3235 Movement reliability and service cost

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by dannyp

Perhaps I misunderstood the article then. I thought it implied that the rotor assembly was just another disposable part, replaced as a matter of course during service. Was it in fact saying that if one part of the rotor assembly goes, the whole thing has to (but at typical service the whole thing can remain intact and as is)?

Yes, misunderstood
It's not necessarily a common occurrence to have to perform a major service to that part unless the watch is dropped and the bearing suffers damage or something else more significant has happened as a result.
The new Roller bearing should remain serviceable for longer between services than the old slipper bearing.
But it all comes down to servicing in a timely manner either way.
Most Roller bearings themselves are easily replaceable. That's not possible with the 32xx movement. If there's something wrong with it, the whole Rotor sub assembly has to be replaced.
With the older Jewelled Slipper bearing arrangement, every component is serviceable and or repairable with the right gear and training if I understand correctly. I'm not a watchmaker, so I don't do it for a crust
RSCs do it routinely and have done so since forever.

Roller bearings are more efficient and aren't as sensitive to lubes drying out like the Jewelled Slipper bearings.
In fact, lubrication is not required with the modern Ceramic Roller bearings.
I prefer the old ways as there's a lot of merit to the design in this case if one is not hung up on sqeezing every last drop of efficiency out of a design.
Happy to discuss further in more detail

[TswaneNguni]

Originally Posted by Rado63

3135 Nice movement.

Very .

4130 too .

[amanbra]

Originally Posted by TswaneNguni

Very .

4130 too .

such a good movement. competitors still can't match it's size.

[Dirt]

I hear the 9001 is not too shabby as well
I suppose 2 out of 3 is sort of ok

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by gwozhog

So I found this old article comparing the 3135 to the 3235 and it seems the guy who wrote it thinks the newer movement will need more costly service down the road. Anyone know the cost of a whole new rotor assembly for the new 3235 movement that he is talking about? Does not instill a lot of confidence in the newer watches Rolex is making us wait and beg to get.

3235 movement reliability? unpredictable.

Service costs? free during guarantee repair.

There is hardly any other topic on this forum where measured data and other facts about the 32xx movements count for so little and members' opinions are so extremely different.

[Tommy125]

I understand the sentiment that mechanical watches will have variations and will not be as accurate as a quartz. Personally for me, I see what the manufacturer or maker say about their watches. If a brand or maker gives a wide range for their accuracy, then I will accept that, though I’ll prefer it to be within -10 to +15s a day. But for a brand like Rolex who does quality checks on precision, then my expectations would be higher. I’ll factor in the claims into the cost of the watch. So, I am quite ocd with my Rolex, but not so much with my Nomos or Seikos.

With that said, when I noticed my watch went from -3s to -5s, I brought it in for warranty work. I bought my 3235 ss datejust in 2019. Went into RSC in Mar 2021. Timekeeping was good for about a year then the same thing happened, ie a sudden small decrease in accuracy. So I brought it into RSC again in Feb 2022. Now it’s been 6 months and so far so good. We’ll see again in 2 years time.

[Mystro]

Originally Posted by TswaneNguni

Very .

4130 too .

The 4130 in the Daytona actually lives up to the hype. It’s really that good.

[Driver8]

Originally Posted by saxo3

There is hardly any other topic on this forum where measured data and other facts about the 32xx movements count for so little and members' opinions are so extremely different.

Unfortunately so.

The problem is, nowadays there's a real culture (in all aspects of life) to only believe something if it actually happens to you, otherwise it's just "fake news".

[Kigan]

Originally Posted by Tommy125

With that said, when I noticed my watch went from -3s to -5s, I brought it in for warranty work. I bought my 3235 ss datejust in 2019. Went into RSC in Mar 2021. Timekeeping was good for about a year then the same thing happened, ie a sudden small decrease in accuracy. So I brought it into RSC again in Feb 2022. Now it’s been 6 months and so far so good. We’ll see again in 2 years time.

It's good when there is a warranty - repair is free. You can repair the watch many times. However, the warranty period will end, then what, sell the watch?...

So far, all the talk is about a drop in accuracy calibre 3235 during the warranty period. After the expiration of the five-year warranty, if there is another drop in accuracy, how much will it cost to repair the 3235, 800_900$?

[Tommy125]

Originally Posted by Kigan

It's good when there is a warranty - repair is free. You can repair the watch many times. However, the warranty period will end, then what, sell the watch?...

So far, all the talk is about a drop in accuracy calibre 3235 during the warranty period. After the expiration of the five-year warranty, if there is another drop in accuracy, how much will it cost to repair the 3235, 800_900$?

I am aware of the cost outside of warranty. I am aware that it is common for new movements to have issues. But note that the issue I faced was just a minor change in accuracy, albeit a sudden one. I did not wait to see if it deteriorated further. I also want to say that Rolex do update existing movements quietly, so if a good fix was issued, no one would know. So I can only trust in the brand itself to find a fix to the problem.

[Tommy125]

Originally Posted by Kigan

It's good when there is a warranty - repair is free. You can repair the watch many times. However, the warranty period will end, then what, sell the watch?...

So far, all the talk is about a drop in accuracy calibre 3235 during the warranty period. After the expiration of the five-year warranty, if there is another drop in accuracy, how much will it cost to repair the 3235, 800_900$?

It would be a shame if it happened outside of warranty. But I have some trust in Rolex that they will silently fix the issue. Who knows, perhaps the issues are decreasing.

[amanbra]

Originally Posted by Tommy125

It would be a shame if it happened outside of warranty. But I have some trust in Rolex that they will silently fix the issue. Who knows, perhaps the issues are decreasing.

they do have a track record of quietly updating things but the issue at the moment is the first versions of the movement have been around from 2015 and we are still getting reports of recent watches or recent warranty work with RSC having issues...

I personally refuse to believe that if Rolex had a fix they would still be selling new watches inf 2021 and 2022 with the issue in it...

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by Tommy125

I am aware of the cost outside of warranty. I am aware that it is common for new movements to have issues. But note that the issue I faced was just a minor change in accuracy, albeit a sudden one. I did not wait to see if it deteriorated further. I also want to say that Rolex do update existing movements quietly, so if a good fix was issued, no one would know. So I can only trust in the brand itself to find a fix to the problem.

That's another reason why the other thread exists.
It's to identify the extent of the problem from the end user's perspective. Also gain a clearer picture of the very nature of the problem and to try and gain a deeper insight into whether there is indeed a long term fix.
The last point has fairly clearly been established to be in the negative at this point in time.

We are pushing deep into the decade now for an issue which is profound and well known at the Mothership.
Patiently we shall wait

[douglasf13]

Originally Posted by amanbra

they do have a track record of quietly updating things but the issue at the moment is the first versions of the movement have been around from 2015 and we are still getting reports of recent watches or recent warranty work with RSC having issues...

I personally refuse to believe that if Rolex had a fix they would still be selling new watches inf 2021 and 2022 with the issue in it...

Yep. Plus, although we haven’t heard from him for a bit, I believe Bas (RSC watchmaker) confirmed that he hasn’t seen any changes.

[Mystro]

Originally Posted by douglasf13

Yep. Plus, although we haven’t heard from him for a bit, I believe Bas (RSC watchmaker) confirmed that he hasn’t seen any changes.

I can confirm that watchmakers with Rolex accounts are at times not permitted to publicly report inside information. I know this first hand and even I won’t disclose my sources. This is SOP for Rolex.
There are many reason besides protecting their trade for these watchmakers to avoid disclosing their trade information on a public/free Internet forum. You will never get any confirmed inside Rolex information on the internet.

[amanbra]

Originally Posted by Mystro

I can confirm that watchmakers with Rolex accounts are at times not permitted to publicly report inside information. I know this first hand and even I won’t disclose my sources. This is SOP for Rolex.
There are many reason besides protecting their trade for these watchmakers to avoid disclosing their trade information on a public/free Internet forum. You will never get any confirmed inside Rolex information on the internet.

Yeah but archer reports it. He is friends with plenty of of rsc watchmakers some of whom have left rsc reasonably unhappy with Rolex.

You appear to be in the camp of there is no real issue with the 32xx. So either your source is simply lying or doesn’t genuinely know what’s going on with these movements.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[douglasf13]

Originally Posted by amanbra

Yeah but archer reports it. He is friends with plenty of of rsc watchmakers some of whom have left rsc reasonably unhappy with Rolex.

You appear to be in the camp of there is no real issue with the 32xx. So either your source is simply lying or doesn’t genuinely know what’s going on with these movements.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yep, Al has discussed this topic plenty in another forum. There's another watchmaker in this forum, who's name I'm forgetting, who's discussed it, and then, of course, Bas.

I think the real trick would be to find a current Rolex watchmaker who doesn't think there's an issue.

[Mystro]

Originally Posted by amanbra

Yeah but archer reports it. He is friends with plenty of of rsc watchmakers some of whom have left rsc reasonably unhappy with Rolex.

You appear to be in the camp of there is no real issue with the 32xx. So either your source is simply lying or doesn’t genuinely know what’s going on with these movements.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Don’t be under the illusion you’re going to get full disclosure over an Internet forum from watchmakers with a current Rolex account.
I am not in any camp other than 7 different 32 series models without any movement issues and I am a mechanical movement super nerd.

[douglasf13]

Originally Posted by Mystro

Don’t be under the illusion you’re going to get full disclosure over an Internet forum from watchmakers with a current Rolex account.
I am not in any camp other than 7 different 32 series models without any movement issues and I am a mechanical movement super nerd.

So are you saying that Al Archer, one of the most respected watchmakers in Canada, and our own Bas, aren't telling the truth? These aren't random, anonymous accounts we're talking about.

[Mystro]

Originally Posted by douglasf13

So are you saying that Al Archer, one of the most respected watchmakers in Canada, and our own Bas, aren't telling the truth? These aren't random, anonymous accounts we're talking about.

Ugh, I am saying you might not be getting every bit of relevant piece of information they know on the topic. I can confirm the watchmakers I know that have a Rolex account will NOT disclose on a open forum a lot of info from Rolex.

[douglasf13]

Originally Posted by Mystro

Ugh, I am saying you might not be getting every bit of relevant piece of information they know on the topic. I can confirm the watchmakers I know that have a Rolex account will NOT disclose on a open forum a lot of info from Rolex.

Well, we're still seeing watches from last year have the issue, but I'll accept there's a possibility that this year, after seven years, there's a secret fix that we don't know about.

[amanbra]

Originally Posted by Mystro

Ugh, I am saying you might not be getting every bit of relevant piece of information they know on the topic. I can confirm the watchmakers I know that have a Rolex account will NOT disclose on a open forum a lot of info from Rolex.

I do agree that we’re unlikely to get full candid disclosure from watchmakers who are actively working with Rolex right now. In saying that Bas did do a photo essay for us.

What I do know is there are plenty of watchmakers leaving Rolex and they do talk to each other, it’s only a matter of time before info gets out.

[amanbra]

Originally Posted by Mystro

Don’t be under the illusion you’re going to get full disclosure over an Internet forum from watchmakers with a current Rolex account.
I am not in any camp other than 7 different 32 series models without any movement issues and I am a mechanical movement super nerd.

7 is a great sample size, do you wear them long enough (days in a row) to detect time keeping changes?

I personally wouldn’t have picked my issues anywhere near as early as I did if it weren’t for the fact that the DJ was a daily work watch and never stopped running because after Friday the 70 PR would keep it ticking and ready for Monday.

The issue with having a tonne of watches is if you wear in rotation and change daily if the watch is only doing about -10-30 you won’t actually pick it up.

[Mystro]

Originally Posted by amanbra

7 is a great sample size, do you wear them long enough (days in a row) to detect time keeping changes?

I personally wouldn’t have picked my issues anywhere near as early as I did if it weren’t for the fact that the DJ was a daily work watch and never stopped running because after Friday the 70 PR would keep it ticking and ready for Monday.

The issue with having a tonne of watches is if you wear in rotation and change daily if the watch is only doing about -10-30 you won’t actually pick it up.

My own personal experience is all of them tend to hold a second or less a day accuracy but most all were regulated in the -.05 a day to +0.0. I was surprised that the regulations always tend to be right at 0 to -.05 a day for the 32 series. My 4130 is a rock +1 a day to +0.50 a day in every resting position. I wore my Sub41LV on a extended 1 month vacation every day from diving to theme parks and it was a rock steady -0.50 a day. So consistent that it never deviates more than 0.50 to 0.25 seconds a day regardless the activity even at home running a chainsaw to whatever. Incredibly consistent.

FYI.. Most all of my watches are always kept on a custom multi head winding box running but I tend to only keep 4 watches at a time running as that is the amount I like to rotate/wear.

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by Mystro

My own personal experience is all of them tend to hold a second or less a day accuracy but most all were regulated in the -.05 a day to +0.0. I was surprised that the regulations always tend to be right at 0 to -.05 a day. My 4130 is a rock +1 a day to +0.50 a day in every resting position. I wore my Sub41LV on a extended 1 month vacation every day from diving to theme parks and it was a rock steady -0.50 a day. So consistent that it never deviates more than 0.50 to 0.25 seconds a day regardless the activity even at home running a chainsaw to whatever.

The Daytona is excluded from the criterior regarding the subject matter.
You haven't worn the LV long enough to know where it sits in the reliability sweep stakes. One month continually is simply not enough. Get back to us in a year or so after wearing continually

[Mystro]

Originally Posted by Dirt

The Daytona is excluded from the criterior regarding the subject matter.
You haven't worn the LV long enough to know where it sits in the reliability sweep stakes. One month continually is simply not enough. Get back to us in a year or so after wearing continually

I have had 32 series for longer than a year but never actually wear one watch for the entire year every day. I will never do that with my collection. I rotate watches too much.

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by amanbra

The issue with having a tonne of watches is if you wear in rotation and change daily if the watch is only doing about -10-30 you won’t actually pick it up.

I would pick it up unless the watch has timing all over the place to start with. For something that is supposed to be precise it's virtually a given how it should perform.
It's so easy to check it against a smart phone or computer at a glance at some point in the day provided it's noted where it's set in relation to a known standard that's reliable.
As you know, once one is onto it one tends to keep an eye on it

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by Mystro

I have had 32 series for longer than a year but never actually wear one watch for the entire year every day. I will never do that with my collection. I rotate watches too much.

Understood

[502 to Right]

All I know is that I bought a 3235 Datejust new from my local AD in March of 2020 and six months later it was suffering from low amplitude and running about -10 seconds a day. It was serviced under warranty and promptly sold. I want nothing more to do with the 3235.

My daily is a 20 year old Sub with a 3135 and it runs like a top.

[amanbra]

Originally Posted by Mystro

My own personal experience is all of them tend to hold a second or less a day accuracy but most all were regulated in the -.05 a day to +0.0. I was surprised that the regulations always tend to be right at 0 to -.05 a day for the 32 series. My 4130 is a rock +1 a day to +0.50 a day in every resting position. I wore my Sub41LV on a extended 1 month vacation every day from diving to theme parks and it was a rock steady -0.50 a day. So consistent that it never deviates more than 0.50 to 0.25 seconds a day regardless the activity even at home running a chainsaw to whatever. Incredibly consistent.

FYI.. Most all of my watches are always kept on a custom multi head winding box running but I tend to only keep 4 watches at a time running as that is the amount I like to rotate/wear.

Okay it does seem like you'd detect a sudden change in timing them. Look I really do hope your watches stay this way. Appears that the lottery as worked out quite well for you. Just please don't accuse those suffering for the issue as a bunch of OCD owners. I own plenty of other watches, just as OCD with them, all zero issues outside of the 32xx bunch.