Flipping watches

[clb521]

Now before people start bashing me, I want to ask an honest question and see what everyone's opinion is.

If I or any other person on here is to but their names on the local AD lists for popular sports SS watches and they are able to get the watch at retail and they want to sell it without a huge price spike, what would you consider a fair mark up to sell it to a fellow forum member?

Also in looking at some of the current BNIB listings, some of the models are selling at very reasonable prices. For instance, their is a BNIB for a GMTIIC Batman for $10,495. Retail price for this watch is $8,950. Lets say your in CA (which is where I'm at) and you pay roughly 8% for tax. That means your out the door cost is $9,666. If your getting the full amount your asking and assume overnighting the watch insured is $100 then your profit is $729. And keep in mind this is a TS dealer so his profit may even be a little more. However lets just say for this discussion that this is a non watch dealer not making a living doing this. Would this be considered too much "profit" to ask for to provide a watch to someone who may otherwise be waiting months or years? If you consider this too much, what do you think a fair fee would be? $500, $400? What is considered an appropriate convenience fee?

Again, this is just a theoretical and I am not planning on doing this. But their is some benefit a person could get from this. If you purchase 1-2 watches a year at 10k average, this would start increasing your purchase volume from an AD which would give you the possibility of getting watches like the daytona.

The only down side I could possibly see is if the AD you purchase from found out and frowned upon you flipping but I would think most AD wouldn't care.

Also, I remember the thread from the newly joined person who got a daytona and bragged about it and flipped it and got severely bashed on here. I am not suggesting that at all.

Also, I am hoping this doesn't turn into a "people just getting into this hobby for a profit" bandwagon or "your doing this to just make money".

We all joined this forum because of our love of watches and the whole purpose of forums is to connect with people that have the same enjoyment and be able to network and at the same time help get a watch a little sooner than just putting your name on a list and just sitting back waiting.

Let the discussion begin.

[Fleetlord]

Yikes

[HogwldFLTR]

I'm pretty certain that selling hard to get pieces significantly under the going rate would be appreciated by many even with a profit made.

It's funny because just this evening I was pondering the enormous number of seller that flip watches on the forum. Not the one's who are selling at reasonable prices but the ones that are apparently trying to make a killing out of this. Some maybe making a living out of the practice. I was wondering how many started just as collectors and wanting to trade in so they could get some other watch which they liked more. I really am curious how so many came to be frequent sellers and apparently much more than just hobbyists.

[S/Z]

You've put a lot of thought and effort into this "theoretical" exercise for someone "not planning on doing this"

[clb521]

Originally Posted by S/Z

You've put a lot of thought and effort into this "theoretical" exercise for someone "not planning on doing this"

Yes. I think alot.... Is that so bad?

[American Jedi]

IF I SOLD. It would only because I just was not into the unit/fell out of love. I would sell retail+tax, and a modest amount for my time. That’s it.

[clb521]

Originally Posted by American Jedi

IF I SOLD. It would only because I just was not into the unit/fell out of love. I would sell retail+tax, and a modest amount for my time. That’s it.

What would you consider a modest amount?

[skiahh]

OK, let me toss another hypothetical in here, mostly because I doubt it'll happen, but who knows?

Let's say you asked an AD you've done business with in the past, but who is out of state, to put you on a list for a hard to get watch (i.e. Daytona, SkD blue) that you have not been able - for obvious reasons - to see in person or try on. They call with one of the watches for you and, of course, you buy it. Once it arrives and you try it on, you decide it doesn't suit you. Is selling it at that point "flipping" it (maybe you opt to maximize the profit, maybe you add a "fair" markup and list in the classifieds here; either way)? Or, to avoid the ire of the interwebz, are you stuck with said watch?

[clb521]

Originally Posted by skiahh

OK, let me toss another hypothetical in here, mostly because I doubt it'll happen, but who knows?

Let's say you asked an AD you've done business with in the past, but who is out of state, to put you on a list for a hard to get watch (i.e. Daytona, SkD blue) that you have not been able - for obvious reasons - to see in person or try on. They call with one of the watches for you and, of course, you buy it. Once it arrives and you try it on, you decide it doesn't suit you. Is selling it at that point "flipping" it (maybe you opt to maximize the profit, maybe you add a "fair" markup and list in the classifieds here; either way)? Or, to avoid the ire of the interwebz, are you stuck with said watch?

I have been lucky in that only 1 watch I bought was one I regretted and it wasn't because of how it looked but what it reminded me of. When I traded it a few months ago I got a watch I really wanted and now its my daily watch.

I had another one which I got but realized it was too blingy for me.

[exador]

Originally Posted by skiahh

Once it arrives and you try it on, you decide it doesn't suit you. Is selling it at that point "flipping” it

Of course it is. But flipping due to buyer’s remorse and doing so with the intention of making a fast buck are two different things...

[clb521]

This practice could have the effect of lowering the prices that the TS have in the classified which would benefit all members. Think about it if everyone asked for $500 over what they paid, it would impact most of the watches listed at the 1000's over retail being asked for now.

[Waddy1]

I don't see the point in telling anyone that you have other watches on a list and when they arrive flip them. Its your business at the end of the day. Unless you have told everyone on this forum and you are open to selling it to them, if so then its a different ball game.
I just part exed a watch and got more than I paid for it, I was more than happy with that, a friend offered me less than the Part Ex price, he offered what I paid. Obviously I am going for the better deal.

[tyler1980]

buying with the intent to sell it and not keep it is the issue. Flipping it for moderately less still makes you a flipper IMO. Its one thing to not bond with a watch and then sell it but buying with the intent to make money even if it is less than the going rate is what i would have an issue with. This hobby has become too much of a business.

Pass on the watch and hope the next person actually wants it. I wouldn't buy a watch whatever price from a secondary seller so i think its probably better to keep the supply chain at the AD where it belongs.

However if i end up not liking a watch and moving it later i will get the maximum i can out of it, but im not buying watches to sell so that is the distinction to me anyway.

[wytrader]

A couple of things come to mind.

The moment you would not pull the stickers off (admittedly I love doing this myself so ask to do so) in the shop is the moment I believe you cross the line.

I don't think buying the in demand SS sports watches will get your buying history up enough to get into Daytona territory. Buy a couple of PM models and you will be there much faster.

As for a fair price, I would suggest whatever you can get.

By taking an in demand watch at an AD you are taking up a spot. The next guy may be a flipper too but everyone in line is part of the traffic jam that has built up. It's everyone's right to so no need to excuse yourself by not trying to get the maximum you could. Seems odd to try and justify it by saying I didn't sell for super premium only a tiny premium.

[Castlesinthesky]

Originally Posted by tyler1980

buying with the intent to sell it and not keep it is the issue. Flipping it for moderately less still makes you a flipper IMO. Its one thing to not bond with a watch and then sell it but buying with the intent to make money even if it is less than the going rate is what i would have an issue with. This hobby has become too much of a business.

Pass on the watch and hope the next person actually wants it. I wouldn't buy a watch whatever price from a secondary seller so i think its probably better to keep the supply chain at the AD where it belongs.

However if i end up not liking a watch and moving it later i will get the maximum i can out of it, but im not buying watches to sell so that is the distinction to me anyway.

This is EXACTLY how I see the whole flipping / reselling thing too.
fwiw I was offered a SD43 quite a while ago but passed on it, it was too big for me really. I could have taken it and made a quick profit but I felt it was not the "right thing to do" so I left it for the next guy on the waiting list.

[Andad]

I only buy watches I like.

I have bought 100+ over the past 50 years.

I have given many to family and friends but have never sold or traded one.

YMMV.

[beshannon]

Originally Posted by clb521

What is considered an appropriate convenience fee?

You don't really like watches now do you.

[037]

Flipping for profit is only helping yourself no matter how you rationalize it. Reselling one or two pieces at close to market value because you don't like what you purchased as much as you thought you would is different.

Become part of the solution by not becoming part of the problem.

[1William]

I don't think that selling/flipping or what ever label we put on it is a bad thing. If I purchase a watch either through luck, connections or prior sales history what does it matter. I paid for it and it is my property. If I choose to sell it, trade it or gift it to a friend whose business is it other than mine. The market will determine the value and I would ask what the market will allow for a sale. With that said, I have not done this nor do I plan on it. Not because it is wrong but because I prefer to own watches and would and do roll them into another watch. I was either second or third on the Daytona-C list at my AD and I removed my name as the Daytona is too small for my tastes and I though someone else would enjoy it. Same with the new SS Pepsi and while I think it is beautiful, I would buy it for the hype. I did get the first Tudor GMT and am quite pleased. In the end I could care less what other do as I am focusing on what I do.

[SilverFoxUK]

I buy to wear, to enjoy. If in the future I am not wearing or enjoying, I will consider selling. I would then get the best price I could. It would be foolish not to, but if I felt guilty for any reason I could give the profit to a charity of my choice. On the other hand, if the out of favour watch is an appreciating asset, I can see the argument to hang on to it. Several dealers have said to me that I will never sell my green sub or BLNR GMT. I get that. That’s not why I bought them l, but given two pieces I liked equally, it’s good to know if you ever do sell then you have a good chance of not losing or maybe better. I am passionate about watches as I think most folks like on here are, but I defend a person’s right to do what they want with their property. ADs and the manufacturers can employ means to reduce quick profit flipping and I have no problem with that as that’s not my way.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by directioneng

I only buy watches I like.

I have bought 100+ over the past 50 years.

I have given many to family and friends but have never sold or traded one.

YMMV.

Have to agree mate but today to many Rolex are no longer watches bought to be worn and enjoyed they are now little more than £££££££$$$$$$$.

[Andad]

I don't know you 1William but that reads like grey dealer or watch seller to me.

And that is 'couldn't care less' . FYI.

[ROLEX MAN]

Originally Posted by directioneng

I only buy watches I like.

I have bought 100+ over the past 50 years.

I have given many to family and friends but have never sold or traded one.

YMMV.

I'm your friend!

[Andad]

You can be many things on the web Martin but there are always some who know.

Sorry I haven't called you yet but have been under it.
Now we have past eofy we will catch up.

[Brew]

Originally Posted by 1William

I don't think that selling/flipping or what ever label we put on it is a bad thing. If I purchase a watch either through luck, connections or prior sales history what does it matter. I paid for it and it is my property. If I choose to sell it, trade it or gift it to a friend whose business is it other than mine.

Then why must flippers drive the rest of us nuts with their ceaseless public threads?

[brandrea]

I wouldn’t put my name on a list at an AD for a reference I didn’t want to own.

If I buy a reference and I don’t bond with (which has happened) I will sell to a member here. It’s happened 3 times in my limited collecting and each time I sold the watch for exactly what I paid.

I could’ve maybe got more, but at that point, I’ve worn the watch for 6-12 months and it hasn’t cost me anything to do so. In the end, I hope it’s going to someone who will bond with it.

[ROLEX MAN]

Originally Posted by directioneng

You can be many things on the web Martin but there are always some who know.

Sorry I haven't called you yet but have been under it.
Now we have past eofy we will catch up.

I'm back from holidays, so whenever suits you!

[AK797]

If I changed my mind and wanted to sell a watch that had a high grey price I think I would just put 10% on it as a TRF mates rates, altho if it was someone here I knew I would sell it to them for retail ofc... but they would have to buy me dinner, so I'd only sell to someone who lives in a different continent.

[m j b]

If I were to sell a watch to a IRL friend, then it would be what I paid and that's it, no "convenience fee" or "buddy discount".

If I'm just going to sell it here or eBay or whatever, then I price it below average retail "asking" prices so that it will move. It is a real pain selling watches - or anything, really, these days, so rather than answering hundreds of emails and responding to offers that don't pan out, it's easier to just price it right.

I sold my car last week for asking price in 1 day. I asked the buyer, "should I have asked more?" and he laughed. Sure, maybe I could have gotten another $1000 or even more out of it, but it may have taken me a few weeks or months, and my time is too valuable.

[jrs146]

This question has come up dozens of times in the past and it seems to split the forums every time.

I’m a capitalist. I believe in free markets. I may not like the gray market or “flippers” but I can not judge anyone for trying to make a profit.

That being said I’m the guy who gets more enjoyment out of wearing an awesome watch than selling it for a few bucks more than I paid. Several people called me crazy when they saw that I actually kept my 126710... that’s just kind of sad. It’s like it’s assumed that someone will flip it for the easy profit. I got into this hobby to enjoy watches not to profit on them.

That doesn’t mean I’ll never sell a watch. I’ve sold my fair share. But I’m always buying with the intention of owning. There’s a difference!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk