Is this patina on my dial or damage?

[sportsfan0704]

Just picked up an early 90s bluesey in what seemed like mint condition. Sharp bezel, original insert, strong crown on clasp, etc. however I noticed what looked like a hair on the dial so I had the watchmaker open it up and look. It’s not a hair and the watchmaker said it upon inspection with loupe and open it looks like the beginning of patina rather than damage. Is it possible for it to start like this and spot?

It doesn’t look like drag on the hands or anything like that. And if you move the watch around in light you don’t see it, which also leads me to believe it’s not a scratch. The watch is in otherwise such good condition with original hands that it seems unlikely that something bad happened. Insight is appreciated. Thanks!


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[996marty]

I wouldn’t say it’s patina. Patina for me is when the whole dial shows signs of aging not just one spot

[espanol]

Patina and damage are the same.

[joli160]

Damage

[crowncollection]

Damage


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[sportsfan0704]

When the watchmaker removed the movement from the case and looked at the dial with a loup, he said it didn’t look like a scratch or something to that effect. Could it be the development of a spotting?

And yeah, I acknowledge that patina and damage are synonymous to some collectors.


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[brandrea]

Originally Posted by espanol

Patina and damage are the same.

I think you’re on to something

[GBD]

It could be the start of oxidation. If you look at the seconds hand around the center pinion, you can see oxidation there.

[sportsfan0704]

Here are three additional photos in natural light. You cannot even see that mark, especially when you turn the watch from side to side. Just normal new owner paranoia I hope!







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[sportsfan0704]

Also this is an S serial, a late 1991. So the watch definitely has some age to it!


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[omar-rye]

It could be a manufacturing defect or a mishandling mark from a previous service. It could be many things, but why would a dial naturally develop a spot in just one place from exposure to the elements? Is it possible? Sure, but I think the first two possibilities are more likely.

[Neil McCauley]

wait you guys can see something?

[sportsfan0704]

Originally Posted by omar-rye

It could be a manufacturing defect or a mishandling mark from a previous service. It could be many things, but why would a dial naturally develop a spot in just one place from exposure to the elements? Is it possible? Sure, but I think the first two possibilities are more likely.

The flip side of this is true also. Why would the dial get damaged in that one spot from handling? I feel like handling damage during service could be closer to where the hands attach. Obviously it’s all speculation. But I want to know because I just bought the watch!


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[sportsfan0704]

Originally Posted by brandrea

I think you’re on to something

I feel like patina is natural aging whereas damage is man made error


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[1259]

That’s just aged creamy patina.

[sportsfan0704]

Originally Posted by 1259

That’s just aged creamy patina.

On the dial?


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[Old Expat Beast]

You'll never know for sure, but it's part of your watch's history, so embrace it or at least accept it. The owner 100 years from now might have the same question.

[sportsfan0704]

Originally Posted by Old Expat Beast

You'll never know for sure, but it's part of your watch's history, so embrace it or at least accept it. The owner 100 years from now might have the same question.

That’s true! Is that how oxidation starts?


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[WatchTimes]

damage....

[M@2]

I'm glad my vision kinda sucks, I'd never notice small(ish) imperfections. I'd say, for a 33 year old watch, that looks pretty dang clean :)

[TimeLord2]

Originally Posted by omar-rye

It could be a manufacturing defect or a mishandling mark from a previous service. It could be many things, but why would a dial naturally develop a spot in just one place from exposure to the elements? Is it possible? Sure, but I think the first two possibilities are more likely.

Omar-Rye, your explanation seems the most valid to me.

Patina is usually a uniform change of color like the tritium luminescent material turning from white to creamy yellowish tones. That said, some dials start to blister from paint defects, and that I would call damage. Some of those paint defects can enhance the overall appearance as long as it doesn't delaminate from the substrate. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Looks like your dial also has a faint purplish hue, which is a know defect with this reference. I for one love the purple hues that develop over time..

My bet, like Omar's, is damage from a service or a slight imperfection in the dial paint. I don't think it will expand to the rest of the dial. It is a beautiful watch and for being 33 years old it looks great!

[AF_Rob]

Originally Posted by espanol

Patina and damage are the same.

Thought the same thing when I read the title.

[daysky1]

Since you've already had a watchmaker open it up and look at it I'm sure he used the loop and was able to get a very clear up close picture of what's going on. I would just trust what he said and enjoy the watch it looks great, congratulations.

[928ktgold]

It looks like damage when the pry off the hands with those levers. It’s in the right spot, b it but who cares your got an old bluesy with beautiful purple patina dial!

[Rolex1982]

It’s part of a 30 year old watch. If you wanted a perfect watch like new you should buy new. This adds to the character of the watch in my opinion.

[sportsfan0704]

Originally Posted by 928ktgold

It looks like damage when the pry off the hands with those levers. It’s in the right spot, b it but who cares your got an old bluesy with beautiful purple patina dial!

That is my suspicion as well. If it was just a spot, I’d say it’s likely patina, as the lume plots have aged nicely. The fact it is a spot and accompanied by a faint line upwards makes me believe it was damage, regardless of what the watchmaker said (he works for the seller, so…). It would be a lovely watch without it, and it is a grail, but I don’t think it’s a good idea to settle when it comes to a known imperfection on a watch you so badly desire.


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[jimcameron]

Those shoes look like they have some patina on them.

[928ktgold]

The case looks so good though. Just keep it. Hard to find one like that

[L_S_SHOE]

Whatever it is, it doesn’t really matter.

The watch is over 30 years old. Replacing the dial would do more damage to the value of the watch than that defect, so you’re pretty much stuck with it. But, it’s still a very good looking watch, and it has character.


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[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by GBD

It could be the start of oxidation. If you look at the seconds hand around the center pinion, you can see oxidation there.

This! I believe it is oxidation that causes patina. It is barely noticeable at first, as in this case, and progresses very slowly.. I wouldn’t worry about it. Just enjoy your beautiful watch. It’s lovely.

Kat


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