Afraid of flying

[redshirt1957]

What is interesting about some of these posts is that the most dangerous times to fly were during "The Golden Years" of aviation. I, for one, am glad those days are long gone. I have done my share of circling NDB approaches at night and I say good riddence. I now fly wth synthetic vision in a light twin. Man, I love technology. I know many APs and IPs and it is their rear if they sign off on a squawk, knowing there is a dangerous situation.

[Kenny147]

Originally Posted by redshirt1957

What is interesting about some of these posts is that the most dangerous times to fly were during "The Golden Years" of aviation. I, for one, am glad those days are long gone. I have done my share of circling NDB approaches at night and I say good riddence. I now fly wth synthetic vision in a light twin. Man, I love technology. I know many APs and IPs and it is their rear if they sign off on a squawk, knowing there is a dangerous situation.

Aw, come on Bubba. It took a real pilot to fly an NDB approach down to mins at night and then circle!! You're just getting soft.....

To be honest though, even though I have a panel full of fancy CRT's, I still like to have an "old fashioned" RMI needle up on my primary screen.

I do wonder if it's a step in the right direction to be training students on G1000 equipped aircraft from day one. Will they really be able to handle an electrical failure at night in IMC? The litmus test for me when I was about to sign off an I/R student for their checkride was to see if they could do a single-engine, partial panel NDB approach. If you can do that, anything else is simple.

[jeangtd]

yes technology has made it easier and safer to fly

[redshirt1957]

Originally Posted by Kenny147

Aw, come on Bubba. It took a real pilot to fly an NDB approach down to mins at night and then circle!! You're just getting soft.....

To be honest though, even though I have a panel full of fancy CRT's, I still like to have an "old fashioned" RMI needle up on my primary screen.

I do wonder if it's a step in the right direction to be training students on G1000 equipped aircraft from day one. Will they really be able to handle an electrical failure at night in IMC? The litmus test for me when I was about to sign off an I/R student for their checkride was to see if they could do a single-engine, partial panel NDB approach. If you can do that, anything else is simple.

I understand exactly what you mean. All my students get the AHRS fuse pulled in various situations, for sure under the hood at night, to see and guage their reactions. I mostly teach in a DA42, which has the Garmin 1000, and what is funny is that the few times I lose situational awareness, I still refer to the HSI for guidance. Old habits die hard.

[redshirt1957]

I thought this thread would have crashed and burned by now.

[305GMTIIc]

Originally Posted by jeangtd

All i'm trying to say is that companies should not take even a 5% risk of a part failing

Well, how about the flight in Buffalo? ATR aircraft. In the late 90's same thing happened outside of Pittsburgh PA. Inspector General Mary Schiavo (read her book) PROVED ATR had well documented evidence that the De-Icing Boots on the wings were a design FLAW! But the manufacturer and FAA refused to retrofit the aircraft due to cost.

Im not the one who is crazy. Those defending the actions of the FAA and Industry corporatism style regulation are. B-737's? No PROBLEM??? are you kidding? Funny because many industry whistleblowers including the Federal Oversight Institutions have documented TIME AND AGAIN that Boeing Co. refused to address the issue with the B737 and refused to retrofit the CVR to record after catastrophic failure. "Too expensive" the FAA and Boeing agreed.

The list is long.

As far as ValueJet, The inspector General had a mountain of evidence to prove they should have been shut down and grounded long before that. NOT the shipper's fault friend. It was Value Jet's fault and it says as much in the report.

Ironic though because Schiavo speaks about the industry's persistence of the
party line" of safer than driving etc.

Did you explain the ATC overhaul promised in 1985 but not delivered due to a federal investigation that revealed it was antiquated and dangerous in 1974? Or is it still totally safe and all that.

Just a good discussion since a plane crashed just a few days ago after you went on about how the FAA would never let planes fly if there was any KNOWN risk! Your right though. The de-icing boot problem would be kept between the NTSB and the ATR co. This way the FAA could say "we didn't officially know" Carry on and tell me how safe flying is? Subtract 51 people from the plant who believed "its safer than driving" and all the wind.

[redshirt1957]

Originally Posted by 305GMTIIc

Well, how about the flight in Buffalo? ATR aircraft. In the late 90's same thing happened outside of Pittsburgh PA. Inspector General Mary Schiavo (read her book) PROVED ATR had well documented evidence that the De-Icing Boots on the wings were a design FLAW! But the manufacturer and FAA refused to retrofit the aircraft due to cost.

Im not the one who is crazy. Those defending the actions of the FAA and Industry corporatism style regulation are. B-737's? No PROBLEM??? are you kidding? Funny because many industry whistleblowers including the Federal Oversight Institutions have documented TIME AND AGAIN that Boeing Co. refused to address the issue with the B737 and refused to retrofit the CVR to record after catastrophic failure. "Too expensive" the FAA and Boeing agreed.

The list is long.

As far as ValueJet, The inspector General had a mountain of evidence to prove they should have been shut down and grounded long before that. NOT the shipper's fault friend. It was Value Jet's fault and it says as much in the report.

Ironic though because Schiavo speaks about the industry's persistence of the
party line" of safer than driving etc.

Did you explain the ATC overhaul promised in 1985 but not delivered due to a federal investigation that revealed it was antiquated and dangerous in 1974? Or is it still totally safe and all that.

Just a good discussion since a plane crashed just a few days ago after you went on about how the FAA would never let planes fly if there was any KNOWN risk! Your right though. The de-icing boot problem would be kept between the NTSB and the ATR co. This way the FAA could say "we didn't officially know" Carry on and tell me how safe flying is? Subtract 51 people from the plant who believed "its safer than driving" and all the wind.

Your point has been made, many times. Your last statement is crass and in poor taste. Your choice though.

[jeangtd]

I'm still affraid of flying.......

[Taffi Abernathy]

I facilitated a Fear of Flying treatment program a while back. It consisted of 3 days of teaching cognitive-behavioral techniques to assist group members in reducing their anxieties and culminated in a short flight to Boston. I also enlisted the assistance of a pilot who explained the mechanics of flying and responded to technical questions. Interestingly, the groups were comprised of clients representing all age groups, some of whom had had prior aversive flying experiences, say, they endured a particularly turbulent flight, and others who had never flown before. (The majority of the American public does not fly. Given increasing concerns about terrorism, and with the advent of recent airplane incidents, the number of nonflyers is no doubt increasing.)

My recommendations are as follows . . . This fear/phobia is highly amenable to treatment and I suggest you contact a clinician in your area who is experienced in treating this particular issue (contact local psychological/psychiatric assocs). BTW, the difference between a fear and a phobia is people who are fearful still engage in the activity albeit with high anxiety. Phobias are marked by anxious avoidance since the individual will avoid the feared condition/stimulus at all costs. If you need medication to fly then my belief is better to walk with a crutch than not walk at all; you can wean off meds as your comfort level increases. Also, think about contacting airlines themselves since they often are an excellent referral source for fear of flying treatments. Finally, there are some excellent Fear of Flying tapes/DVDs you can purchase and carry with you on the flight to assist you in mitigating anxiety. (If you cannot find this on your own, send me a PM and I'll see if I can help you.) The most important thing is that you take a flight which is long enough whereby your anxiety level has an opportunity to peak and then dissipate, in other words, make certain your flight is at least one hour long. Anything shorter might cause high anxiety but not provide you with the opportunity for the anxiety to resolve, thus inadvertently exacerbating your fears. Do not give up! I have personally witnessed that almost everyone who sought treatment for this problem improved. I hope this was helpful. Taffi

[Hatchet]

305, is that a troll mask in your avatar?

[BondandBigM]

I think you are blowing it all out of proportion myself.

Revert to option one before and if there is a problem, during the flight and you'll be fine.

[Paulie]

http://askthepilot.com/book.html :) :) :)

On Patrick Smith's site, he has very nice section with air travel facts. He used to do private phone calls to help people with their fear, but doesn't appear to do that any more. Probably because he now actually has a flying job again, to go along with his Salon.com weekly column.

[jeangtd]

so how about that plane that fell apart in 3 pieces!

[Rockrolex]

Originally Posted by jeangtd

so how about that plane that fell apart in 3 pieces!

It just shows how far safety technology has come. Years ago, that type of crash would most likely have been much worse. But with advances in technology, crashes have become more surivivable.

Look, if you are always going to look on the dark side, then don't fly. And be done with it. But please don't go trying to scare everyone else into going along with your personal paranoia.

You shouldn't get into a car either. The chances of your being injured or killed on the road are significantly higher than in the air.

[Carolina]

Look at the stats - the numbers don't lie. Flying is one of the safer modes of transportation, and certainly better than getting on the highway.

We aren't going to convince you, but a decent counselor could do a world of good. Or, simply don't fly!

[frostie]

Never had problem with flying !

However, I really like that strange feeling that somebody gets when the plane actually takes off

[Mosco]

Valium + 2 glasses of red wine. Works every time!

[pz93c]

I don't know the answer.

I tried to sleep on flights.

That was before all of the heightened security... now I don't want to go through the hassle.

[AIKO]

Originally Posted by Mosco

Valium + 2 glasses of red wine. Works every time!

Have to go to Tampa tomorrow and I will follow your path-xanax without the wine.