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rotorcraft · 4 November 2009, 08:52 PM

I recently bought myself a Rolex Sub Date and thought I had a new addiction for Rolexes having joined TRF, but browsing through the Panerai section has blown me away.

Having looked all the way through the Panerai website the two I like the look of the most are the 233 and the 270.

Any thoughts, pros or cons between the two would be VERY helpful!

Thanks in advance,

R

rotorcraft · 4 November 2009, 09:15 PM

Will these Pams appreciate, or at least hold their value, or will I take a big hit the moment I walk out of the store?

Don't get me wrong, I love the look and would love one as my dress watch, but I'd also like to know that it's not throwing money away.

If that was the case would a pre-loved one be a better choice?

dalip · 4 November 2009, 09:20 PM

I have no idea...new to Pams myself: but seriously love my 104 :)

rotorcraft · 4 November 2009, 10:14 PM

Hey dalip, I'm new to Rolex and Pams too. I'm after a dress watch and they look perfect. The 104 looks great as well, I love the simple, elegant and classic look.
Do you have some pics?

dalip · 4 November 2009, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rotorcraft

Hey dalip, I'm new to Rolex and Pams too. I'm after a dress watch and they look perfect. The 104 looks great as well, I love the simple, elegant and classic look.
Do you have some pics?

Hey Rich...yep this one...VERY bad: taken quickly when I got it with iphone:

rotorcraft · 4 November 2009, 10:21 PM

Very nice!

dalip · 4 November 2009, 10:43 PM

looking at pics of them both...I'd go 233

Trurolexer · 4 November 2009, 10:54 PM

Hello Rich...Welcome To The BLUESIDE!!!

I think 233 can hold the price more good than 270 IMO. If I were you I will go for 233. Why? The "real" Panerai for me is the manual winding one.
But you can't go wrong with 270. whatever you choose in the end, HUGE CONGRATS!!!

RedBaronF2001 · 4 November 2009, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rotorcraft

Will these Pams appreciate, or at least hold their value, or will I take a big hit the moment I walk out of the store?

Don't get me wrong, I love the look and would love one as my dress watch, but I'd also like to know that it's not throwing money away.

If that was the case would a pre-loved one be a better choice?

Very few Panerai actually appreciate in value immediately. Only a few sought after SEs have. Neither the 233 nor the 270 are SEs are even limited production (by Panerai standards).

There are a few subtle differences between the 233 and 270 - go with what you like - not what the forum members tell you. Both are great IMHO.

rotorcraft · 4 November 2009, 11:43 PM

Hello TR and RedBaron,

Thanks for the info, I will have to go to my nearest AD and try them on.

Sounds like a used one in good condition might be the wisest option.

mike · 5 November 2009, 12:03 AM

Rich, the 233 is a grail to many panerasti. It is a stunning reference.

One thing to consider is whether you like the older "dot" or the newer AM/PM indication. I tend to favor the dot, but that's just me.

Good luck.

rotorcraft · 5 November 2009, 12:16 AM

Thanks Mike, I mainly liked the fact that the 270 shows the 9 numeral.

Which of these two have the better movement, is that something to look for when considering which one to get?

Rich

rotorcraft · 5 November 2009, 12:21 AM

Oh, BTW, RedBaron, it's your Tuesday wrist check 312 that got me looking at Pams, fantastic picture!

mfer · 5 November 2009, 01:03 AM

They'll both take a big hit if you buy from AD, but at the same time AD's should be discounting these big time, like 20%.

I think the 270 is a more solid movement. There have been NUMEROUS problems with the 233, but also there have been many that have had a 233 and had NO problems. Point being you don't hear about as many problems with the 270. I too love the 9 and if I had the means (aka cash money), 270 all the way (for me).

rotorcraft · 5 November 2009, 01:12 AM

Thanks mfer,

Interesting to hear that there have been problems with the 233.
As TR kindly pointed out the 233 is a manual, which I find fun and attractive but I do like the 9 in the 270, although it is automatic.

Does anyone know which of these movements is the more modern and robust?

RedBaronF2001 · 5 November 2009, 01:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rotorcraft

Thanks mfer,

Interesting to hear that there have been problems with the 233.
As TR kindly pointed out the 233 is a manual, which I find fun and attractive but I do like the 9 in the 270, although it is automatic.

Does anyone know which of these movements is the more modern and robust?

The 270 uses caliber P.2003 which is newer than the P.2002/1 used in the 270. I can't say with certainly which one is more "modern" technically, but the 2003 is newer so more modern in the timeline sense.

There were issues initially with the P.2002/1 in the 233s, but I have not read anything bad for a while.

As for robustness - I think it's too early to tell anything about any of Panerai's own movements.

RedBaronF2001 · 5 November 2009, 01:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rotorcraft

Oh, BTW, RedBaron, it's your Tuesday wrist check 312 that got me looking at Pams, fantastic picture!

Well thank you. I wanted another "simple" Luminor as I don't really have a need for nor use the GMT function so I went with the 312.

Officine Panerai makes a fantastic watch. You won't see them as often "in the wild" as you will with Rolex (and others). When you do spot another Panerai you can often strike up a conversation with the owner easily.

Here's another shot for you:

Trurolexer · 5 November 2009, 01:36 AM

312 Rules!!!

rotorcraft · 5 November 2009, 02:59 AM

That 312 looks fantastic.

I'm definitely looking forward to a trip to the nearest AD tomorrow!

TswaneNguni · 5 November 2009, 03:02 AM

111 or 104 or 312 or 233 >>

brainbizz · 5 November 2009, 01:03 PM

Not to be rude but the search function is your friend. I have posted several pics with comparisons which i no longer have on my desktop. This is a frequent topic but a good question. I own both and 289 maybe worn my 270 twice for reasons of preference to the 233 stated in previous threads. Some 233 i s had issues when the power reserve was low but was pretty rare. The 8 day manual wind mvnt is perfection and makes sense the 10 day auto what is the point? http://www.rolexforums.com/showthrea...ad.php?t=60959
http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=62153
http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=60959

WatchTimes · 5 November 2009, 02:18 PM

I had a 233, I sold it.
I will never buy another Panerai in house movement after my experience.
Many others are happy with their watches and have had great service experiences
so do not go by what I say.

Id buy a 243, 279 and a base model logo

rotorcraft · 5 November 2009, 06:17 PM

Thanks for the links brainbizz.
Looks like this is an old question, sorry guys!
The 233 certainly seems to be the choice over the 270 for all the reasons stated, and I agree.
Since it was RedBaron's 312 that brought me in here, I guess the real question for me now is 233 or 312!

rotorcraft · 5 November 2009, 07:10 PM

What makes the 233 a grail watch for some people?
I like it's simple beauty combined with the complications, so going to see if my AD has the dot or the am/pm, might just be the deciding factor!

Trurolexer · 5 November 2009, 09:51 PM

Rich, just trust your heart. Buy watch because you like it, not because somebody said to you that watch is good. Good luck.

hflee55 · 6 November 2009, 12:07 AM

233 forever!

mfer · 6 November 2009, 01:20 AM

Exactly, just buy what you love.

For me 270
For TR, Brainbizz, 233

Neither of us is wrong. There is no wrong decision here.

The only thing that would even remotely come into play is do you want to wind it up all on your own. Isn't an issue with me and really should be on a 8 day PR.

Tommysol · 6 November 2009, 03:27 AM

http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=48574

rotorcraft · 6 November 2009, 07:11 AM

Thanks to all of you for your advice, it's great to weigh up all the different perspectives.

So...

....I went to the AD today and knew in the back of my mind that if the 233 he had was a K series with 'dot' I might just...

...several pleasant hours, cappuccinos, soda waters, hors d'oeuvres and a glass of pink Champagne later...

I am the proud new owner of a new 233 (K)!

ocwatching · 6 November 2009, 01:25 PM

Congrats!!!!
I sure hope it was not the champagne...the 233k dot is awesome...

4 November 2009, 08:52 PM	#1
rotorcraft Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Real Name: Rich Location: NW Europe Watch: AP ROO Safari Posts: 58	Help required! 233 or 270? I recently bought myself a Rolex Sub Date and thought I had a new addiction for Rolexes having joined TRF, but browsing through the Panerai section has blown me away. Having looked all the way through the Panerai website the two I like the look of the most are the 233 and the 270. Any thoughts, pros or cons between the two would be VERY helpful! Thanks in advance, R

4 November 2009, 09:20 PM	#3
dalip "TRF" Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Real Name: Dalip Location: Mumbai and Perth Watch: Rolex PAM Omega Posts: 18,656	I have no idea...new to Pams myself: but seriously love my 104 :) __________________ ------------------------------------------------------------ *"The liar's punishment is not in the least that he is not believed, but that he cannot believe anyone else." George Bernard Shaw*

4 November 2009, 10:43 PM	#7
dalip "TRF" Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Real Name: Dalip Location: Mumbai and Perth Watch: Rolex PAM Omega Posts: 18,656	looking at pics of them both...I'd go 233 __________________ ------------------------------------------------------------ *"The liar's punishment is not in the least that he is not believed, but that he cannot believe anyone else." George Bernard Shaw*

5 November 2009, 01:03 AM	#14
mfer "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Real Name: Mik Location: USA Posts: 13,723	They'll both take a big hit if you buy from AD, but at the same time AD's should be discounting these big time, like 20%. I think the 270 is a more solid movement. There have been NUMEROUS problems with the 233, but also there have been many that have had a 233 and had NO problems. Point being you don't hear about as many problems with the 270. I too love the 9 and if I had the means (aka cash money), 270 all the way (for me). __________________ member#3242

5 November 2009, 02:18 PM	#22
WatchTimes 2024 ROLEX DATEJUST41 Pledge Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Real Name: JYogi/Jeremy Location: Metro Detroit USA Watch: It's a Rolex! Posts: 5,780	I had a 233, I sold it. I will never buy another Panerai in house movement after my experience. Many others are happy with their watches and have had great service experiences so do not go by what I say. Id buy a 243, 279 and a base model logo __________________ "You won't rise to the occasion - you'll default to your level of training." Barrett Tillman Kentucky Colonel, Tennessee Squire & Combat Leprechaun

4 November 2009, 09:15 PM	#2
rotorcraft Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Real Name: Rich Location: NW Europe Watch: AP ROO Safari Posts: 58	Will these Pams appreciate, or at least hold their value, or will I take a big hit the moment I walk out of the store? Don't get me wrong, I love the look and would love one as my dress watch, but I'd also like to know that it's not throwing money away. If that was the case would a pre-loved one be a better choice?

4 November 2009, 10:14 PM	#4
rotorcraft Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Real Name: Rich Location: NW Europe Watch: AP ROO Safari Posts: 58	Hey dalip, I'm new to Rolex and Pams too. I'm after a dress watch and they look perfect. The 104 looks great as well, I love the simple, elegant and classic look. Do you have some pics?

4 November 2009, 10:21 PM	#6
rotorcraft Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Real Name: Rich Location: NW Europe Watch: AP ROO Safari Posts: 58	Very nice!

4 November 2009, 10:54 PM	#8
Trurolexer Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: USA Watch: 5513MaxiI+PreComex Posts: 18,421	Hello Rich...Welcome To The BLUESIDE!!! I think 233 can hold the price more good than 270 IMO. If I were you I will go for 233. Why? The "real" Panerai for me is the manual winding one. But you can't go wrong with 270. whatever you choose in the end, HUGE CONGRATS!!!

4 November 2009, 11:43 PM	#10
rotorcraft Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Real Name: Rich Location: NW Europe Watch: AP ROO Safari Posts: 58	Hello TR and RedBaron, Thanks for the info, I will have to go to my nearest AD and try them on. Sounds like a used one in good condition might be the wisest option.

5 November 2009, 12:03 AM	#11
mike "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 22,683	Rich, the 233 is a grail to many panerasti. It is a stunning reference. One thing to consider is whether you like the older "dot" or the newer AM/PM indication. I tend to favor the dot, but that's just me. Good luck.

5 November 2009, 12:16 AM	#12
rotorcraft Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Real Name: Rich Location: NW Europe Watch: AP ROO Safari Posts: 58	Thanks Mike, I mainly liked the fact that the 270 shows the 9 numeral. Which of these two have the better movement, is that something to look for when considering which one to get? Rich

5 November 2009, 12:21 AM	#13
rotorcraft Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Real Name: Rich Location: NW Europe Watch: AP ROO Safari Posts: 58	Oh, BTW, RedBaron, it's your Tuesday wrist check 312 that got me looking at Pams, fantastic picture!

5 November 2009, 01:12 AM	#15
rotorcraft Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Real Name: Rich Location: NW Europe Watch: AP ROO Safari Posts: 58	Thanks mfer, Interesting to hear that there have been problems with the 233. As TR kindly pointed out the 233 is a manual, which I find fun and attractive but I do like the 9 in the 270, although it is automatic. Does anyone know which of these movements is the more modern and robust?

5 November 2009, 01:36 AM	#18
Trurolexer Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: USA Watch: 5513MaxiI+PreComex Posts: 18,421	312 Rules!!!

5 November 2009, 02:59 AM	#19
rotorcraft Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Real Name: Rich Location: NW Europe Watch: AP ROO Safari Posts: 58	That 312 looks fantastic. I'm definitely looking forward to a trip to the nearest AD tomorrow!

5 November 2009, 03:02 AM	#20
TswaneNguni "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Real Name: Chris Location: . Watch: Daytonas/Subs/GMTs Posts: 12,609	111 or 104 or 312 or 233 >>

5 November 2009, 01:03 PM	#21
brainbizz Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 608	Not to be rude but the search function is your friend. I have posted several pics with comparisons which i no longer have on my desktop. This is a frequent topic but a good question. I own both and 289 maybe worn my 270 twice for reasons of preference to the 233 stated in previous threads. Some 233 i s had issues when the power reserve was low but was pretty rare. The 8 day manual wind mvnt is perfection and makes sense the 10 day auto what is the point? http://www.rolexforums.com/showthrea...ad.php?t=60959 http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=62153 http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=60959

5 November 2009, 06:17 PM	#23
rotorcraft Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Real Name: Rich Location: NW Europe Watch: AP ROO Safari Posts: 58	Thanks for the links brainbizz. Looks like this is an old question, sorry guys! The 233 certainly seems to be the choice over the 270 for all the reasons stated, and I agree. Since it was RedBaron's 312 that brought me in here, I guess the real question for me now is 233 or 312!

5 November 2009, 07:10 PM	#24
rotorcraft Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Real Name: Rich Location: NW Europe Watch: AP ROO Safari Posts: 58	What makes the 233 a grail watch for some people? I like it's simple beauty combined with the complications, so going to see if my AD has the dot or the am/pm, might just be the deciding factor!

5 November 2009, 09:51 PM	#25
Trurolexer Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: USA Watch: 5513MaxiI+PreComex Posts: 18,421	Rich, just trust your heart. Buy watch because you like it, not because somebody said to you that watch is good. Good luck.

6 November 2009, 12:07 AM	#26
hflee55 "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Real Name: Andy Location: Kuala Lumpur, MY Watch: Me Watching You!! Posts: 3,260	233 forever!

6 November 2009, 01:20 AM	#27
mfer "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Real Name: Mik Location: USA Posts: 13,723	Exactly, just buy what you love. For me 270 For TR, Brainbizz, 233 Neither of us is wrong. There is no wrong decision here. The only thing that would even remotely come into play is do you want to wind it up all on your own. Isn't an issue with me and really should be on a 8 day PR. __________________ member#3242

6 November 2009, 03:27 AM	#28
Tommysol "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: California Posts: 591	For more on this subject...try this link... http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=48574

6 November 2009, 07:11 AM	#29
rotorcraft Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Real Name: Rich Location: NW Europe Watch: AP ROO Safari Posts: 58	Thanks to all of you for your advice, it's great to weigh up all the different perspectives. So... ....I went to the AD today and knew in the back of my mind that if the 233 he had was a K series with 'dot' I might just... ...several pleasant hours, cappuccinos, soda waters, hors d'oeuvres and a glass of pink Champagne later... I am the proud new owner of a new 233 (K)!

6 November 2009, 01:25 PM	#30
ocwatching "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Real Name: Phil Location: CA Posts: 5,374	Congrats!!!! I sure hope it was not the champagne...the 233k dot is awesome... __________________ too much into watches...

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