Discounts on Patek? Where? How Much?

[Markg]

i am looking to buy a Patek 5146J.

how much can i expect an AD to discount? the prices JUST went up a couple days ago, but of course now i found what i want! with their low production, im not sure when i will find another.

any ideas? i checked furman and they are about 15%, but thats all i found. and i dont know the scarcity of the watches, nor the rules patek places on their ad's.

thanks for any suggestions/information.

mark

[rpryan55]

That's a beautiful watch - and a great buy at the prices I saw. It will go up and up and up in value (but I don't buy watches for investment). The Patek Philippe Company is family owned (by the Sterns) and right now they are on a campaign to stop the gray dealers and discounters - and they can find out who is doing it because, with their low production numbers and the fact that each watch gets an individual serial number, they can determine which A.D.'s are putting their watches into the market at a discounted price. The Sterns are actually buying as many Pateks as they can from gray dealers and they are dropping the A.D.s that those watches came from. They're also putting boutiques into the Tiffany stores to ensure the exclusivity and value of their brand.

All that said, 15% (if you can still get it) is a great deal in this climate. Of course, you may find an A.D. that's on his way out and who would give you a better one, but that's pure luck. I'll be rooting for you to get that beautiful watch, though!

[Jedi]

The 5146 is a nice piece, and a popular complication.

You shouldn't pay more than list for it as Patek frowns on ADs charging premiums.

I was in Bangkok over the weekend and there were no shortages of the 5146 with various dial and case combinations, at LIST.

If you need more info on Patek, let me know.

[Markg]

my local ad has one for about the same price as furman (since the price just went up, he is willing to deal a little more than normal).

i LOVE the look; the only one i like better is about 250k, so that isnt happening....

any info you have would be helpful, as i dont know that much about them other than they look great

[Jedi]

Mark, you can get quite a bit of information on the Patek website on the 5146. It is an annual calendar and is very desirable in terms of collectability. It contains the caliber 315 base movement which is very robust, and is incidentally the caliber to be found in the very desirable sports watch, the Nautilus.

Patek has come out and stated that they frown on their ADs charging premiums, and discounts are also frowned upon, but generally that is up to the AD and 15% is like, WOW. MRSP for that reference now is US34,800.00.

[Jedi]

I can also add that ownership of a Patek entitles you to receive their bi-annual magazine, which is kinda cool.

Some goodies you might want to pressure your AD for are:

- travelling watch pouch with Patek logo
- extra cleaning cloth with Patek logo
- a loupe for viewing the movement through the sapphire caseback

[Terry Newton]

Mark:

$27,840 is the price for this brand new one at Feel Good Watches:

http://www.feelgoodwatches.com/produ...oducts_id/2123

The list is $34,800 and with a 15% discount brings it to $29,580. So this one at Feel Good will make you Feel Good.

Nice watch.

Terry Newton

[Markg]

thanks terry;

so its about a $2k penalty to buy from a local AD...

[Jedi]

Buy from an AD. Unless you're intending to flip, later on down the track when it comes to servicing etc. you might encounter issues from Patek themselves. Regardless, if you buy from a grey dealer or online, be careful and if you do get the watch, then register it with Patek online.

[Markg]

i like the idea of an ad, since i can see the watch before i purchase it.

also this ad seems honest in his information, both good and bad.

[DSJ]

Originally Posted by Markg

thanks terry;

so its about a $2k penalty to buy from a local AD...

It also gives you a "last look" counteroffer to take to your AD. Maybe the AD can match or get closer to where you are both within a range that is mutually acceptable.

[Markg]

Originally Posted by DSJ

It also gives you a "last look" counteroffer to take to your AD. Maybe the AD can match or get closer to where you are both within a range that is mutually acceptable.

good point, although im not sure how much room there is on pateks since they dont make that many.

i was told that some models go for 10-15k over list (like the daytona) so they are kept in the safe and only sold to the best customers (like daytona), but i dont really know much about pateks so dont know which ones they are....(and likely dont care since the only ones i like are the 5146j and a couple that list for $250k; unless someone else hits the lottery and buys it for me, i think my limit is the one)

[Welshwatchman]

That's the exact 5146 that I haggled over in my local AD last Autumn.

It is a beautiful piece!

They wanted £15k which represented a paltry discount of 2.5%. I made them an offer of £14.5k to buy it then and there. They refused the offer and off I went.

In hindsight I was a little relieved as I would have had to flip two Rolex watches to justify the extravagance and I really am not cultured enough to be a Patek owner.

[Markg]

Originally Posted by Welshwatchman

I really am not cultured enough to be a Patek owner.

perhaps if you got the watch.....

but the price tag didnt mention culture....just the price!

and pricewise it isnt much different than a gold rolex...

[Welshwatchman]

Originally Posted by Markg

Pricewise it isnt much different than a gold rolex...

Not at the prices I got my Goldies for.

Having said that the 5146 really does depreciate less than an equivalent Gold Rolex purchased near MRSP and it really is in a different league.

Got me thinking a moment about going back there to see if they've still got it in their safe but MRSP is now £16k+. Much too hot for my liking.

[DSJ]

Originally Posted by Markg

good point, although im not sure how much room there is on pateks since they dont make that many.

i was told that some models go for 10-15k over list (like the daytona) so they are kept in the safe and only sold to the best customers (like daytona), but i dont really know much about pateks so dont know which ones they are....(and likely dont care since the only ones i like are the 5146j and a couple that list for $250k; unless someone else hits the lottery and buys it for me, i think my limit is the one)

No, but you can assume their markup is probably in the typical 35-40% range as it is for most other brands, so you know their margin...

[Markg]

Originally Posted by Welshwatchman

Not at the prices I got my Goldies for.

Having said that the 5146 really does depreciate less than an equivalent Gold Rolex purchased near MRSP and it really is in a different league.

Got me thinking a moment about going back there to see if they've still got it in their safe but MRSP is now £16k+. Much too hot for my liking.

i saw a price of a bit over $20k in 2005; now they are almost $35k; depreciate? almost double in three years!

[Jedi]

The 5146 is a very popular piece and there seems to be a small glut of them in the market at the moment.

MarkG, I've read about your ADs comments in another thread, and I'm sad to say he's probably not the most knowledgeable Patek AD around when he's decribing movements as you've quoted.

[rpryan55]

Originally Posted by Markg

thanks terry;

so its about a $2k penalty to buy from a local AD...

I wouldn't buy a Patek from a gray dealer - only AD's can properly register them with Patek now and assure your warranty holds firm. But that's just me - to each his own.

[Markg]

Originally Posted by rpryan55

I wouldn't buy a Patek from a gray dealer - only AD's can properly register them with Patek now and assure your warranty holds firm. But that's just me - to each his own.

good point; on rolex, i have never had a warranty issue, so even though i bought them all at ADs, it was "insurance" that didnt pay off.

how reliable are the pateks? should i be more concerned?

[rpryan55]

Originally Posted by Markg

good point; on rolex, i have never had a warranty issue, so even though i bought them all at ADs, it was "insurance" that didnt pay off.

how reliable are the pateks? should i be more concerned?

One of my Pateks ran a bit slow - and I cannot stand a watch that runs slow. So I had my A.D. ship it back to Geneva and fix it for me - at no cost to me. Had I bought from a gray dealer, I would have been charged.

[Jedi]

Originally Posted by Markg

good point; on rolex, i have never had a warranty issue, so even though i bought them all at ADs, it was "insurance" that didnt pay off.

how reliable are the pateks? should i be more concerned?

Stick with Rolex Mark. I don't think Patek is really for you. Just my opinion. Your 55K would be better spent on stocks or blue chip investments, rather than on a magnificently crafted piece of horological art that isn't meant to be taken swimming or on cross-artic journeys, both of which any Rolex would survive in a heartbeat.

A Patek is to be savoured and appreciated. A Rolex is to be worn like a TOOL. Horses for causes like I've said before. Patek movements when in simple form, last for years. When complicated, they are to be appreciated and marveled at.

[Markg]

Originally Posted by Jedi

Stick with Rolex Mark. I don't think Patek is really for you. Just my opinion. Your 55K would be better spent on stocks or blue chip investments, rather than on a magnificently crafted piece of horological art that isn't meant to be taken swimming or on cross-artic journeys, both of which any Rolex would survive in a heartbeat.

A Patek is to be savoured and appreciated. A Rolex is to be worn like a TOOL. Horses for causes like I've said before. Patek movements when in simple form, last for years. When complicated, they are to be appreciated and marveled at.

ok, so if i can boil this down so i understand (since it seems they arent for me....)

rolex is like a good wife that will last a long time and can be taken anywhere,
patek is like a temperamental girl friend who will be lusted after but is just too complicated and fussy for every day use...?

[DSJ]

Originally Posted by Markg

ok, so if i can boil this down so i understand (since it seems they arent for me....)

rolex is like a good wife that will last a long time and can be taken anywhere,
patek is like a temperamental girl friend who will be lusted after but is just too complicated and fussy for every day use...?

Sounds about right, but when you're with your girlfriend, you'll think it's worth it!

[Jedi]

Nice one David, but what I meant is more along the lines of:

Rolex is a good daily companion piece, that's if you like Rolex, and this being TRF, I'm assuming that we all like Rolex.

Pateks are somewhat more refined and should be approached in a manner akin to connoisseurship of a fine whisky or wine. It should be "savoured and appreciated." A lusted after girlfriend will simply provide a momentary burst of pleasure, or several, depending on your patience, but wouldn't last.

The reason I stuck my head out and said it probably isn't for Mark is due to his apparent indecision, which in my experience, might lead to disatisfaction. Having said that, sometimes you don't know till you buy and try. It's a safe bet though, given that you can probably off load the Patek without a loss, but maybe try visiting the AD, close out to the drivel, pick up a loupe and take a good long close look at that Patek. Then maybe you might pick up on the magic if its really for you.

It's an intangible thing, this hobby of ours. Reason has very little part to play in a decision involving thousands of dollars over a 40mm chunk of metal and strips of leather.

[Markg]

Originally Posted by Jedi

and strips of leather.

you must be confusing patek with panerai; patek would never use leather...

[Jedi]

You must be joking right?

Did your AD tell you that?

[Jedi]

Are you sure this is the watch you've been talking about? It's one of many dial variations and metals, but this is in yellow gold, and look.... is that a croc leather strap?? Lined with calf leather mind you... is it?

[Markg]

Originally Posted by Jedi

You must be joking right?

Did your AD tell you that?

they actually use leather? how common....

[Markg]

Originally Posted by Jedi

Are you sure this is the watch you've been talking about? It's one of many dial variations and metals, but this is in yellow gold, and look.... is that a croc leather strap?? Lined with calf leather mind you... is it?

croc strap it is! any leather is hidden from view....
and you say its yellow gold, but it looks white gold to me...