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vman · 17 February 2008, 01:51 PM

I got up at 6AM this morning to prepare myself for a trip to AD. Today was supposed to be the day. Unfortunately, after looking at Subs I came home empty handed. For some reason I did not expect Rolex to be what it was in terms of quality and looks when compared to other watches.

I looked at the inventory at Shreve and Co. located in San Francisco. First of all, the sales person was completely clueless. I asked her if there were any COSC Subs in stock and she said that only Sub dates had certification. When I tried to explain about the latest model that came in mid 2007, I lost her. Then I asked her for an LV, she did not know what it was. WTF? I have large wrists and the Subs looked tiny plus the bracelets were, well, not the ones that I would expect to find on fine watches. I compared this to Omega and to be honest with you I ran out of the store because I did not want to get an Omega instead of a Rollie. Seamaster just felt like a tool watch compared to a Sub. I did not want to make any spontaneous decisions and chose to stay away from any buys until I got home. Rolex is a fine watch, but it simply did not smile at me.

The only hope is a Sea Dweller. They did not have any in stock and I am going to check them out at another location. If SDs feel like Subs, then I'll end up getting something else... Here goes dream :(

frostie · 17 February 2008, 01:54 PM

The most important thing is that you did what you really feel. If rolex watches don't smile at you it's ok there are so many other brands

Hope that you are going to be able to find a Sea Dweller

Alcan · 17 February 2008, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vman

Rolex is a fine watch, but it simply did not smile at me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by frostie

The most important thing is that you did what you really feel. If rolex watches don't smile at you it's ok there are so many other brands

Velitsko nailed it. If a Rolex doesn't do it for you, keep looking. You'll eventually find just what you had your heart set on.

applebook · 17 February 2008, 02:15 PM

So you've never seen an Oyster bracelet before, not even in pictures? What were you expecting?

I like the overall construction of OMEGA bracelets, but their use of pins is cheap as well. The only bracelets on watches under $7K that are truly great are from JLC, IWC, and a few other companies.

As for the size of the SD, it's exactly the same size as the Sub, except thicker. The Sub is actually thicker than the Seamaster, which is only 1mm larger in diameter than a Sub. Overall, the Seamaster should seem about the same size as the Sub.

Your post is confusing.

vman · 17 February 2008, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by applebook

So you've never seen an Oyster bracelet before, not even in pictures? What were you expecting?

I have seen it before, I just did not expect it to be so flimsy. This was the first time I got to see watches so close together (even went to Torneau to compare just one more time) and it was not something that I expected at all. To freaking flimsy, if you ask me. I love to go camping, hiking and be active and I am basically looking for a quality everyday watch (dress watches are another subject) that I can have for years and years and years. I love the design of the Sub, but to be honest with you the ruggedness was not there...

I am confused as you're :) I've always wanted to have a quality watch and Rolex was my first choice. Unfortunately, I do not want to spend $$$ so I can just have a dream that I no longer like. 45mm PO felt more stable and rugged on my hand, but I did not really want an Omega.

Leighton · 17 February 2008, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vman

...but I did not really want an Omega.

Nothing wrong with an Omega.... I've got one and love it..... Did you try on a GMT IIc? The new bracelet is much nicer.

puffnmo · 17 February 2008, 05:18 PM

I have only one word to say - PANERAI.

fear · 17 February 2008, 08:07 PM

Vman, you gotta be kidding right? Omega make nice trendy watches. Tool watch? I can understand how the the Speedy Pro is. Please tell us how the Bond Seamasters are tool watches?

I'll start.

Tools · 18 February 2008, 02:43 AM

Rolex isn't for everybody..

If it was, nobody else would be in business... and there are other fine offerings out there.

As for the bracelet....Rolex is one of those watches that people wear every day, in all conditions.. and the Bracelet has proven its sturdness and capability.. Many other watches in this price range are safe queens or only taken out for special occassions..

Still, in the end, you are the one that is going to wear it, so get what you feeel comfortable with..

haakon59 · 18 February 2008, 05:25 AM

If you don't like Rolex and Omega, you could look at Breitling, Panerai, and Girard-Perregaux. In fact, the Girard-Perregaux Seahawk II is a pretty solid watch and has a significant crown guard and a highly regarded proprietary movement.

Jedi · 17 February 2008, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vman

I have seen it before, I just did not expect it to be so flimsy. This was the first time I got to see watches so close together (even went to Torneau to compare just one more time) and it was not something that I expected at all. To freaking flimsy, if you ask me. I love to go camping, hiking and be active and I am basically looking for a quality everyday watch (dress watches are another subject) that I can have for years and years and years. I love the design of the Sub, but to be honest with you the ruggedness was not there...

I am confused as you're :) I've always wanted to have a quality watch and Rolex was my first choice. Unfortunately, I do not want to spend $$$ so I can just have a dream that I no longer like. 45mm PO felt more stable and rugged on my hand, but I did not really want an Omega.

I've been 4WD'ing, camping, fishing and sailing with both my Sub Date and Speedmaster Automatic (Baby moon-watch). The Sub Date performed briliiantly each time, with situations where I thought I'd damaged it, a quick rinse in the ocean or in a river revealed that no permanent damage had been done save for a few scrapes. Vibrations from driving, knocks and scrapes from hauling sheets and sails, bangs on boulders, equipment, engines... solid performer.

With the Speedy on the other hand; bracelet failure on a fishing boat, probably due to repetitive casting and striking at fish, almost lost the damn thing overboard had my sleeve not somehow restrained it; once when hauling in a spinnaker on our race boat, the bezel ripped right off and became a ninja-like spinning disc.

I'll choose a Rolex over an Omega any day.

My 2cts worth... And if you want a real tool appearance on the Sub, get a black or regimental NATO strap to go with.

padi56 · 17 February 2008, 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vman

I have seen it before, I just did not expect it to be so flimsy. This was the first time I got to see watches so close together (even went to Torneau to compare just one more time) and it was not something that I expected at all. To freaking flimsy, if you ask me. I love to go camping, hiking and be active and I am basically looking for a quality everyday watch (dress watches are another subject) that I can have for years and years and years. I love the design of the Sub, but to be honest with you the ruggedness was not there...

I am confused as you're :) I've always wanted to have a quality watch and Rolex was my first choice. Unfortunately, I do not want to spend $$$ so I can just have a dream that I no longer like. 45mm PO felt more stable and rugged on my hand, but I did not really want an Omega.

Would agree may look like you say flimsy but the Oyster bracelet now has been around now for 40 years plus with very very little change.It has stood up to the job,in a lot more difficult environments than your average Rolex wearer today will.Take the Comex Sub and the SD, same bracelet these watches have a very hard life.Myself been around Rolex watches for 30 plus years not heard of one thats failed.The Oyster bracelet is as strong as many others out there,and as for like your quote (ruggedness) does not equate to weight etc.The Sub has been around for 50 plus years and there are still many of those original watches still ticking is that rugged enough for you.And I can assure any Rolex will stand up to camping, hiking,and any activity you give it.This is not a plug for Rolex what I am saying Rolex are as tough as any other brand out today,and in most departments tougher.But its all down to what you like you are the buyer wearer, the above are just a Rolex wearers true facts.

David1971 · 17 February 2008, 08:07 PM

Try the Milgauss or GMTII-c, they have the new clasp and solid centrelink bracelet.

-David

DSJ · 18 February 2008, 12:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vman

I have seen it before, I just did not expect it to be so flimsy. This was the first time I got to see watches so close together (even went to Torneau to compare just one more time) and it was not something that I expected at all. To freaking flimsy, if you ask me. I love to go camping, hiking and be active and I am basically looking for a quality everyday watch (dress watches are another subject) that I can have for years and years and years. I love the design of the Sub, but to be honest with you the ruggedness was not there...

I am confused as you're :) I've always wanted to have a quality watch and Rolex was my first choice. Unfortunately, I do not want to spend $$$ so I can just have a dream that I no longer like. 45mm PO felt more stable and rugged on my hand, but I did not really want an Omega.

Lots of good advice here vman. They were thinking the same things I was about the GMT2c. They probably didn't have the GMT2C there (it wasn't there when I was in 2 weeks ago), but they may have one at Stanford. Also call Jade Galore. And there is NOTHING wrong with an Omega PO. Even our JJ owned one for a while.

vman · 18 February 2008, 01:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DSJ

Lots of good advice here vman. They were thinking the same things I was about the GMT2c. They probably didn't have the GMT2C there (it wasn't there when I was in 2 weeks ago), but they may have one at Stanford. Also call Jade Galore. And there is NOTHING wrong with an Omega PO. Even our JJ owned one for a while.

Thanks man! I am going to Stanford today to see what is up. Yesterday the sales person was pre-occupied with upgrading a wealthy gentleman (he was going from a DJ to something more expensive). Since I was just looking for a watch, they did not give me any attention. Too bad, I had $$$ in the pocket :)

I'll take a look at GMT-IIc to see how it compares to the rest of them. So far, PO is my safe bet. I would love to try on an SD as well though.

As for the definition of the real tool watch, I think that it is up to the owner. I simply prefer the models that have more weight and feel solid. My Citizen lived through 2 motorcycle accidents and is still on my wrist w/o problems :)

bwalkerVintage · 18 February 2008, 02:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vman

As for the definition of the real tool watch, I think that it is up to the owner. I simply prefer the models that have more weight and feel solid.

I figured that was what you were looking for - a real solid feeling watch.

The Rolex tool watches were designed to fulfill a certain purpose (i.e., a tool) and all were designed to maximize strength while minimizing weight (sounds great to me). They do this so effectively, that you can forget the watch is even there. I personally don't want a watch for my everyday use that is going to be obtrusive.

fear · 18 February 2008, 07:45 AM

"As for the definition of the real tool watch, I think that it is up to the owner."

To a point "tool" can be subjective. Whatever watch you use for hard activity can be a "tool" watch. In the "Every Rolex Tells a Story" testimonies several non-tool Rolex styles withstood extreme conditions. The ones that are marketed as "tool" are the sports models. These sports models are the toughest watches around. On the dive-net website the author even used his "tool" Submariners and his supercased GMT Master beyond's rated depths.

Objectively, Rolex sport models ARE tool watches. Rolex says they are and the watches have proven themselves.

Similarly with the Omega Speedmaster Pro. Everyone knows that it IS a space "tool" watch.

You lean towards the Seamasters because subjectively you believe it's a 'tool" watch. You think it can withstand you using it for hiking and camping. Sure. It's in the sports line, it has heft built like a Hummer and in the movies James Bond get shot up wearing one. That should not be the standard (if everyone agrees that "tool" means something that can withstand extreme conditions) of a "tool" watch. Where are the life and death stories, where's "Every Seamaster Tells a Story?"

"I simply prefer the models that have more weight and feel solid."

TRFers are suggesting the supercased GMT II, go for that if you like. Personally, I like the streamlined "older" models. But the the supercased GMTs has heft and the bracelet's more modern. Get Panerai, GP, Omega for big, chunky watches. But know this, (yes, I'm beating this horse pretty hard) everyone and his brother knows that Rolex sports line are true-blue tool watches. Rolex sport models are what other brands want to be.

JBat · 18 February 2008, 04:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vman

I have seen it before, I just did not expect it to be so flimsy. This was the first time I got to see watches so close together (even went to Torneau to compare just one more time) and it was not something that I expected at all. To freaking flimsy, if you ask me. I love to go camping, hiking and be active and I am basically looking for a quality everyday watch (dress watches are another subject) that I can have for years and years and years. I love the design of the Sub, but to be honest with you the ruggedness was not there...

I am confused as you're :) I've always wanted to have a quality watch and Rolex was my first choice. Unfortunately, I do not want to spend $$$ so I can just have a dream that I no longer like. 45mm PO felt more stable and rugged on my hand, but I did not really want an Omega.

Dude, the Submariner has been used as a professional divers watch for decades now. Do you honestly think it cannot stand up to your hiking and camping activities? I'm here to tell you it can. I agree that the bracelet could be better, especially the clasp, but it's plenty strong enough for anything you can dish out. Decades of history bear that out.

frostie · 18 February 2008, 04:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBat

Dude, the Submariner has been used as a professional divers watch for decades now. Do you honestly think it cannot stand up to your hiking and camping activities? I'm here to tell you it can. I agree that the bracelet could be better, especially the clasp, but it's plenty strong enough for anything you can dish out. Decades of history bear that out.

Very good point there Jbat

kingblackbolt · 18 February 2008, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vman

I've always wanted to have a quality watch and Rolex was my first choice. Unfortunately, I do not want to spend $$$ so I can just have a dream that I no longer like. 45mm PO felt more stable and rugged on my hand, but I did not really want an Omega.

Sorry to hear that... Rolex is a true icon of watches especially the Sub but there is nothing wrong with trying the other brands like the 45m PO you mentioned... I just bought one myself and could'nt be happier! Of course if the rumors are true you may want to hold out for the new 44m Seadweller but who really knows when those will be out?

vman · 18 February 2008, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kingblackbolt

Sorry to hear that... Rolex is a true icon of watches especially the Sub but there is nothing wrong with trying the other brands like the 45m PO you mentioned... I just bought one myself and could'nt be happier! Of course if the rumors are true you may want to hold out for the new 44m Seadweller but who really knows when those will be out?

AD told me that Rolex will probably update the dials as GMT-IIc has been proven to be a major step forward. However, when I inquired about any possible changes to the Sub line, there was no response. These watches are selling like hot cakes! I agree with people on this board that a time proven design is not worth changing because it is what makes Rolex stand out.

I will be back for GMT-IIc. Loved that thing, but PAM wowed me today the most. SD feels solid as it is. For me it was night and day compared to the Sub. However, different strokes for different folks. I guess I just prefer larger watches :)

Ciao,
/v

DS/B MINI S · 19 February 2008, 03:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vman

SD feels solid as it is. For me it was night and day compared to the Sub.

Now, you understand why the decision was easy for me

chevycorvette · 17 February 2008, 02:21 PM

sub not good for you.

hope attached one is big enough.

keep searching. or try other brand . daytona should be ur choice becuase it is a big watch

JBat · 18 February 2008, 04:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chevycorvette

sub not good for you.

hope attached one is big enough.

keep searching. or try other brand . daytona should be ur choice becuase it is a big watch

CoopJr · 17 February 2008, 02:25 PM

If the Sub didn't do it for you, chances are the SD won't either. That's OK, at least you didn't make a 5K purchase that you were not sure of...that was smart. I saw some nice Tags at the same AD where I bought my LV from the other night. Omega Speedmaster is a fine watch too.

Incurable · 17 February 2008, 02:38 PM

Different strokes... I must admit some surprise at your characterization of the Sub as 'flimsy'. My first 14060 aways stuck me as a tank, if nothing else. The quality of workmanship and materials also struck me as impressive. The design is not overt but overall the watch imbued class and quality to me. Especially compared to previous and lesser brands.

Keep looking and I'm sure you'll find something to your liking. The SD is more robust than the Sub for sure. The bracelet, clasp aside, you'll find much the same. Find a SD and maybe it'll speak to you. Good luck...

applebook · 17 February 2008, 02:41 PM

Coop is right. The SD is exactly the same as the Sub, with a few key exceptions. Quality is about the same.

OMEGAs are fine quality. Why do you not want an OMEGA, especially when a Seamaster goes for well under half the price of a Sub? The SMP bracelet, like most have mentioned, has one undesirable issue at this price point: push-pins instead of screws. Other than that, OMEGAs are generally comparable in case, movement, etc. quality with Rolex. Buy the watch, not just the name.

sharif · 17 February 2008, 02:45 PM

The current sub bracelet has a flimsy....dare I say....cheap feeling to it, when compared to other fine swiss watches.

You should have tried the newer bracelets, such as the GMTIIc...I think you would have jumped all over it.

cmr · 17 February 2008, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sharif

The current sub bracelet has a flimsy....dare I say....cheap feeling to it, when compared to other fine swiss watches.

You should have tried the newer bracelets, such as the GMTIIc...I think you would have jumped all over it.

i agree, the normal oyster bracelet with the stamped sheet metal bracelet feels, sounds and looks flimsy. i have heard hundreds of complaints about this very subject and i don't like them myself. go back and try the gmt2c. the bracelet and clasp is that of a fine watch i promise you. the watch also looks good on a big wrist because of the new case design. i have 8 inch wrists and it looks ok on me. a sub almost looks like a mid size watch on me.

jp1316 · 17 February 2008, 02:51 PM

About five years ago I had a very similar experience. I had always wanted a Roles and I got to a jeweler and tried one on at the same time I tried on and Omega SMP. I thought the SMP (mostly because fo the bracelet) just blew the Rolex away. Many watches since, I am convinced that Rolex, including the bracelet is the better watch (for me-which is the only thing that matters). IMHO if you wanted the Rolex to start, you will have one or many eventually and if you buy on the first time, you may save yourself some money.

17 February 2008, 01:51 PM	#1
vman "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Real Name: Capt Swerve Location: North Carolina Watch: less TV Posts: 2,230	Major disappointment... I got up at 6AM this morning to prepare myself for a trip to AD. Today was supposed to be the day. Unfortunately, after looking at Subs I came home empty handed. For some reason I did not expect Rolex to be what it was in terms of quality and looks when compared to other watches. I looked at the inventory at Shreve and Co. located in San Francisco. First of all, the sales person was completely clueless. I asked her if there were any COSC Subs in stock and she said that only Sub dates had certification. When I tried to explain about the latest model that came in mid 2007, I lost her. Then I asked her for an LV, she did not know what it was. WTF? I have large wrists and the Subs looked tiny plus the bracelets were, well, not the ones that I would expect to find on fine watches. I compared this to Omega and to be honest with you I ran out of the store because I did not want to get an Omega instead of a Rollie. Seamaster just felt like a tool watch compared to a Sub. I did not want to make any spontaneous decisions and chose to stay away from any buys until I got home. Rolex is a fine watch, but it simply did not smile at me. The only hope is a Sea Dweller. They did not have any in stock and I am going to check them out at another location. If SDs feel like Subs, then I'll end up getting something else... Here goes dream :(

17 February 2008, 01:54 PM	#2
frostie 1,000,000th PostMember Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Earth Posts: 14,048	The most important thing is that you did what you really feel. If rolex watches don't smile at you it's ok there are so many other brands Hope that you are going to be able to find a Sea Dweller __________________ GMT - Master II C - 116710 LN

17 February 2008, 02:15 PM	#4
applebook "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: vancouver Posts: 1,918	So you've never seen an Oyster bracelet before, not even in pictures? What were you expecting? I like the overall construction of OMEGA bracelets, but their use of pins is cheap as well. The only bracelets on watches under $7K that are truly great are from JLC, IWC, and a few other companies. As for the size of the SD, it's exactly the same size as the Sub, except thicker. The Sub is actually thicker than the Seamaster, which is only 1mm larger in diameter than a Sub. Overall, the Seamaster should seem about the same size as the Sub. Your post is confusing. __________________

17 February 2008, 08:07 PM	#8
fear "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Mililani, Oahu Posts: 1,307	Vman, you gotta be kidding right? Omega make nice trendy watches. Tool watch? I can understand how the the Speedy Pro is. Please tell us how the Bond Seamasters are tool watches? I'll start. Attached Images

18 February 2008, 02:43 AM	#9
Tools TRF Moderator & 2025 SubTT Patron Join Date: May 2007 Real Name: Larry Location: Mojave Desert Watch: GMT's Posts: 44,083	Rolex isn't for everybody.. If it was, nobody else would be in business... and there are other fine offerings out there. As for the bracelet....Rolex is one of those watches that people wear every day, in all conditions.. and the Bracelet has proven its sturdness and capability.. Many other watches in this price range are safe queens or only taken out for special occassions.. Still, in the end, you are the one that is going to wear it, so get what you feeel comfortable with.. __________________ (Chill ... It's just a watch Forum.....) NAWCC Member

17 February 2008, 05:18 PM	#7
puffnmo Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 848	I have only one word to say - PANERAI.

18 February 2008, 05:25 AM	#10
haakon59 "TRF" Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Seattle Posts: 1,571	If you don't like Rolex and Omega, you could look at Breitling, Panerai, and Girard-Perregaux. In fact, the Girard-Perregaux Seahawk II is a pretty solid watch and has a significant crown guard and a highly regarded proprietary movement.

17 February 2008, 08:07 PM	#13
David1971 Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Sweden Watch: PAM 00005 Posts: 202	Try the Milgauss or GMTII-c, they have the new clasp and solid centrelink bracelet. -David

18 February 2008, 07:45 AM	#17
fear "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Mililani, Oahu Posts: 1,307	"As for the definition of the real tool watch, I think that it is up to the owner." To a point "tool" can be subjective. Whatever watch you use for hard activity can be a "tool" watch. In the "Every Rolex Tells a Story" testimonies several non-tool Rolex styles withstood extreme conditions. The ones that are marketed as "tool" are the sports models. These sports models are the toughest watches around. On the dive-net website the author even used his "tool" Submariners and his supercased GMT Master beyond's rated depths. Objectively, Rolex sport models ARE tool watches. Rolex says they are and the watches have proven themselves. Similarly with the Omega Speedmaster Pro. Everyone knows that it IS a space "tool" watch. You lean towards the Seamasters because subjectively you believe it's a 'tool" watch. You think it can withstand you using it for hiking and camping. Sure. It's in the sports line, it has heft built like a Hummer and in the movies James Bond get shot up wearing one. That should not be the standard (if everyone agrees that "tool" means something that can withstand extreme conditions) of a "tool" watch. Where are the life and death stories, where's "Every Seamaster Tells a Story?" "I simply prefer the models that have more weight and feel solid." TRFers are suggesting the supercased GMT II, go for that if you like. Personally, I like the streamlined "older" models. But the the supercased GMTs has heft and the bracelet's more modern. Get Panerai, GP, Omega for big, chunky watches. But know this, (yes, I'm beating this horse pretty hard) everyone and his brother knows that Rolex sports line are true-blue tool watches. Rolex sport models are what other brands want to be.

17 February 2008, 02:21 PM	#23
chevycorvette "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Real Name: willie Location: pie hole Watch: still looking Posts: 924	sub not good for you. hope attached one is big enough. keep searching. or try other brand . daytona should be ur choice becuase it is a big watch Attached Images

17 February 2008, 02:25 PM	#25
CoopJr "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Real Name: Coop Location: U.S.A. Watch: Subs Posts: 6,455	If the Sub didn't do it for you, chances are the SD won't either. That's OK, at least you didn't make a 5K purchase that you were not sure of...that was smart. I saw some nice Tags at the same AD where I bought my LV from the other night. Omega Speedmaster is a fine watch too.

17 February 2008, 02:38 PM	#26
Incurable "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Real Name: Pat Location: PNW Watch: your P's and Q's Posts: 2,549	Different strokes... I must admit some surprise at your characterization of the Sub as 'flimsy'. My first 14060 aways stuck me as a tank, if nothing else. The quality of workmanship and materials also struck me as impressive. The design is not overt but overall the watch imbued class and quality to me. Especially compared to previous and lesser brands. Keep looking and I'm sure you'll find something to your liking. The SD is more robust than the Sub for sure. The bracelet, clasp aside, you'll find much the same. Find a SD and maybe it'll speak to you. Good luck... __________________ Rolex GMT Master II 16710 (Blk/Blk) Rolex Explorer 114270 Sinn 356 Sa Flieger Limes Endurance 1Tausend Too many others... #2592 It may seem like I'm doing nothing but, at a cellular level, I'm actually quite busy...

17 February 2008, 02:41 PM	#27
applebook "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: vancouver Posts: 1,918	Coop is right. The SD is exactly the same as the Sub, with a few key exceptions. Quality is about the same. OMEGAs are fine quality. Why do you not want an OMEGA, especially when a Seamaster goes for well under half the price of a Sub? The SMP bracelet, like most have mentioned, has one undesirable issue at this price point: push-pins instead of screws. Other than that, OMEGAs are generally comparable in case, movement, etc. quality with Rolex. Buy the watch, not just the name. __________________

17 February 2008, 02:45 PM	#28
sharif Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: South East USA Posts: 671	The current sub bracelet has a flimsy....dare I say....cheap feeling to it, when compared to other fine swiss watches. You should have tried the newer bracelets, such as the GMTIIc...I think you would have jumped all over it.

17 February 2008, 02:51 PM	#30
jp1316 "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: East Coast Posts: 179	About five years ago I had a very similar experience. I had always wanted a Roles and I got to a jeweler and tried one on at the same time I tried on and Omega SMP. I thought the SMP (mostly because fo the bracelet) just blew the Rolex away. Many watches since, I am convinced that Rolex, including the bracelet is the better watch (for me-which is the only thing that matters). IMHO if you wanted the Rolex to start, you will have one or many eventually and if you buy on the first time, you may save yourself some money.

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