AP Boutique suggesting path to grail piece

[WatchEater666]

Originally Posted by Halothane

I have purchased AP's for many years (started before the craze). It's such a gamble now. SA's leave, managers change. I was staying in the game to try and get a ceramic piece for myself. Been waiting several years. My wife doesn't actually even like the RO (she owns 2 codes, a ROO and one steel RO). What really rubbed salt in the wound and put us off the brand was when they offered HER a ceramic RO, lol. She hadn't even asked for one and I had made it clear that it was dream of mine to own a mens version. Anyway, she turned it down. It was 34mm so no way I could wear it. My suggestion after this "manager talk" would be to wait and see if they offer something from your wish list but I would absolutely not be pressured into buying some overpriced references you don't want. It's just not worth it in the end. This company doesn't give 2c about it's customers (unless you are a celebrity or influencer).

The other frustrating thing is that a lot of people's purchase history back when AP had ADs did not carry over. There were tons of threads here on that, pretty brutal way to treat long time customers.

[mickyd329]

Originally Posted by Halothane

I have purchased AP's for many years (started before the craze). It's such a gamble now. SA's leave, managers change. I was staying in the game to try and get a ceramic piece for myself. Been waiting several years. My wife doesn't actually even like the RO (she owns 2 codes, a ROO and one steel RO). What really rubbed salt in the wound and put us off the brand was when they offered HER a ceramic RO, lol. She hadn't even asked for one and I had made it clear that it was dream of mine to own a mens version. Anyway, she turned it down. It was 34mm so no way I could wear it. My suggestion after this "manager talk" would be to wait and see if they offer something from your wish list but I would absolutely not be pressured into buying some overpriced references you don't want. It's just not worth it in the end. This company doesn't give 2c about it's customers (unless you are a celebrity or influencer).

Sorry to hear, but continued patience might prevail for your ceramic piece. They are not easy to come by. The 34 ceramic is much easier than the 41. My wife got hers in a month from asking.

I will respectfully disagree on AP not giving 2 cents about their customers though. They take great care of us with some amazing experiences where no other luxury brand we deal with even comes close. And we are not influencers and definitely no celebrity. Many collectors I know personally feel the same way and I'm sure many here on TRF agree.

It all comes down to your relationship. However, I can see why you might be frustrated if you've had a management change at your boutique. Everyone's experience is going to be different, so I don't think we can make blanket statements good or bad.

[mickyd329]

Originally Posted by WatchEater666

The other frustrating thing is that a lot of people's purchase history back when AP had ADs did not carry over. There were tons of threads here on that, pretty brutal way to treat long time customers.

Again different for everyone. All of my prior AD purchases got registered into their CRM by my SA.
Basically not boutique history, but got credit for the length of time and diversity in collecting AP's. It's still better than when your Patek or Rolex AD loses status IMO.

[Moondoggy]

Give them the middle finger and tell them to get st*ffed

[daysky1]

Originally Posted by llngoc

I have been with my current AP Boutique SA for a couple of years and have acquired a nice piece with him as a first piece. He's always been very professional in showing us interesting pieces whenever we visited. And he also took down our wishlist diligently even though we have only rather rare pieces on the list. (Double balance and RD3 for myself, ceramics and frosted gold pieces for my wife)

A couple of months ago, he texted me and told me that one of the pieces on my wife's wish list came in. I was all excited but then found out that it was a ladies ROO which was never on her list. I was confused and politely declined it and re-confirmed our wishlist again.

And a couple of weeks ago, we visited the boutique. Our SA referred us to be helped by his manager. He showed us a few pieces saying that he wanted to see what our taste is so he can help us better. Including a gorgeous 37mm RD#3 which I would have taken in a heartbeat if not for the diamonds. After showing us 6-8 pieces of very loud ROOs and Code 1.59 without anything which we really want, he then told us that in order for us to get something on our wishlist, we need to show our appreciation of the brand (we already owned 3 pieces of ROs). I asked if I acquire a ROO Beast, will it be okay as an appreciation piece, but he said no. In the end, I got a ROO diver and the manager assured us to trust them as they will help to fight for our wishlist pieces.

I do not have any complain in this case as I do like the ROO diver. I am just curious on how come there is a change in approach from our SA and the boutique. I felt like that our SA was too "embarrassed" to bring up this "bundling" practice and have his manager to be the "bad cop" after 2 years.

BTW, I used to have a 2019 ROO Chronograph which I found not very comfortable to wear and this 2024 ROO diver is definitely a great improvement. It got me thinking of adding the beast to my wishlist now.

When I was first starting to purchase my Rolex watches. ? You have to keep in mind I decided I would collect watches I would buy wear and keep everything that I could get. It didn't take me long to learn about the run around and the games. I did find one ad finally that took a chance on selling me a watch thinking that I would make a good home for it. I was open and honest with the ad letting them know I had been purchasing from the gray Market but I would much rather purchase from an authorized dealer. I'm now fairly well known at this ad and enjoy going just to visit or look and see what they have in their showcase and just talk if they call me for a watch I'm happy if they don't I'm still happy I have made new friends. I guess what I have going for me is that I am a collector so I have a variety that I'm interested in the only time I said no to a watch it was a champagne dial Day date 40 and I had already been promised a yellow gold green dial Day date I didn't want to buy both of them back to back so I turned down the champagne dial waiting for the green dial to come in that's been almost 2 years ago now still waiting but that's okay I'm happy. And in the meantime my disposable income grows.

[daysky1]

Originally Posted by Watchman001

This is awful. What’s more, the longer the market is in a downturn and they do this, the more obvious this is and always was a game of lies and manipulation. Perhaps these watch companies think this is a good model, but I think it will come back to bite them hard.

https://coron.et/
News as of 7/10/2024 As Rolex is poised to boost production to meet demand globally, clients of the brand are hopeful the supply situation will soon return to normal. But a study published last week by Deloitte tells a different story: an emerging market is likely to sap Rolex's availability further.

India's rapidly growing economy is driving an expansion of the middle class and a demand for aspirational products, like Swiss watches, the Deloitte report said. That potential has now been enhanced by a new trade agreement between Switzerland and India which will provide “a competitive advantage” for many years, according to Swiss Economics Minister Guy Parmelin.

[messikens]

Originally Posted by llngoc

I have been with my current AP Boutique SA for a couple of years and have acquired a nice piece with him as a first piece. He's always been very professional in showing us interesting pieces whenever we visited. And he also took down our wishlist diligently even though we have only rather rare pieces on the list. (Double balance and RD3 for myself, ceramics and frosted gold pieces for my wife)

A couple of months ago, he texted me and told me that one of the pieces on my wife's wish list came in. I was all excited but then found out that it was a ladies ROO which was never on her list. I was confused and politely declined it and re-confirmed our wishlist again.

And a couple of weeks ago, we visited the boutique. Our SA referred us to be helped by his manager. He showed us a few pieces saying that he wanted to see what our taste is so he can help us better. Including a gorgeous 37mm RD#3 which I would have taken in a heartbeat if not for the diamonds. After showing us 6-8 pieces of very loud ROOs and Code 1.59 without anything which we really want, he then told us that in order for us to get something on our wishlist, we need to show our appreciation of the brand (we already owned 3 pieces of ROs). I asked if I acquire a ROO Beast, will it be okay as an appreciation piece, but he said no. In the end, I got a ROO diver and the manager assured us to trust them as they will help to fight for our wishlist pieces.

I do not have any complain in this case as I do like the ROO diver. I am just curious on how come there is a change in approach from our SA and the boutique. I felt like that our SA was too "embarrassed" to bring up this "bundling" practice and have his manager to be the "bad cop" after 2 years.

BTW, I used to have a 2019 ROO Chronograph which I found not very comfortable to wear and this 2024 ROO diver is definitely a great improvement. It got me thinking of adding the beast to my wishlist now.

I'll offer a contrarian viewpoint (outside of boutique calling and then not having what they wanted).

OP purchased ONE PIECE and then basically started adding super high in demand pieces on his wish list that are SUPER RARE (double balance, tourb RD, frosted gold).

I am sure SAs have to justify allocations to senior management and corporate, esp for such pieces since they are - shock of shocks- SALES PEOPLE.

So rather than doing the Rolex way ("no buddy you're not getting a Daytona unless you buy $100k of junk jewelry), his SA and the boutique manager have hinted at a way of getting there without saying it directly, which is what you'd expect of a luxury brand...

OP didn't like the message and here we are. Look I'll buy a ceramic double balance as well in a heartbeat. I also know that I only own 4 pieces and hence will likely never be allocated one in the foreseeable future from the boutique.

Doesn't mean the SA behaved badly, just means OP didn't like the message...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[messikens]

Compare to Delta / frequent fliers : who gets the complimentary seat upgrade to business class and priority changes?

The traveler that has logged 100 flights this year and spent $50k with the airline or Joe Shmo that scored one discounted flash sale bizclass trip to Europe and now thinks he should be Delta360?

Same story different brand

[llngoc]

Originally Posted by messikens

I'll offer a contrarian viewpoint (outside of boutique calling and then not having what they wanted).

OP purchased ONE PIECE and then basically started adding super high in demand pieces on his wish list that are SUPER RARE (double balance, tourb RD, frosted gold).

I am sure SAs have to justify allocations to senior management and corporate, esp for such pieces since they are - shock of shocks- SALES PEOPLE.

So rather than doing the Rolex way ("no buddy you're not getting a Daytona unless you buy $100k of junk jewelry), his SA and the boutique manager have hinted at a way of getting there without saying it directly, which is what you'd expect of a luxury brand...

OP didn't like the message and here we are. Look I'll buy a ceramic double balance as well in a heartbeat. I also know that I only own 4 pieces and hence will likely never be allocated one in the foreseeable future from the boutique.

Doesn't mean the SA behaved badly, just means OP didn't like the message...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Minor correction

I did not state that I am upset or dislike the hint as I stated in the post. I was just curious on what’s changed as I have these pieces on my wishlist for a very long time. Nothing was mentioned. In fact, I was surprised that nothing was mentioned for the longest time.

The ceramic and frosted gold pieces are on my wife’s list which are 34mm pieces. From what I saw on C24, they are not marked up significantly so I assume they are not high demand pieces. And my wife is the one who really wants one of those.

I would like the double balance as I already have two other double balance pieces. (FPJ RQ and MB&F LM2) So I feel that it will be a nice sub-theme in my collection. But I fully understand if I never get one. I would happily trade 10 double balance allocations for one FPJ allocation.

[WatchEater666]

Originally Posted by messikens

Compare to Delta / frequent fliers : who gets the complimentary seat upgrade to business class and priority changes?

The traveler that has logged 100 flights this year and spent $50k with the airline or Joe Shmo that scored one discounted flash sale bizclass trip to Europe and now thinks he should be Delta360?

Same story different brand

No, it's way less transparent and consistent.

[abrosz]

I don't yet own an AP, but have had several discussions with boutiques in Chicago, New York, and Dallas. Not a single one made any attempt to earn my business. Each one tried to steer me to something I didn't want. In March I had an hour-long conversation with Natalie, the manager at the NYC boutique. Long story short, the whole process is completely arbitrary. Even if you buy items you are not truly passionate about, they make no guarantee they will EVER offer you what you really do want. There was a story from a guy in Las Vegas who has spent over $400,000 on stuff he didn't really want in this pay-to-play scheme and still wasn't offered his grail piece. The whole thing stinks to high heaven. Needless to say, when the time comes I'm going gray. I will pay the premium, but that premium still will come nowhere near what you're going to shell out in this journey of the brand bullshit. I have some other financial goals in the near term, so my purchase is going to be several months out, but I will never set foot in nor contact an AP boutique again. This game is for people with more money than sense.

[messikens]

Originally Posted by llngoc

Minor correction

I did not state that I am upset or dislike the hint as I stated in the post. I was just curious on what’s changed as I have these pieces on my wishlist for a very long time. Nothing was mentioned. In fact, I was surprised that nothing was mentioned for the longest time.

The ceramic and frosted gold pieces are on my wife’s list which are 34mm pieces. From what I saw on C24, they are not marked up significantly so I assume they are not high demand pieces. And my wife is the one who really wants one of those.

I would like the double balance as I already have two other double balance pieces. (FPJ RQ and MB&F LM2) So I feel that it will be a nice sub-theme in my collection. But I fully understand if I never get one. I would happily trade 10 double balance allocations for one FPJ allocation.

Look I totally get it, wasn't trying to be antagonistic at all.

You have wonderful pieces, I'm just comparing it to walking into FPJ now and getting assigned an Elegante (which is already awesome). And then wondering why it's taking so long to get a Remontoirs as your second piece...

Same reason, few made and a bajillion other people in line who'd like the same and likely have purchased several other FPJs before asking for one...

You're probably ahead of MickyD in the FPJ game and he's ahead of you in the AP allocation game. I'm behind both of you in either... That's how it goes

[codecow]

A wise man once said, “A journey of 1000 miles begins with your first step.” This is good to keep in mind with AP.

It’s a long game. Each Code, every ladies piece, each Offshore, it’s another step in your journey.

With no journey and only a destination there is no appreciation.

[Pw92676]

Originally Posted by VogelPhoenix

Not sure that there's an SA anywhere in the US that could do much for a client with OPs wishlist ("Double balance and RD3 for myself, ceramics and frosted gold pieces for my wife"). They could either say it's not going to happen anytime soon, or suggest "the journey" that has everyone up in arms to allow OP to leapfrog everyone else waiting for the same models forever.

Imo this is spot on.

If OP were asking for a steel Royal oak his and hers and was given this hoopla, then totally agree.

I really appreciate my APs but sadly my interest keeps dwindling in the brand, largely due to scenarios like these. Luckily for me, I’m chasing an openworked/db so I can sit on the sidelines and pout :)

[llngoc]

Originally Posted by messikens

Look I totally get it, wasn't trying to be antagonistic at all.

You have wonderful pieces, I'm just comparing it to walking into FPJ now and getting assigned an Elegante (which is already awesome). And then wondering why it's taking so long to get a Remontoirs as your second piece...

Same reason, few made and a bajillion other people in line who'd like the same and likely have purchased several other FPJs before asking for one...

You're probably ahead of MickyD in the FPJ game and he's ahead of you in the AP allocation game. I'm behind both of you in either... That's how it goes

I was probably not very good at expressing my thought in the original post.

I was working with the boutique for about 2 years. It is indeed a very short time but the double balance and RD#3 was on my wishlist since the first meeting. I have these on my list since I believe that I should only tell them what I do want and not adding pieces in there with hope of getting one of the hard to get pieces. And I expected my SA to let me know how to get there and if it does not work for me, I have no issue to let him know that we can remove them from the list. The original post was just curious if there is some changes in AP which prompted a change in approach after all these times. And I have zero negative vibe against the SA nor the boutique. He is always pleasant and professional to work with.

In my wife's case, since she *wants* one of the 34mm pieces and the ROO Diver is an usable piece so I am agreeable to get it to build her relationship with the boutique. :-)

[mickyd329]

Originally Posted by messikens

Look I totally get it, wasn't trying to be antagonistic at all.


You're probably ahead of MickyD in the FPJ game and he's ahead of you in the AP allocation game. I'm behind both of you in either... That's how it goes

I think ahead in the FPJ allocation game is a huge understatement. lol. His FPJ collection is incredible.

Originally Posted by abrosz

l There was a story from a guy in Las Vegas who has spent over $400,000 on stuff he didn't really want in this pay-to-play scheme and still wasn't offered his grail piece. The whole thing stinks to high heaven.

How does that saying go? Don't believe everything you read on the internet?

[codecow]

All I know is, I went into Palazzo last November and asked about a Star Wheel and they wouldn’t even take my name down.

[crispyness87]

Originally Posted by codecow

All I know is, I went into Palazzo last November and asked about a Star Wheel and they wouldn’t even take my name down.

Dude… starwheel ain’t easy bro.
I’ve got openwork and jumbo, but my SA won’t take my name down for a starwheel.
I think you should recalibrate your expectations on what’s realistic.
Simply walking into a boutique to drop your name down isn’t a cheat code to get any highly popular piece you want…

[abrosz]

Originally Posted by mickyd329

I think ahead in the FPJ allocation game is a huge understatement. lol. His FPJ collection is incredible.





How does that saying go? Don't believe everything you read on the internet?

That story was right here on TRF. Very detailed about what was purchased and when. I have no reason to doubt or find fault in the OPs story. It actually paralleled my own experience. Perhaps you know of some fault or inconsistency with the poster’s story? This would have been back in March. I’d be happy to learn his story wasn’t true, but based on my experience with AP and my discussion with the manager of the flagship boutique in NA, I believe his account and experience.

[Gandor]

Originally Posted by abrosz

That story was right here on TRF. Very detailed about what was purchased and when. I have no reason to doubt or find fault in the OPs story. It actually paralleled my own experience. Perhaps you know of some fault or inconsistency with the poster’s story? This would have been back in March. I’d be happy to learn his story wasn’t true, but based on my experience with AP and my discussion with the manager of the flagship boutique in NA, I believe his account and experience.

It was revealed halfway though that he sold allocations. Which anyone going to an AP boutique should know is a big no no. Even after selling AP was still willing to work with him since he was a big fish, they just didn't want to immediately give him another limited piece to pawn off.

[mickyd329]

Originally Posted by Gandor

It was revealed halfway though that he sold allocations. Which anyone going to an AP boutique should know is a big no no. Even after selling AP was still willing to work with him since he was a big fish, they just didn't want to immediately give him another limited piece to pawn off.

Not just regular allocation pieces. I'll just leave it at that.

[1259]

Do you have to buy watches you don’t want for a basic steel RO?

[Octagon Guy]

Originally Posted by 1259

Do you have to buy watches you don’t want for a basic steel RO?

You'll get 2 different extreme answers here. Some says yes and some says no. Talk to the Boutique yourself and understand the game from the horse's mouth. And decide whether the game's for you.

[VogelPhoenix]

Originally Posted by 1259

Do you have to buy watches you don’t want for a basic steel RO?

I imagine AP wants people to buy watches they DO want before they allocate the basic steel RO. Subtle difference, and unfortunate for those only after the basic RO.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Henrimontgomery]

AP has levels of approvals. Some are left at the boutique level, other (used to) go directly to the CEO. If you ask for something rare, exotic and popular, your wish might get refused at some level by somebody who would go “who’s that guy?”.

Now, how much finesse the SA have into telling you this, will probably craft your experience. Personally I’d rather have them be honest with me than be giving fake smiles. Your SA might not have read the art of the deal and therefore not know how to manage frustration (joke), but at least he told you that you won’t get the shiny stuff without more history.

Would you rather have this, or the elusive 10 year old list antics that just hope you move on and quietly go away?

[codecow]

Originally Posted by crispyness87

Dude… starwheel ain’t easy bro.
I’ve got openwork and jumbo, but my SA won’t take my name down for a starwheel.
I think you should recalibrate your expectations on what’s realistic.
Simply walking into a boutique to drop your name down isn’t a cheat code to get any highly popular piece you want…

I don’t think they understand how entitled I am when it comes to luxury timepieces. If they did they’d say, “Certainly sir, while I’m taking down your information would you like a Diet Coke with ice?”

[Vivalas]

Originally Posted by codecow

All I know is, I went into Palazzo last November and asked about a Star Wheel and they wouldn’t even take my name down.

I don’t find that surprising at all. I went to AP House in HK and they showed me some watches, the Star Wheel being one. They said a lot of regular clients had wanted one and they couldn’t allocate to everyone. It’s not a watch that I’d buy if I only had one or two AP’s, but it’s such a different offering, I’d imagine that people with big collections would want to add it for its diversity. I liked it

[VogelPhoenix]

Originally Posted by codecow

I don’t think they understand how entitled I am when it comes to luxury timepieces. If they did they’d say, “Certainly sir, while I’m taking down your information would you like a Diet Coke with ice?”

Outcome would be the same, though.

[Steele]

This is one of the best threads we have going right now!

Riveting reading

[jimmypark54]

Sounds like the boutique is pushing you to buy more to get your wishlist items. The manager probably stepped in to handle the tough conversation. Glad you like the ROO Diver. Adding the Beast could improve your chances for those rare pieces. Enjoy the journey!