Would you buy a red sub...

[myopiccoog]

Without box and paperers. I am debating. I am leaning no.

[conrail]

I absolutely would.

First, it is long out of warranty so who cares. Second, can you be sure they weren't originally fully blank and punched/filled in by someone long after the fact to make a buck off you? (Check out the threads on this issue on here and VRF). Third, if you limit yourself to only red subs with virtually-certain-to-be-OK-papers, you'll be vastly limiting the pool of nice, available watches at decent prices.

[lhanddds]

yes

[Darlinboy]

I would. Can't wear the box & papers!

And.. Should go for less money.

[Kiwinz]

Not really that important.

[RC2]

Yes from a trusted seller who knows what to look for

[BaltimoreBrian]

when i bought mine, i was looking for the complete package, so i wanted original B&P's. it is about what YOU want. It is also important that you know who you are buying from.

[Pete17]

Of course you should.
A box doesn't make a watch legit.......and these days some examples of punched papers don't either unfortunately.

A RSC service receipt is always a nice bonus to have though.

[john11f]

Originally Posted by baltimorebrian

when i bought mine, i was looking for the complete package, so i wanted original b&p's. It is about what you want. It is also important that you know who you are buying from.

+1

[Frogman4me]

Not a deal breaker at all especially with the loose paper scandal that's been going on. For me condition and originality is far more important and personal research and going through a reputable seller is the key.

[pdoukas]

Just did 3 weeks ago from a trusted seller, and am currently waiting its return from the RSC with my own personalized set of service papers.

Can't wear a box.

Don't need a pamphlet.

Not sure what I'd do with an anchor and no boat.

So yup, I sure would.

[andyboy39]

Originally Posted by pdoukas

just did 3 weeks ago from a trusted seller, and am currently waiting its return from the rsc with my own personalized set of service papers.

Can't wear a box.

Don't need a pamphlet.

Not sure what i'd do with an anchor and no boat.

So yup, i sure would.

+1

[cruvon]

Wouldn't have a problem. However if you are going to then start collecting period correct boxes and accessories for the watch for completeness/collectability sake which sell at a huge premium still, than you might as well go for a full set. Collecting them separately doesn't make the accessories strictly original to the watch but many find that acceptable, fun and challenging to do though I would prefer if they originally came with the watch. For period correct accessories, there is unfortunately no way to tell the difference between those that originally came with the watch and those that didn't since no watch serials are puched on those.

The most important part of a watch's papers to ascertain originality, the warranty paper, can be easily forged by stamping serials on a period correct warranty paper to make it look more original i.e to make it look like it came from the same watch. Though there are a few cues like correct stamping font, aging etc. (which might again be possible to replicate) is almost impossible to detect with certainty whether was done in 1960 or in 2012. So is best you buy a watch either from the first owner or a watch with history that can be tracked and reverified by knowledgeable and trusty sources/sellers, failing which, a recent Rolex RSC warranty paper would be more reassuring!

[nick c]

Yes sir

[Michael M.]

Of course!

[kyle L]

Condition is more important to me than B&P.

[greekbum]

For me personally....When I am buying a vintage 30 plus year old watch I look at the watch as this is what I want. I consider anything else like accessories papers etc a BONUS to this. Its nice to have everything but having searched for these watches for over 20 years I will say that in the USA its not common to find a complete set rare sport model watch. In some countries its the norm as people dont trade as much and usually keep things for life. In the last 7 years or so papers have been created or added to watches to feed the markets demand for papers only buyers by unethical sellers. Do your homework before you buy

[caryyee]

If you've bought it to collect, then yes. If you've bought it to wear no.

A number 1 rule though, it make sure the seller knows vintage and that you can trust them when they say 'original', that everything is in fact 'original' and not replaced parts.

[Jannal]

I've already bought one.

If you're buying to collect / investment then you need to check that the dial, hands, case, caseback etc. are original not service replacement parts. This will affect the resale value. Watch collectors prefer everything original.

If buying the watch for daily wear rather than investment then the above in not important. Just need to make sure that all replacement parts are genuine Rolex parts.

[Kingair]

Of course !

Most of the vintage watches lost their paperwork during the years . . .

If all is correct I don't see any problem . .

Make sure you read some posts here . . .

Last week I posted about a fake Sub . . . and there are arriving more and more . . .

Fake dials, hands, bezels . . .

Good luck


HAGT

[Vincent65]

absolutely - good luck!

[toph]

It would depend on watch and seller but with so many fakes I would be very careful

[high5]

do you really like it? if you do, then look for one with good condition. Post pictures here before buying so people here can help you. Probably a good time to buy price-wise.

[Robbyvm]

the B&P do not justify the premium in my opinion
if you buy as an investment you should try to get a complete set, on the other hand i don't believe in vintage Rolexes as an investment... (except maybe for some exclusive models)
pay a part of the premium to get a nicer Red !!

[Ed!]

Box & Papers mean absolutely nothing to me, have it checked over by a dealer that you know and trust that knows all about the watch you're showing them! It's the only way apart from sending the thing back to Rolex and have them check it/service it then it'll come back with paperwork.

[cdweller]

B&P used to give piece of mind, but that is no longer true with today's printing technology. For piece of mind, buy the seller, and remember that it is the watch that will be on your wrist, not the box or other "accessories". Goodluck on your hunt for a red

[eparisini]

Why not?
If the watch is in good shape I'd buy it every day, better without expensive pounched papers!

[Beelzy]

It's hard enough buying a Red that is original and or correct....let alone adding papers to the quest. IMO

[onkyo]

Absolutely.... most buyers back then discarded the b/p after the warranty period was up.

[lsavoldi]

Definitely yes, especially once that there lots of fake papers around, and you could be paying a premium for something worthless.
the most important advice I have received in the forum s " Buy the seller'