold at the lower MSRP, i.e. they're being sold at a profit. This cannot be said of ANY other recently-made SS (or TT, or 18K) model Rolex. Sub dates, listing out at $6000, sell used in the low to mid $4K range, nearly 30% off of MSRP, yet I've seen *one* SS Daytona selling for this level of discount, and that was lacking box/papers and was snapped up within hours.

Reports of the death of the Daytona are *greatly* exaggerated. If you don't like the watch, that's fine, but it's kind of getting tiresome to see you peeing on our collective birthday cakes every chance you get.

Sorry you are so sensitive about this matter. In this post, I simply gave my opinion and never once criticized the watch itself. I simply stated they were widely available which (according to some but not to all, I understand) in my experience seems true.

You yourself once wrote in another post, "I am a SS Daytona magnet . . . anybody in/near Dallas metro want one? If so, PM me . . . got a line on one and possibly two."

Hmmm This doesn't seem like a watch that is impossible to find.

As for a discount, all I said was that consumers can now get a discount. I never claimed you could get one at 30% off retail.

As for "peeing on your birthday cake" that was never my intention. Glad you love your watch.

[improviz]

Originally Posted by improviz

How much are Omega Planet Oceans selling for on Ebay?

Sour grapes, eh? Well, I got my Planet Ocean Casino Royale (it's my beater watch) from an AD at 20% off MSRP, and this is a "limited edition" watch, so I'm sure the regular ones can be had on Ebay for much less, probably less than 1/3 the cost of the Daytona. I'm also certain that there are no wait lists for them at dealers, and that every Omega dealer in my area that I've visited has plenty of them in stock. Which, of course, brings the ol' glass houses/throwing stones thing to mind...

As to it being a much nicer looking watch, well....I'll just smile and say that's subjective, while on the other hand, which of the two watches has waitlists, sells for full MSRP at ADs and for more than full MSRP at grey market dealers, sells used for greater than its original MSRP, and is worn by more celebrities is NOT subjective.

[improviz]

Originally Posted by kingkongkelley

Sorry you are so sensitive about this matter. In this post, I simply gave my opinion and never once criticized the watch itself. I simply stated they were widely available which (according to some but not to all, I understand) in my experience seems true.

I have noticed that in virtually every thread discussing this matter, you've weighed in with inaccurate info. Perhaps you'd be so kind as to give me the number of some of these multiple ADs you know of where they not only have them in stock, but that I can also purchase a new SS Daytona at a discount?

Originally Posted by kingkongkelley

You yourself once wrote in another post, "I am a SS Daytona magnet . . . anybody in/near Dallas metro want one? If so, PM me . . . got a line on one and possibly two."

That was last year. Both were sold within a day or two, at MSRP (they would NOT discount, even to the "old" MSRP, which is why at least one of the guys I pointed their way backed out), and ya know what? I was at that AD last week, and lo and behold: not a single solitary SS Daytona was in stock. Nor do any of the other local ADs, all of which still have wait lists, interesting in light of your continued claim that they're widely available.

The other thing that I find to be particularly annoying is that you seem hell-bent on portraying this as a softening of the market for this particular watch, ignoring any and all evidence that the economy, and the swiss watch industry as a whole is in a deep slump right now; as this article shows, swiss watch sales in the US were off 43% in Q1 09, which means that demand has fallen off for ALL watches, which means that yes, there is downward pricing pressure on ALL of them.

This, however, does NOT translate into a sudden decision by watch wearers everywhere that the SS Daytona is an undesirable watch, which is what you seem to be constantly trying to argue.

So, I'll anxiously await your list of ADs where I can find them in stock, at a discount. I'm sure that there are many folks on this forum who would love to have such info, so by all means: please share.

Originally Posted by kingkongkelley

Hmmm This doesn't seem like a watch that is impossible to find.

Straw man technique won't work. Neither I nor anyone else here ever said the watch is "impossible to find". I just dispute your continued assertion that they're available brand new at discount, from anywhere, but especially from ADs, or that they're "widely available" at ADs in any case.

Considering that I provided plenty of data to the contrary, it would appear that you're mistaken in this matter.

Originally Posted by kingkongkelley

As for a discount, all I said was that consumers can now get a discount. I never claimed you could get one at 30% off retail.

So please, enlighten me and point me to one of these many ADs where I can pick one up at a discount.

Originally Posted by kingkongkelley

As for "peeing on your birthday cake" that was never my intention. Glad you love your watch.

So am I. Now please present some facts to back up your claim, and I'll be happy to retract my criticism.

[Watchdog]

Improviz:

The first store I called had one in stock. They have a black face Daytona "Up for grabs" as the salesman told me over the phone.

The store is Leeds and Son in Palm Desert California.

The number is 760 340 5249.

Hope it helps you or anyone else who is interested in the watch.

[Watchdog]

Improviz:

I forgot to mention, as for a discount, that will all depend upon your negotiating skills.

[ASH]

IMHO the white dial ss Daytona is the prettiest Rolex ever made.

[improviz]

Originally Posted by kingkongkelley

Improviz:

The first store I called had one in stock. They have a black face Daytona "Up for grabs" as the salesman told me over the phone.

The store is Leeds and Son in Palm Desert California.

The number is 760 340 5249.

Hope it helps you or anyone else who is interested in the watch.

Hmm, so why did you wait until 30 min. after they closed to post this? I'll check on this personally during business hours, and be sure to post back the deep discount they'll give me on the watch, provided they have one.

Originally Posted by kingkongkelley

Improviz:

I forgot to mention, as for a discount, that will all depend upon your negotiating skills.

So, how is it exactly you "know" that they're being sold at discounted prices, then? Is this in the same way that you "know" why those of us who purchased the watch purchased the watch?

Also, care to address the pricing data I provided earler, or the comments from Anastasio or Bob? Ya know, actual data points?

[criggs19]

Originally Posted by improviz

Sour grapes, eh? Well, I got my Planet Ocean Casino Royale (it's my beater watch) from an AD at 20% off MSRP, and this is a "limited edition" watch, so I'm sure the regular ones can be had on Ebay for much less, probably less than 1/3 the cost of the Daytona. I'm also certain that there are no wait lists for them at dealers, and that every Omega dealer in my area that I've visited has plenty of them in stock. Which, of course, brings the ol' glass houses/throwing stones thing to mind...

As to it being a much nicer looking watch, well....I'll just smile and say that's subjective, while on the other hand, which of the two watches has waitlists, sells for full MSRP at ADs and for more than full MSRP at grey market dealers, sells used for greater than its original MSRP, and is worn by more celebrities is NOT subjective.

A beater watch, well I guess I should be in awe of your wealth and regal presence for owning that Daytona. My Planet Ocean is my every day watch too, but I haven't made the splash into pretending that I'm James Bond yet. I wear my Bluesy on days when I am in court or have to wear a suit. On very special occasions I wear my 1965 Patek Philippe, Genève, but being worth triple digits I don't like to leave the house with it very often. So we can all be pretentious if we want to. In my humble opinion, most Rolex owners are more into seen with an expensive watch and Omega owners want a nice every day watch that actually keeps good time and looks good at the same time. I believe that most Omega Chronos look much better than the Daytona.

And several ADs within 100 miles of little Pensacola, Florida have Daytonas as we speak.

[Watchdog]

Improviz:

Obviously, I have hit a nerve. So, in the interest of peace, I concede the SS Daytona is the most desirable watch on the planet, no one can ever find one, and if a lucky soul is fortunate enough to be blessed by one, it costs more than anti-matter.

Best of luck to you. Enjoy the forum.

[improviz]

Originally Posted by criggs19

A beater watch, well I guess I should be in awe of your wealth and regal presence for owning that Daytona. My Planet Ocean is my every day watch too, but I haven't made the splash into pretending that I'm James Bond yet.

Oh, how cute....actually, I liked the strap, which at that time was only available on that watch. But thanks for projecting.

Originally Posted by criggs19

I wear my Bluesy on days when I am in court or have to wear a suit. On very special occasions I wear my 1965 Patek Philippe, Genève, but being worth triple digits I don't like to leave the house with it very often.

Interesting, I had no idea that being a "Special agent with the Florida State Police" paid so well. My congratulations to you, sir...interesting that you've never mentioned your PP here before, but I'll take you at your word. :)

Originally Posted by criggs19

So we can all be pretentious if we want to.

Not to mention rude, insulting, and boorish, but don't let me stop you there...

Originally Posted by criggs19

In my humble opinion,

Humble in the same way the Pope is but a simple preacher...

Originally Posted by criggs19

most Rolex owners are more into seen with an expensive watch

So what shall I take away from the fact that you have sold several Rolexes here, then?

Originally Posted by criggs19

and Omega owners want a nice every day watch that actually keeps good time and looks good at the same time.

Well, what can I say to such a shallow, poorly reasoned, non-humble non-argument, other than to point out that in terms of mind reading, you're right up there with kingkongkelly....I, personally, would never be so pretentious as to surmise the reasons, or lack thereof, of a group of people who do, or do not, choose to own a particular brand of watch, but perhaps I lack your gifts of insight and clairvoyance.

Originally Posted by criggs19

I believe that most Omega Chronos look much better than the Daytona.

Well, there you go being subjective again.

Originally Posted by criggs19

And several ADs within 100 miles of little Pensacola, Florida have Daytonas as we speak.

Stainless Daytonas, or Daytonas? Also, perhaps you'd care to be a bit more specific as to which ones have them?

[improviz]

Originally Posted by kingkongkelley

Improviz:

Obviously, I have hit a nerve. So, in the interest of peace, I concede the SS Daytona is the most desirable watch on the planet, no one can ever find one, and if a lucky soul is fortunate enough to be blessed by one, it costs more than anti-matter.

Best of luck to you. Enjoy the forum.

Well, kkk, all I can say is that you're rather long on straw men but short on facts. Have fun with your continued quest to talk down SS Daytonas, it seems as though you lack more constructive things to do.

[Czechman]

Gentlemen, please take this outside.

[Brunotheboxer]

This argument has gone on since I joined this forum. It seems like no one ever wins either.

[Czechman]

All this stuff really accomplishes is to ruin the credibility of the participants.

[mb hawaii]

Originally Posted by kingkongkelley

Sorry you are so sensitive about this matter.

I don't think he's sensitive about it, it's more like passionate. Same as someone passionately defending their Omega watch here when "jabbed" at.

I believe that frustrations have come from many opinions stated as if they were hard facts instead of what they are......opinions. So it's only natural for someone to question that when defending a belief.

Like I stated eariler and if you check the posts, it seems anyone who owns one or wants one thinks the Daytona is still great and anyone who don't own one and never planned to own one seems to think it's over rated. Maybe we can all agree to disagree?

Once again, just my IMHO.

[kcmo]

Originally Posted by mb hawaii

I don't think he's sensitive about it, it's more like passionate. Same as someone passionately defending their Omega watch here when "jabbed" at.

I believe that frustrations have come from many opinions stated as if they were hard facts instead of what they are......opinions. So it's only natural for someone to question that when defending a belief.

Like I stated eariler and if you check the posts, it seems anyone who owns one or wants one thinks the Daytona is still great and anyone who don't own one and never planned to own one seems to think it's over rated. Maybe we can all agree to disagree?

Once again, just my IMHO.

Well said!

[Watchdog]

Originally Posted by mb hawaii

I don't think he's sensitive about it, it's more like passionate. Same as someone passionately defending their Omega watch here when "jabbed" at.

I believe that frustrations have come from many opinions stated as if they were hard facts instead of what they are......opinions. So it's only natural for someone to question that when defending a belief.

Like I stated eariler and if you check the posts, it seems anyone who owns one or wants one thinks the Daytona is still great and anyone who don't own one and never planned to own one seems to think it's over rated. Maybe we can all agree to disagree?

Once again, just my IMHO.

Fair enough, my friend.