32xx movement problem poll and data thread

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by Easy E

Like I said…..

I generally don’t like to make a point in a vacuum, but to isolate one element let’s try this example. Older cars, using natural motor oil needed an oil change every 3000 miles. Now, with modern synthetics you can go 5000, 7500, even 10,000 in some cases. Same is likely on a micro level, no?

Yes and no.

There is a yawning gulf between what happens inside an ICE and the various functions that motor oil performs in service verses what happens inside a watch case.
Not to mention the viscosities and unique properties.

To that, viscosity and the effects of shearing are one thing and oxidative thickening and acid formation are another.

Probably best not to try and draw any comparisons.


Back to normal programming

[SwissSteph]

Originally Posted by saxo3

Thanks for the update on your Sea-Dweller.

I looked at your Sea-Dweller timegrapher data from January and April 2025 and also at your Explorer II by comparing their isochronism. As a rule of thumb, the best isochronism is when the amplitudes of a mechanical watch decrease and the rates remain stable or almost unchanged.

I plotted the average rate (X-Rate) against the average amplitude (X-Ampl.) and fitted these data, see graph below. The higher the slope 'm', the better the isochronism. In the past, I have found that 32xx watches without caliber issues have good isochronism (high 'm' values).

I conclude as follows:

Your Explorer II is very good, it shows high amplitudes, good isochronism, and the accuracy remains good along the power reserve.

Your Sea-Dweller improved a bit during its 3 months resting time. You see that the isochronism became slightly better. The average amplitude and rate, measured in April 2025, is better until 36 hours compared to the 01/2025 measurements. The change is not dramatic.

In January, I did not reveal the reason for this simple test: It was to measure whether the caliber 3235's performance (amplitudes) remained unchanged, decreased or increased.

Now, it would be interesting to test what happens to the amplitudes and rates if you wear this Sea-Dweller for a few weeks or months and then measure again. I think it is too early for a RSC repair.

Thank you very much for your clear and precise analysis. I was ready to prepare screenshots of my graphs to include with my complaint to Rolex's parent company. So I'm going to "sit back" a little longer before accessing the building's ticket office.

Based on my latest readings, I thought things were really bad. You've given me some hope, thank you.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by SwissSteph

Thank you very much for your clear and precise analysis. I was ready to prepare screenshots of my graphs to include with my complaint to Rolex's parent company. So I'm going to "sit back" a little longer before accessing the building's ticket office.

Based on my latest readings, I thought things were really bad. You've given me some hope, thank you.

Your newest Sea-Dweller data posted in #5698 are not outside the Rolex acceptance criteria of the famous -2/+2 sec/day and no amplitude value is lower than 200° after 24 hours, but all 3 vertical amplitudes are (very) close to 200°.

What I don't understand is why your Explorer II bought in 08/2024 is so much better than your Sea-Dweller bought a month later (09/2024). This time the more complicated 3285 is better than a 3235.

Why is the 32xx performance difference so great for watches sold in 2024?

I cannot explain this with one bad sample out of many many sold watches. The low amplitude problem does not seem to be under control on new watches, the situation may be better on serviced 32xx calibers.

[SwissSteph]

OK, I'll wear my "SD" and see over time what happens and if I need to bring it in for warranty service. Thanks again for your analysis and sharing your knowledge.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by SwissSteph

OK, I'll wear my "SD" and see over time what happens and if I need to bring it in for warranty service. Thanks again for your analysis and sharing your knowledge.

Whatever watch you wear, keep this movement running!

[SwissSteph]

Yes, one on me and the other in a https://swisskubik.com/

[FTX I]

This is one of the most informative threads I've ever seen on TRF.

[TheVTCGuy]

OK, here is a question for you techies… With my 3235, I consistently see it within the +- two seconds a day WHEN I WEAR IT. I.E. When my 126619B is on the winder (a Wolf) for several days I have found it falls out of tolerance. Yesterday, I took it off after five days on the winder and it was (approximately) 40 seconds slow. Yet, when I wear it and check it regularly it is very-very accurate. Could there be something wrong with my winder? Has anyone done any studies with winder accuracy versus daily wearing?

[CharlesN]

Originally Posted by TheVTCGuy

OK, here is a question

Paul,

GOOD QUESTION !

Hopefully …

Here is an answer ...

I also have found that a watch on a winder keeps different time to being on the wrist.

I think the reason is possibly that a winder seems to have the watch in one plane or another for a set and similar amount of time.

In real life wearing different positions are occurring all the time you are moving (Or even sitting).

Form example 12H is not measured on most watch brands because it is so rare for the watch to be worn in that position.

A machine just does NOT simulate a human wearing and winding. It certainly does not take into account “Couch Potato TV watching Time”.

The winder is solely to stop the watch from running down. Thats very useful for watches such as perpetual calendars or even moon phase watches..

[AggiePhil]

Very interesting stuff! Thanks to all who posted. Now I have to decide if I want my first Rolex to be a new Submariner (I'm on a few lists) or if I should go with a different brand and hold off on Rolex for a few years. Ugh...

[1William]

Originally Posted by AggiePhil

Very interesting stuff! Thanks to all who posted. Now I have to decide if I want my first Rolex to be a new Submariner (I'm on a few lists) or if I should go with a different brand and hold off on Rolex for a few years. Ugh...

Welcome. The Submariner is the one and why wait? If the AD's can't give you a definitive answer on arrival just look at our Trusted Sellers and find the watch you want. I would go slightly pre-owned and complete. The prices have adjusted and by the time you add in tax from the AD you should be close. Good luck and let us know what you decide.

[Easy E]

Somewhat overdue, somewhat lacking in fullness, but this still shows the state of affairs with my BLNR. I bought this new from an AD July 2019. Going on 6 years old and I am still experiencing +1.44spd at 24hrs. I consider this excellent. This watch is most curious to me. As demonstrated, it runs very well. The problem is I cannot reconcile this watch to the many that I have owned that have been out of spec, some egregiously so - 10 watches, I believe is the count of out of spec watches I have owned. This one works.


I have read posts in which other members have questioned why someone would buy more 32s if they have had so many bad examples. This watch is the reason I have continued to look for another comparable piece. I just, personally, have not found it.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by Easy E

Somewhat overdue, somewhat lacking in fullness, but this still shows the state of affairs with my BLNR. I bought this new from an AD July 2019. Going on 6 years old and I am still experiencing +1.44spd at 24hrs. I consider this excellent. This watch is most curious to me. As demonstrated, it runs very well. The problem is I cannot reconcile this watch to the many that I have owned that have been out of spec, some egregiously so - 10 watches, I believe is the count of out of spec watches I have owned. This one works.


I have read posts in which other members have questioned why someone would buy more 32s if they have had so many bad examples. This watch is the reason I have continued to look for another comparable piece. I just, personally, have not found it.

Thanks for the update on your BLNR.

In total you bought 12 watches with 32xx movements and posted all your timegrapher data in this special thread. I have collected and analysed all your numbers. This is by far the largest 32xx statistic this forum has seen, based on numbers or facts!

10 of these 12 watches had the known 32xx amplitude problems within the warranty period, some of them right out of the box. This 2019 BLNR is the only good one, the second watch was your 2018 BLRO which was very close to the amplitude specifications after 4.5 years, then you sold it.

Statistically, this is very interesting because it allows to calculate the probabilty (P) of buying 10 defective 32xx watches in a row, assuming one free parameter: an assumed (not proven) defect rate (DR) for 32xx calibers delivered by Rolex Geneva.

Below are calculated figures for a set of assumed defect rates (DR) that result in different probabilities (P) of buying 10 defective 32xx watches:

DR = 0.1 % - P = 1E-28 %
DR = 1 % - P = 1E-18 %
DR = 3 % - P = 5.9E-14 %
DR = 10 % - P = 1E-8 %
DR = 30 % - P = 5.9E-4 %
DR = 50 % - P = 0.098 %
DR = 70 % - P = 2.8 %
DR = 80 % - P = 10.7 %
DR = 90 % - P = 34.9 %
DR = 95 % - P = 59.9 %
DR = 99 % - P = 90.4 %

Conclusion: one needs a 32xx defect rate of 70 % to have a 2.8 % chance of buying 10 defect 32xx watches (out of a total of 12).

This simple calculation suggests that the 32xx defect rate for new watches, bought between 2015 and 2024, was very high. No one can know what the situation in 2025 will be, except that this topic will continue to be discussed controversaly.

[TheVTCGuy]

Saxo, I completely agree with your calculations ( I kind of have to because I’m not smart enough to understand them, I tried, but my head exploded ). Here, I am adding my own story to this thread:

My 126619B is two years and six weeks old. I check the accuracy more often then a rational person should, and have always found it spot on… until recently. A few weeks ago I started noticing it was losing time. I tried to chalk it up to the usual variables, on my wrist, on a winder, humidity, activity while wearing, position etc. But it just kept getting worse. Right now it is running EIGHT seconds slow PER DAY. I didn’t keep a record but can confidently say it is progressively getting worse, just in the last few weeks. I spoke with the AD I bought it from and they said they will send it in to NY RSC. (And I will be without it for two to three months )

I have looked through the thread and there are a lot of references to people sending their watch in with a similar experience, the RSC over-hauling (or whatever) and it comes back in specs. Did you guys ever discover what they actually DO to repair it? Is it a lifetime fix? I think I saw a couple instances where even after the service, the issue returns(?).

I almost feel like my puppy is sick, and I am sending it for a surgery to the Vet…

[Easy E]

Paul, I’m sorry to hear this. All I can give you is my experience. I have sent two in for service. Both instances the service ticket just stated “movement check” (maybe function check). Both came back right at 4 weeks. Both sent to NYLI.

There have been several reports of pieces going back more than once, but to my recollection those reports are a bit dated.

Maybe other can offer more current state of affairs.

[TheVTCGuy]

Originally Posted by Easy E

Paul, I’m sorry to hear this. All I can give you is my experience. I have sent two in for service. Both instances the service ticket just stated “movement check” (maybe function check). Both came back right at 4 weeks. Both sent to NYLI.

There have been several reports of pieces going back more than once, but to my recollection those reports are a bit dated.

Maybe other can offer more current state of affairs.

Thanks, I am glad to hear this and happy they are working for you now I heard RUMORS that they would switch out a part, but I don’t know if that was ever confirmed.

[theshrike]

Supposedly two parts are changed at service - maybe the pallet fork is one of them. This is based off what someone reported in a French language forum I frequent, and maybe corroborates with what the poster via reggio said a few posts ago. I have 0 proof for this, just hearsay.

[Easy E]

Originally Posted by TheVTCGuy

Thanks, I am glad to hear this and happy they are working for you now I heard RUMORS that they would switch out a part, but I don’t know if that was ever confirmed.

To be clear, I traded them out after service. I am down to one 32. I traded my 126619 for an 11 Smurf. Traded the DD for….something… can’t recall. `

[tman9999]

Originally Posted by TheVTCGuy

OK, here is a question for you techies… With my 3235, I consistently see it within the +- two seconds a day WHEN I WEAR IT. I.E. When my 126619B is on the winder (a Wolf) for several days I have found it falls out of tolerance. Yesterday, I took it off after five days on the winder and it was (approximately) 40 seconds slow. Yet, when I wear it and check it regularly it is very-very accurate. Could there be something wrong with my winder? Has anyone done any studies with winder accuracy versus daily wearing?

What are your winder settings? How many turns per day? Bi-directional or one direction only?

[Andad]

[QUOTE=TheVTCGuy;13627088]Thanks, I am glad to hear this and happy they are working for you now I heard RUMORS that they would switch out

Paul,

Google 3235 Rolex movement problems.

Example.

AI Overview:

Rolex Caliber 3235 Watch Movement.
The Rolex Caliber 3235 movement, while generally reliable, has been reported to have a specific issue: low amplitude.
Some users have reported this issue recurring even after servicing, and some watchmakers have suggested it may be a widespread problem affecting all 3235 movements.
Rolex has not officially commented on the issue, but there's speculation that they might be working on a fix.

Elaboration:

Low Amplitude:
This refers to a problem where the balance wheel, a crucial part of the movement responsible for regulating time, is not swinging properly.

Recurring Issue:
Some users have reported the low amplitude problem returning even after the watch has been serviced by official Rolex service centers.

Industry Speculation:
A watchmaker claiming to be Rolex-certified has suggested that this problem is becoming increasingly common and potentially affects all 3235 movements.

No Official Comment:
Neither Rolex nor authorized dealers have officially commented on this issue, though there's hope that they are working on a fix.

[douglasf13]

Originally Posted by saxo3

Thanks for the update on your BLNR.

In total you bought 12 watches with 32xx movements and posted all your timegrapher data in this special thread. I have collected and analysed all your numbers. This is by far the largest 32xx statistic this forum has seen, based on numbers or facts!

10 of these 12 watches had the known 32xx amplitude problems within the warranty period, some of them right out of the box. This 2019 BLNR is the only good one, the second watch was your 2018 BLRO which was very close to the amplitude specifications after 4.5 years, then you sold it.

Statistically, this is very interesting because it allows to calculate the probabilty (P) of buying 10 defective 32xx watches in a row, assuming one free parameter: an assumed (not proven) defect rate (DR) for 32xx calibers delivered by Rolex Geneva.

Below are calculated figures for a set of assumed defect rates (DR) that result in different probabilities (P) of buying 10 defective 32xx watches:

DR = 0.1 % - P = 1E-28 %
DR = 1 % - P = 1E-18 %
DR = 3 % - P = 5.9E-14 %
DR = 10 % - P = 1E-8 %
DR = 30 % - P = 5.9E-4 %
DR = 50 % - P = 0.098 %
DR = 70 % - P = 2.8 %
DR = 80 % - P = 10.7 %
DR = 90 % - P = 34.9 %
DR = 95 % - P = 59.9 %
DR = 99 % - P = 90.4 %

Conclusion: one needs a 32xx defect rate of 70 % to have a 2.8 % chance of buying 10 defect 32xx watches (out of a total of 12).

This simple calculation suggests that the 32xx defect rate for new watches, bought between 2015 and 2024, was very high. No one can know what the situation in 2025 will be, except that this topic will continue to be discussed controversaly.

[JeanGenie]

About 3 weeks ago I picked up a 224270 brand new, March 2025 warranty card. This is my first time only, 3230 movement Rolex. No timegrapher here but I've worn it every single day since and it has gained about 8 seconds total in that time. I'll be keeping a close eye on it and wearing it very frequently. There are very few 3230 watches mentioned in this thread so I'm interested to see how it holds up. The fact that it's running fast seems like a good sign to me!

[Toshk]

Originally Posted by JeanGenie

About 3 weeks ago I picked up a 224270 brand new, March 2025 warranty card. This is my first time only, 3230 movement Rolex. No timegrapher here but I've worn it every single day since and it has gained about 8 seconds total in that time. I'll be keeping a close eye on it and wearing it very frequently. There are very few 3230 watches mentioned in this thread so I'm interested to see how it holds up. The fact that it's running fast seems like a good sign to me!

In my experience 8 seconds gain over 3 weeks is not enough to hold in a long run. But let’s hope your watch stays in + and doesn’t start losing time.

[JeanGenie]

Originally Posted by Toshk

In my experience 8 seconds gain over 3 weeks is not enough to hold in a long run. But let’s hope your watch stays in + and doesn’t start losing time.

It's definitely settling in to a pretty consistent +1ish a day, which is obviously just right. But yes, in a year will it still be there?

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by Toshk

In my experience 8 seconds gain over 3 weeks is not enough to hold in a long run.

100 %

Originally Posted by JeanGenie

It's definitely settling in to a pretty consistent +1ish a day, which is obviously just right. But yes, in a year will it still be there?

No one can predict what issues the 32xx scrap will develop inside. I hope your watch stays in good condition. In my opinion, the chances of that are slim. Others who just made fun of this thread were also affected recently.

Concerning how to obtain very good timekeeping, try the method I described on 8.8.2022 here:
https://www.rolexforums.com/showpost...4&postcount=23

That was an excellent thread started by CharlesN.

[Toshk]

Originally Posted by JeanGenie

It's definitely settling in to a pretty consistent +1ish a day, which is obviously just right. But yes, in a year will it still be there?

So it is 8 seconds per week or 8 seconds over 3 weeks?

[TheVTCGuy]

So, here’s a question, kind of general for anyone’s input. Let’s say my 3235 comes back and continues to have issues, bad enough (as some TRFers have stated) that they no longer want a watch with the 32 movement and have moved on. Let’s bypass vintage for a moment, like the 3186 for example, and stick to current movement’s, which ones are “safe.” Is the SkyDweller? The DayDate? Heck we might even have an as yet undetected issue with the new movement in the Land Dweller. I guess my question is has there been results with other current movement’s that are also showing issues?

[TheVTCGuy]

Originally Posted by saxo3

Others who just made fun of this thread were also affected recently.

He means me

[JeanGenie]

Originally Posted by Toshk

So it is 8 seconds per week or 8 seconds over 3 weeks?

It was 8 seconds over three weeks. Some days it gained 0 during that time.

The past 5 days have been a solid +1 spd, timed against time.gov.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by TheVTCGuy

He means me

No way, Paul!
What about buying a timegrapher, measuring and posting some data from your 32xx watch before and after the RSC repair? That would make an interesting contribution.